Xbox patch info!

[Nike-it]

Guys, I sent a request to 505 Games about the current situation with the patch for Xbox version. I'll post the answer, as soon as get one. Before that please stop posting different rumours about it, let's get the official answer!

[SEE]

Hope you get a reply, unfortunately no one to date has. Keep my fingers crossed and hope you (1C) have better luck.

[stealth finger]

Thanks, hopefully you get a response.

[FOZ_1983]

Hope this thread fills up soon :D

even if it doesnt, thanks for trying anyway. Canr ask for anymore than that.

[Vulcan607]

Proof that we havent been abandoned.

[imnotgeoff]

hopefully you will get a reply,but i seriously doubt it

[twentyONE]

Nice.

I am sure we will get the update eventually but 505 does not need to be so shady about it. I bet we hear something soon because there is plenty of attention being brought to this through many different websites.

Of course I could be wrong and 505 could just say "F U!"

I am using the 'Ace Edge' sticks and I'm still loving this game, however the update would be nice.

[Reddisback]

if they dont reply to you IC then we're screwed for sure.....

[markyboyacebassist]

Fingers crossed!:grin:

[Buggins]

Can you also ask them why they deemed it necessary to silence Anton?

[AutomaticAddict]

:)Good Luck Nike!:-P

[Deascendent]

Um, Nike-It, sorry bud, but the truth is that 505 Games doesn't even exist, it's a shadow organization run by ex-KGB and Soviet political officers in a brash attempt to wage war on America in the only way left; PISSING OFF MICROSOFT AND IT'S USERS!!!!!!!! BWAHAHAHAHAHAH!

[haitch40]

Can you also ask them why they deemed it necessary to silence Anton?

thats another thing that 505 have done to p us off

[trk29]

Can you also ask them why they deemed it necessary to silence Anton?

I'm sure that is a answer we will never find out.

[Deascendent]

I'm sure that is a answer we will never find out.

Um, actually it's quite simple, Anton is in a contract, as with the other developers, and I'm pretty sure he could face legal action if he slanders, speaks on behalf for which he has no authority (remember updates/dlc is in the hands of the publishers) or defiles the company as he did in previous posts, (remember; "let's wait and blame publisher together"). Basically, 505 Games most likely threatened him.

[SEE]

I agree, 505 have issued a statement that implies that the development of a patch for the Xbox is currently being looked into. Unfortunately for 505, this is contradicted by Anton in his previous comms - a title update for both platfoms was made available for submissiom some time ago. A case of bolting the stable door after the horse has run?

[trk29]

Um, actually it's quite simple, Anton is in a contract, as with the other developers, and I'm pretty sure he could face legal action if he slanders, speaks on behalf for which he has no authority (remember updates/dlc is in the hands of the publishers) or defiles the company as he did in previous posts, (remember; "let's wait and blame publisher together"). Basically, 505 Games most likely threatened him.


I agree with you. I was just saying that 1C or Gaijin is not going to tell us exactly why.

[Riceball]

He was silenced because he was promising things his bosses could'nt, and would'nt deliver. Pretty simple.

[STINGERSIX78]

thats really sad. the communication between the devs and the community was really good.
its a shame...

[trk29]

Yes, I couldn't wait to log on here everyday just to see if Anton posted any more news before the game came out. Guess those days are long gone.

[stealth finger]

So i guess no replies then?

[IiI GUNNY IiI]

Um, Nike-It, sorry bud, but the truth is that 505 Games doesn't even exist, it's a shadow organization run by ex-KGB and Soviet political officers in a brash attempt to wage war on America in the only way left; PISSING OFF MICROSOFT AND IT'S USERS!!!!!!!! BWAHAHAHAHAHAH!

Yes thats it.I see the light.

[AutomaticAddict]

*cough* communists! *cough* ahem... excuse me.

[Panzergranate]

I think that you'll find that Microsoft reserves all rights to pissing off its users.

I've endured every version of Windows since 1.03...... by comparison the BOP problems are nothing really.

Windows = Microsoft.

Mac OS = Adobe.

Ever hear a Mac owner moaning about Mac OS or Adobe??

Me Neither....

[trk29]

I think that you'll find that Microsoft reserves all rights to pissing off its users.

I've endured every version of Windows since 1.03...... by comparison the BOP problems are nothing really.

Windows = Microsoft.

Mac OS = Adobe.

Ever hear a Mac owner moaning about Mac OS or Adobe??

Me Neither....

I love my MAC!! :-P

[PantherAttack2]

I love my PC! :-P

[irrelevant]

Mac FTW! :P

[FOZ_1983]

I love lamp

[Robotic Pope]

I love oranges

[Nike-it]

Guys, please stop offtop. Most likely I'll be able to post some official info on Monday.

[axhat]

Thank you Nike, I really do appreciate your efforts on this matter.

Cheers!

Ax

[David198502]

me too!

[markyboyacebassist]

I'm sure that goes for everyone!!:grin:

[Lexandro]

Any news you can post yet Nike?

[stealth finger]

what time is it in russia?

[markyboyacebassist]

what time is it in russia?

Moscow is 3 :-Phours ahead of the current time in London.

[Deascendent]

So basically it's 8:00 at night over there.... F***!!!!!!!

WHEN WILL THIS EVER END!!??

[Lexandro]

Its a pain yes, we really need some news.

[David198502]

yes this uncertainty is really annoying!

[imnotgeoff]

thought we were gona here something today?

[AutomaticAddict]

Me too...damn it!

[Deascendent]

Guys, please stop offtop. Most likely I'll be able to post some official info on Monday.

Now YOU have lost our respect, another one fallen to the den of lies that surrounds the xbox 360's freshmen release, BOP.

May the witch trials begin.

[trk29]

Now YOU have lost our respect, another one fallen to the den of lies that surrounds the xbox 360's freshmen release, BOP.

May the witch trials begin.

Most likely I'll be able to post some official info on Monday.

He didn't say that he would definitely post news. It's hard not to get your hopes up, this happens on every forum. Admin never hears from the source at the time your expecting it.

[FOZ_1983]

He didn't say that he would definitely post news. It's hard not to get your hopes up, this happens on every forum. Admin never hears from the source at the time your expecting it.

Thats very true and what you say is correct and can't be faulted.


BUT

Common decency says he could of at least posted to say he didnt hear anything. Will give him the benefit of the doubt for now though.

[Nike-it]

Guys, the release of the patch is still being discussed and the final decision unfortunately is not made yet. I'll keep you informed on the current situation. I really wish it will be confirmed very soon.
I know the news are not very positive, but still the patch is not cancelled.

[Lexandro]

Guys, the release of the patch is still being discussed and the final decision unfortunately is not made yet. I'll keep you informed on the current situation. I really wish it will be confirmed very soon.
I know the news are not very positive, but still the patch is not cancelled.

Well at the very least its news, even if its bad news. Thanks for the effort Nike.

[Phantom Works]

Thanks for your efforts Nike-it but I can't see what there is to discuss by 505Games. Its been 5 MONTHS since the games release. The game has a serious control issue for the xbox with the lack of wheel brake, the issue with the strike scoring system, the unrealistic unlocking conditions for many of the various load outs etc. lets be honest if it was getting released it would be here by now. As each day passes the chance of this patch seeing the light of day gets slimmer and slimmer.

These and many other things were fixed on another platform, 505 Games are a disgrace. This news for me is the final nail in the coffin for IL2. :evil:

[bobswar]

Cheers Nike-it, at least ONE of the main contributers to the game (apart from the players) can still give us some information about whats the go with this patch. ANY information is a good thing

[imnotgeoff]

thanx for the info.but what the hell are they "discussing"?are they trying to figure out YET more ways to piss us off

[trk29]

Guys, the release of the patch is still being discussed and the final decision unfortunately is not made yet. I'll keep you informed on the current situation. I really wish it will be confirmed very soon.
I know the news are not very positive, but still the patch is not cancelled.



Nike-it is there any way you could ask about dlc?

Thanks

[Nike-it]

Nike-it is there any way you could ask about dlc?

Thanks

I'll ask.

[markyboyacebassist]

Thanks for your efforts Nike-it but I can't see what there is to discuss by 505Games. Its been 5 MONTHS since the games release. The game has a serious control issue for the xbox with the lack of wheel brake, the issue with the strike scoring system, the unrealistic unlocking conditions for many of the various load outs etc. lets be honest if it was getting released it would be here by now. As each day passes the chance of this patch seeing the light of day gets slimmer and slimmer.

These and many other things were fixed on another platform, 505 Games are a disgrace. This news for me is the final nail in the coffin for IL2. :evil:

I totally agree with you matey!
As the PS3 version of this game has been corrected, if the XBOX 360 patch is not released I feel the game I paid good money for is not fit for purpose.
505 have admitted the game was incomplete by releasing the patch.
Discrimination against us XBOX 360 pilots should & will not be tolerated !!
Come the revolution we shall have our revenge!!:grin::grin::grin:

[AeroHeadTW]

As a former hardcore flight sim junkie, I know this audience is never going to be truly happy-- but a game with this much promise (the feel of firing as you close with a bogey looks almost like vintage gun cam film) really screams for a patch--even if it is minimal.

After years of sims and RC I can't use the regular controller setup and as I couldn't justify dulicating my PC throt and stick setup I bought an Aviator PS41 stick. It's decent enough stick-- but the game's programmed in deadzone makes the game virtually unplayable for anything past straffing bombers and ground tagets.

You really must patch the stick deadzone--anything else would be great-- but as originally released, the game in pretty much unplayable especially to the casual audience.

[Yakoff]

Yes, a fix for the AV8R dead-zone would be fantastic. I can actually tolerate most everything about the dead-zone except when I'm trying to trim the plane in Simulator mode. It's MADDENING. It appears there is no need to trim the plane in Realistic mode, but I prefer playing Sim.

[El_Luz]

It's really curious: I've left pretty girlfriends for less. I'm an addicted lovefool hoping for changes that will never come. And watching others have all the fun I should have...

Please can someone give me a slap in the face to wake up?

[markyboyacebassist]

It's really curious: I've left pretty girlfriends for less. I'm an addicted lovefool hoping for changes that will never come. And watching others have all the fun I should have...

Please can someone give me a slap in the face to wake up?

A kick in the gonads should suffice! :evil::evil::evil::evil:

[David198502]

whats dlc???

[TRC Subaru]

Nike-it,

Thank you very much for your help with this issue.

I understand in this world that money makes everything work faster and smoother.

I personally do not have a problem with paying a reasonable amount for a DLC/patch that will fix BoP and possibly give us a new plane, (I would like the P-40 anyway).

Please also suggest this idea to the management at 505.


PLEASE – DO NOT DEBATE THIS IDEA IN THIS THREAD.
(This is Nike-it’s thread to announce new information, not for debating issues)

I understand this is a highly volatile idea and if you do want to debate this please start another thread - Thank You.

[trk29]

whats dlc???

Downloadable Content

[David198502]

thank you!!!

[SEE]

I did say in an earlier thread that the issue of the Xbox patch may have to be fought with a 'stick' and a 'carott' strategy. I would support the patch in the form of a DLC.

However, if additional pressure is needed then I would suggest that the issue is elevated to a wider argument that affects all gamers and one that should be discussed within the industry.

MS and 505 use the statement 'committed to improving the game play experience for its customers'. Their mission statement so to speak!

Bearing in mind that MS grant the licence is it acceptable that MS take no further interest in the product (once it has satisfied the initial QA) or have any legal contract with the publisher?

505 have also used the same statement in their last reply. Yet, it is quite clear that this is not entirely accurate given their actions. It seems that this could happen at any time in the future and with any publisher. Neither MS or Sony (who grant the licenses) can prevent a publisher from showing preference to one console over another regarding title updates that improve gameplay. Should there be some form of licensing requirement that all publishers must legally abide by to prevent this happening again?

As a consumer group we have to trust the publisher. Unfortunately - trust alone is not enough!

I suggest that we move this argument to the industry through the media that represents it.

BOP is an excellent example of a title that MS claim they cannot interfere with as they are not the publisher. How is the consumer protected by this and is it right? How can MS justify the use of ' committed to improving the gameplay experience for its customers' then simply state that it cannot interfere with a publishers decision to improve 'quality of gameplay' for one console over another?

Use the argument and this experience to one that could affect all gamers and present it to the gaming media for their opinions.

[stealth finger]

MS cant do anything precisely because its already been through their QC and they qualified it as fit for release. All 3 companies have missed these issues. And unfortunatley ms cant force a patch unless a serious showstopper is found but in those cases theyd probably waive the fee. Even though the patch is done 505 would still have to pay an amount of money (your guess how much is as good as mine) which they obviously dont feel they want to pay.

They dont seem to realise if this title is properly supported consumers will have more confidence to buy their next product instead of feeling taken advantage off and will more dubious about the next one. The kicker is the devs get most of the blame from most people becuase they don't know about the publisher/developer/platform holder relationship.

[SEE]

.................

Even though the patch is done 505 would still have to pay an amount of money (your guess how much is as good as mine) which they obviously dont feel they want to pay.

Which questions their last reply and undermines their 'committment to improving game play experience'!

The fact is that many games rely on subsequent patches being released. Console manufacturers QA are therefore not infallible. Games are often rushed into production. I would argue that where a title has gameplay experience improved for one console and, there are no technical limitations that would prevent a similar one for other consoles, that part of any licence agreement is to ensure that a publisher commits its obligation to all consumers across all platforms. This is the fundamental issue that the industry needs to resolve otherwise it will happen again and again!

Gamers represent a multi-million dollar market with absolutely no rights when it comes to quality assurance.

[stealth finger]

I completely agree.

I can forgive the release sooner patch later ethos if they actually put the patches out, other wise its just skinflint and lazy.

[stealth finger]

So what's the chances of any news this week?

[CrazyOwl]

Can we do like a video talking about the companies that screw alot of people "meaning all this issue of the game" and post it in youtube and forums to see what happen. I ask of course about legal issues for posting something talking about companies and there reputation??.

I know youtube is free so is there no legal issue wy dont doit. I could do the video if you can send a good scrip about this.

dont know just a thought. pardon writting not my first one.

so anyways, what you guys say?

Crazyowl.

[Implosion]

very bad news from Anton on yuplay forum:
http://forum.yuplay.com/index.php?showtopic=1419

no update for xbox360

[imnotgeoff]

wtf!!!???they already said it was made

[TRC Subaru]

very bad news from Anton on yuplay forum:
http://forum.yuplay.com/index.php?showtopic=1419

no update for xbox360


I can not get into the yuplay forum right now, could you please cut and past what has been said?

Thank you.

[Houndstone Hawk]

I can not get into the yuplay forum right now, could you please cut and past what has been said?

Thank you.


** The post in question from Anton**

Hi guys.
Unfortunately, no good news.
Publisher thinks that it is not commercially reasonable to create, QA, and release title update for X360.
Releasing PS3 update has not significant impact to sells, and it costs much. DLC was also not very popular (not popular at all).
In addition, I was told to communicate with gamers only via publisher's PR department - that's why I am being quiet silent.

Nothing we can do here with X360 version itself - we've already funded PS3 update from our own pockets (and we do not even benefit from potential sells increase).

So, to make it sweeter we've done the only thing we could done - we'll provide huge (50%) discount on PC version Wings of Prey for consoles users. I know that's not the same (some of console audience even do not have PCs or not gaming PCs), but PC-version is the only published by us.
I'll provide way of getting discount soon (in a few hours), here.

----------------------------------------

**EDIT** For those of you with a capable PC, DO IT!!!!! You'll be picking up a bargain that's head & shoulders above BoP. (Fact I'm afraid)

[SEE]

Not suprised other than the Xbox patch was never actually done. Ah well, get a PS3, a new PC or just play as is! Hopefully there will be a sequel as Anton replied to my question on Yuplay without saying too much. At least we now know were we stand and about time too!

Unfortunately I don't have a PC of the required spec so the offer has little benefit to me whatever the price.

[imnotgeoff]

why aint that posted in here somewhere???also why say the patch was DONE?

[stealth finger]

that sucks, it really, really does.

Even though the patch may be 'done' it still cost mucho casho to get it through the chain and 505 say its not worth it. Oh well we can only hope a decent publisher does the next one

[imnotgeoff]

if there is one..so if pc users are gettin a discount on wings of prey,what do people who dont have one get

[PantherAttack2]

Even though the patch may be 'done' it still cost mucho casho to get it through the chain and 505 say its not worth it.

Actually that would be 'mucho dinero' or 'mucho efectivo'. ;)

[Robotic Pope]

Not suprised other than the Xbox patch was never actually done. Ah well, get a PS3, a new PC or just play as is! Hopefully there will be a sequel as Anton replied to my question on Yuplay without saying too much. At least we now know were we stand and about time too!

Unfortunately I don't have a PC of the required spec so the offer has little benefit to me whatever the price.

Well at least we can stop waiting for it now. I'm staying with my xbox Evangelus. And I might at some point get around to installing IL-2 1946 on desktop PC.

The patch certainly isn't worth the price of a PS3. And Wings of Prey isn't different enough for me to want to upgrade my current pc. What I will probably do is save up for a new pc, joystick and TrackIr for when Storm of War is released. SoW will be the main event.

[Houndstone Hawk]

Well at least we can stop waiting for it now. I'm staying with my xbox Evangelus. And I might at some point get around to installing IL-2 1946 on desktop PC.

The patch certainly isn't worth the price of a PS3. And Wings of Prey isn't different enough for me to want to upgrade my current pc. What I will probably do is save up for a new pc, joystick and TrackIr for when Storm of War is released. SoW will be the main event.

+1!!! Storm of War is going to be huge. It really will have been worth the mammoth wait for what screenies & stuff I've seen & read.

[The M00ps]

Well, all I can say is that I've purchased my last game that has anything with 505 on it, I can promise you that. I don't care if it has waffle eating zombies riding flying unicorns in it.

[Slomo]

Well, all I can say is that I've purchased my last game that has anything with 505 on it, I can promise you that. I don't care if it has waffle eating zombies riding flying unicorns in it.

+1

I have never really paid attention to publishers, etc on games but now I will.

[InfiniteStates]

I don't care if it has waffle eating zombies riding flying unicorns in it.
You know you'd be a little bit tempted if that was the next game though. There aren't enough games out there catering to that market...

[SEE]

I went on Xbox live purely for this title, No patch but I have met so many fantastic peeps all over Europe and the USA playing Xbox BOP and that more than makes up for the disappointment. Great bunch of guys and we all enjoy the game. No patch won't stop us playing I'm sure.

[stealth finger]

I went on Xbox live purely for this title, No patch but I have met so many fantastic peeps all over Europe and the USA playing Xbox BOP and that more than makes up for the disappointment. Great bunch of guys and we all enjoy the game. No patch won't stop us playing I'm sure.

I agree, its still a great game, just like ofp, not as great as it could've been.

[zg26]

** The post in question from Anton**

Hi guys.
Unfortunately, no good news.
Publisher thinks that it is not commercially reasonable to create, QA, and release title update for X360.
Releasing PS3 update has not significant impact to sells, and it costs much. DLC was also not very popular (not popular at all).
In addition, I was told to communicate with gamers only via publisher's PR department - that's why I am being quiet silent.

Nothing we can do here with X360 version itself - we've already funded PS3 update from our own pockets (and we do not even benefit from potential sells increase).


Think they're missing the point that selling a game thats incomplete/with bugs is not a good look. The patch was a chance to make that right and by not patching they're sullying the Il2 Brand. I don't believe its entirely the publishers fault as the game was released in an incomplete state (possibly due to pressure from the publisher).
And now we know for certain there will be NO german cockpits.

I won't say I'll never buy another Il2 game again because they've got us over a barrel as they're the only ones doing WW2 flight sims for console but I will think twice and certainly won't buy until I know for certain the Axis aircraft have cockpit views.

As for the DLC not selling - it was overpriced and it didn't have German cockpits! And I still bought it anyway!

[Houndstone Hawk]

Think they're missing the point that selling a game thats incomplete/with bugs is not a good look. The patch was a chance to make that right and by not patching they're sullying the Il2 Brand. I don't believe its entirely the publishers fault as the game was released in an incomplete state (possibly due to pressure from the publisher).
And now we know for certain there will be NO german cockpits.

I won't say I'll never buy another Il2 game again because they've got us over a barrel as they're the only ones doing WW2 flight sims for console but I will think twice and certainly won't buy until I know for certain the Axis aircraft have cockpit views.

As for the DLC not selling - it was overpriced and it didn't have German cockpits! And I still bought it anyway!

This half-baked console attempt is not IL-2. It has nothing to do with Oleg Maddox; it never did.

[zg26]

This half-baked console attempt is not IL-2. It has nothing to do with Oleg Maddox; it never did.

Well perception counts for alot and in this case its hard not to perceive that the Il-2 series and Il-2 BOP are indeed very closely related.
(1) They both share the moniker Il-2.
(2) IL-2 Sturmovik: Birds of Prey Famous title comes to consoles (from forum title).

[juz1]

ha why, five oh...?

[Houndstone Hawk]

Quote: "its hard not to perceive that the Il-2 series and Il-2 BOP are indeed very closely related."
Um, How????? Because they both feature the same a/c?



If you believe they're closely related, then you've very little experience of IL-2 on PC I'm guessing as you would know they're worlds apart. Different in approach, mentality, looks, feel, sound, intentions, the list is endless. One is full of realism, immersion & attention to detail & the other is an arcade 'shoot 'em up'. Why do you think they dropped the IL-2 Sturmovik namesake from the PC version?!

The forum title was always a good laugh imo.

Quote: "its hard not to perceive that the Il-2 series and Il-2 BOP are indeed very closely related."
Because they both feature the same a/c?

[PantherAttack2]

Quote: "its hard not to perceive that the Il-2 series and Il-2 BOP are indeed very closely related."
Um, How?????


Why don't you actually pay attention to what zg26 said? There's no point in saying "Um, How?????" when he just said how. Plus you automatically assume he has very little experience with the original IL-2 (and expansions), which really has nothing to do with what he posted. It seems he was pointing out things that the general public will draw conclusions with ("same IL-2 name, oh, it must be a new version or something"). My respect for you has reached a new low.

I'm making a guess here of course, but maybe it is you that has little experience with IL-2 BoP. On Sim mode, although not as realistic as IL-2 for PC, it is still more than an arcade "shoot 'em up". I don't see people in sim mode zooming around and shooting things down with a few bursts of fire and not even stalling or anything. Even realistic isn't that bad. And attention to detail... Have you even seen the scenery? It's way better than anything IL-2 1946 had or will have, ever. And there is plenty of immersion in IL-2 for PC, but it's kind of hard to feel like a World War II pilot with the 2d smoke trails the planes leave when damaged. Or the bad explosions. That said of course, graphics aren't everything but they still play an important role.


And yes, I have played the original IL-2. I own it and I play it often. It's a great game. Just because it is much much better than BoP doesn't mean BoP is some kind of Blazing Angels arcade game. Even on arcade mode it's better than that.

[Houndstone Hawk]

Why don't you actually pay attention to what zg26 said? There's no point in saying "Um, How?????" when he just said how. Plus you automatically assume he has very little experience with the original IL-2 (and expansions), which really has nothing to do with what he posted. It seems he was pointing out things that the general public will draw conclusions with ("same IL-2 name, oh, it must be a new version or something"). My respect for you has reached a new low.

I'm making a guess here of course, but maybe it is you that has little experience with IL-2 BoP. On Sim mode, although not as realistic as IL-2 for PC, it is still more than an arcade "shoot 'em up". I don't see people in sim mode zooming around and shooting things down with a few bursts of fire and not even stalling or anything. Even realistic isn't that bad. And attention to detail... Have you even seen the scenery? It's way better than anything IL-2 1946 had or will have, ever. And there is plenty of immersion in IL-2 for PC, but it's kind of hard to feel like a World War II pilot with the 2d smoke trails the planes leave when damaged. Or the bad explosions. That said of course, graphics aren't everything but they still play an important role.


And yes, I have played the original IL-2. I own it and I play it often. It's a great game. Just because it is much much better than BoP doesn't mean BoP is some kind of Blazing Angels arcade game. Even on arcade mode it's better than that.

What on earth are you on?
My question still remains. How is it that the comparison between the 2 can be made? It's obvious to make comparisons between BoP & Blazing Angels or SWON & compare IL-2 to BoB but comparing a game to a SIM just because it shares the same name for sales reasons is baffling when they're 2 completely different beasts.

You've made your 'respect' toward me quite known previously, on a personal level & through my videos & as you would most likely expect, I really am going to lose very little sleep over it. I will always hold my opinion that BoP is lightyears apart from IL-2 & comparisons cannot be made.

Why dont you stop being a 'P.C.' idiot & wake up. I'm not attacking the X360 BoP forum members at a low point. The way these guys have been treated is very frustating where the patch is concerned. I'm merely commenting, as I've always done; to BoP being (or not being) a close resemblance to IL-2 Sturmovik. My opinionated nature means I will air my view, regardless of what it will do to my 'respect' levels of Mr PantherAttack! If I have something to say, I will say it. I won't bend my views for popularity votes & your respect for me means as much to me as last night's dishwater. That said, I have alot of respect for many 'open minded' & interesting users of this forum. I thank my lucky stars that, ppl worrying about 2D smoke trails (that have since been MODDED like everything else in IL-2) don't include.

2D smoke btw? From a fan of a game where wheels don't turn & pilots eject THROUGH canopies or fly planes with wrong or even NO cockpits.

[PantherAttack2]

Well perception counts for alot and in this case its hard not to perceive that the Il-2 series and Il-2 BOP are indeed very closely related.
(1) They both share the moniker Il-2.
(2) IL-2 Sturmovik: Birds of Prey Famous title comes to consoles (from forum title).

To which you (Houndstone Hawk) replied:

Quote: "its hard not to perceive that the Il-2 series and Il-2 BOP are indeed very closely related."
Um, How?????


My point is he just gave you two valid points and yet you still asked him "how?". It's like saying:

"There are two reasons why this game sucks- it's not realistic and the graphics are bad."

and then someone says to him:

"How does it suck?"


And this is my personal preference of course, but one question mark is enough.
Notice how I never made any insults, too, in this post and my last. ;)
And what's this about your videos? As I recall I didn't even comment on them, if I did and I don't remember I don't think my post contains some sort of attack. And I really appreciate it, but the Mr. before my name is not necessary.

That said, I have alot of respect for many 'open minded' & interesting users of this forum.

As do I.

Edit: I do see how my previous post could be seen as offensive to Houndstone Hawk. I apologize, I was merely trying to get a point across which I think I have done so correctly in this post.

[Houndstone Hawk]

To which you (Houndstone Hawk) replied:

Quote: "its hard not to perceive that the Il-2 series and Il-2 BOP are indeed very closely related."
Um, How?????


My point is he just gave you two valid points and yet you still asked him "how?". It's like saying:

"There are two reasons why this game sucks- it's not realistic and the graphics are bad."

and then someone says to him:

"How does it suck?"


And this is my personal preference of course, but one question mark is enough.
Notice how I never made any insults, too, in this post and my last. ;)
And what's this about your videos? As I recall I didn't even comment on them, if I did and I don't remember I don't think my post contains some sort of attack. And I really appreciate it, but the Mr. before my name is not necessary.



As do I.

Edit: I do see how my previous post could be seen as offensive to Houndstone Hawk. I apologize, I was merely trying to get a point across which I think I have done so correctly in this post.



LOL, your PC (political correctness) skills are truly amazing. You're beginning to sound like a canvassing politician on the ropes, seeking pc popularity. :rolleyes:

[PantherAttack2]

LOL, your PC (political correctness) skills are truly amazing. You're beginning to sound like a canvassing politician on the ropes, seeking pc popularity. :rolleyes:

I don't see any point in arguing with you anymore, you can't seem to comprehend what I'm trying to say. All you do is make pointless insults when someone disagrees with what you think, even if their point is completely valid.

In the end, none of this really matters. You think what you want and I will think what I want. (obvious exaggeration) But nearly half your posts are about how IL-2 (the original PC version) is so much better than BoP and that BoP is just some sort of arcade game trash. You say you aren't attacking the members here, but I think you are every time you put down BoP, a game which -although obviously not as good as IL-2 1946 realistically- most of us have come to love, patch or not. But that's for everyone else to decide.

[Houndstone Hawk]

I don't see any point in arguing with you anymore, you can't seem to comprehend what I'm trying to say. All you do is make pointless insults when someone disagrees with what you think, even if their point is completely valid.

In the end, none of this really matters. You think what you want and I will think what I want. (obvious exaggeration) But nearly half your posts are about how IL-2 (the original PC version) is so much better than BoP and that BoP is just some sort of arcade game trash. You say you aren't attacking the members here, but I think you are every time you put down BoP, a game which -although obviously not as good as IL-2 1946 realistically- most of us have come to love, patch or not. But that's for everyone else to decide.


Ofcourse I can comprehend what you were referring to but my original question to that still stands:

**My quote**
My question still remains. How is it that the comparison between the 2 can be made? It's obvious to make comparisons between BoP & Blazing Angels or SWON & compare IL-2 to BoB or BoB2 but comparing a game to a SIM just because it shares the same name for sales reasons is baffling when they're 2 completely different beasts.

I don't believe my words are pointless or insulting other than labelling you as a pc idiot which I've always believed you to be.
Read back your last responce & it's more P.C. spill as is the majority of your posts aimed my way. Careful wordage speaking for the masses to win over that coveted popularity spot. It's also convenient forgetting your words re: myself sharing my vids, although like you say; it is totally pointless but to say I'm attacking good folk on this forum because I think their game is a joke is kinda belittling the peeps in question as I'm pretty sure these guys have minds of their own & aren't going to take personal damage over a shiny piece of plastic you 'chuck' into your 360 tray.
If I'm attacking anything (which I didn't directly believe I was, it was a question of comparison correction), then it's that round piece of plastic & not the poor ppl that have been let down by it.

[PantherAttack2]

Well, this 'argument' didn't start because of that question, but I agree with your point.

I already said however, you can think what you want. Go ahead and think I'm trying to win the hearts of forum members or whatever but to be honest I don't care. I only try to not be brought down to the level of stupid insults that you were at, although I admit your last post was an improvement. I'm not even speaking to the masses- I'm speaking to you. Don't you get that yet? What would the benefit be, anyways?


And as I said, all that other stuff is for everyone else to decide. If they are offended by your posts (as I was, but no longer am because I don't care anymore) then they agree with me. If they are not, then they don't agree with me. That's that.

Now I need to return to my life outside of the computer. ;)

Edit: Someone else please post and get this thread back on topic.

[Houndstone Hawk]

Edit: I do see how my previous post could be seen as offensive to Houndstone Hawk. I apologize, I was merely trying to get a point across which I think I have done so correctly in this post.


You don't speak to the masses? Speaking directly to me but in the third person then. Very clever.
Stupid insult. Do you even
know what that is I wonder.

Yep. Enough on the subject. Topic between us closed!

[PantherAttack2]

You don't speak to the masses? Speaking directly to me but in the third person then. Very clever. Yep. Enough on the subject. Topic between us closed!

One last comment- good eye, and your point does make sense but that's not my intention. As this is a public forum it's necessary, I think. Topic closed (unless of course you have a closing comment as I always do). Now if you'll all excuse me I'm going to play some IL-2 1946.

[Houndstone Hawk]

One last comment- good eye, and your point does make sense but that's not my intention. As this is a public forum it's necessary, I think. Topic closed (unless of course you have a closing comment as I always do). Now if you'll all excuse me I'm going to play some IL-2 1946.

well I'd love to also partake a bit of 1946 but gig duty calls, being the singer in punk covers band The Krays.

[stealth finger]

What on earth are you on?
My question still remains. How is it that the comparison between the 2 can be made? It's obvious to make comparisons between BoP & Blazing Angels or SWON & compare IL-2 to BoB but comparing a game to a SIM just because it shares the same name for sales reasons is baffling when they're 2 completely different beasts.



You answer your own question. They can be compared because they both start IL2-...

90% of people will know nothing about oleg maddox or even care, will see the il2 and whatever impression they have of the name. Regardless of who made what and how that opens them up for comparison. also that theyof the same genre and general style

Why is it people think you can only compare like for like. Anything can be compared to anything else.

[Houndstone Hawk]

You answer your own question. They can be compared because they both start IL2-...

90% of people will know nothing about oleg maddox or even care, will see the il2 and whatever impression they have of the name. Regardless of who made what and how that opens them up for comparison. also that theyof the same genre and general style

Why is it people think you can only compare like for like. Anything can be compared to anything else.

Bloody hell mate you're so off the mark it's not even worthy of a responce.

[stealth finger]

Bloody hell mate you're so off the mark it's not even worthy of a responce.

so what is the mark? You ask how you can compare IL2-'46 or other pc versions to IL2-Birds of Prey? Is that correct? If so my question is how can you not?

[Houndstone Hawk]

so what is the mark? You ask how you can compare IL2-'46 or other pc versions to IL2-Birds of Prey? Is that correct? If so my question is how can you not?

LISTEN! I'm making a remark to someone making the comparison & I challenge it. Now having to repeat myself to someone that believes 90% of ppl have no care for the work of Maddox & his team is completely pointless.

The name IL-2 Sturmovik was bolted onto this title to sell units. Chuck the Sturmovik namesake onto Blazing Angels 3 & you'd be jumping up & down for sure, but you'd then also be obliged to compare because they both start 'IL-2'

How can you NOT make & challenge comparisons to flight games, that's what 'ppl like me' believe anyway.

[stealth finger]

Yeah the 90% I pulled out of my ass meant to mean most gamers that arent into PC sims, and never said 'ppl'. Looks like it's a bit of a touchy subject so i'll step back. IL2 wasnt even my point. It's that you seemed to be saying they couldnt be compare for whatever reason which IMO is stupid.

[Houndstone Hawk]

Yeah the 90% I pulled out of my ass meant to mean most gamers that arent into PC sims, and never said 'ppl'. Looks like it's a bit of a touchy subject so i'll step back. IL2 wasnt even my point. It's that you seemed to be saying they couldnt be compare for whatever reason which IMO is stupid.

Well mate, I don't debate with ppl that 'pull facts & figures out of their ass'. Atleast PantherAttack puts across a point & openly knows what he's talking about.

And true: My point remains. They can't be compared; particularly now you're ass-talking figures tell me that most flightsim gamers don't even know of the pc title I speak of.

I think that's your view & not the view shared by many others!

I'm outta here, it's Sat night u know!

[PantherAttack2]

Oh, okay, since I 'know what I'm talking about' I'll talk.

What stealth finger is saying is that almost nobody knows who Oleg Maddox is (relative to the rest of the world) or even cares who he is. You can compare anything to anything. I can compare the pencil that's a few inches away from my keyboard to a bowling ball if I wanted to. Or a palm tree to a pine tree. Maybe television remote to a rock in the desert?

A lot of this conversation consists of generalizations and assumptions, but I guess that doesn't necessarily matter. All stealth finger is saying is that you can compare BoP to IL-2 1946.

[stealth finger]

What stealth finger is saying is that almost nobody knows who Oleg Maddox is (relative to the rest of the world) or even cares who he is. You can compare anything to anything. I can compare the pencil that's a few inches away from my keyboard to a bowling ball.

Exactly this. I never said people haven't heard of il2. They have but have no idea about the people who make it.

You can take the example from anywhere. Most gamers dont know about the differences between the original fallout games on pc and the new one on consoles. They where made by completely different companies in different ends of the spectrum genre and are rightly compared. Some can't stand the new style and consider it an insult to the fallout name, some cant stand the old style or never played it, some appreciate both and don'y know what all the fuss is about,

[PantherAttack2]

Most gamers dont know about the differences between the original fallout games on pc and the new one on consoles. They where made by completely different companies in different ends of the spectrum genre and are rightly compared. Some can't stand the new style and consider it an insult to the fallout name, some cant stand the old style or never played it, some appreciate both and don'y know what all the fuss is about,


That's a perfect example. I for one appreciate both, but that's another story. ;)

Fallout 3 and Fallout 2 are very different games. But they still have the same theme and general setting. The same applies for IL-2 1946 and IL-2 BoP. Both are aerial combat games set in Europe during World War II. Just like Fallout 2 and Fallout 3 are both role-playing-games set in a post-apocalyptic United States.

[winny]

To say that you can't compare 2 games that share the same name, forum and genre is wrong.

You can have different expectations across platfoms. Even then you'll still be able to make comparisons.



I won't dwell on my many disappointments in this title & will not compare it to its PC counterpart (although why I feel I shouldn't is perhaps strange as for one, it is a title that shares the esteemed name to an untouchable pc combat sim & so why shouldn't it be compared, & another; its pre-build up was to always maintain its realism & immersion that I personally believe, falls way short of even Over G Fighters).

This is mirrored a treat in IL-2 also. Wanna take off & land in PC IL-2; fine. Don't wanna bother but instead set up a quick training type battle in just a few clicks that gives you the choice of multiple wingmen, fellow bombers & such against a multitude of enemies in mixed aircraft, fine also. How about a more detailed tool to create an entire mission? ...go for it, it's all there & the best thing. You only ever needed around 4 or 5 keyboard inputs to create all of this. You telling me that todays consoles cannot harbour this ability to give a console gamer this option when say the original xbox proved otherwise with op flashpoint 1 & even Far Cry?

[juz1]

What do you mean *insert console version of sim game here* is anything like *insert PC version of sim game here*?

The console game is just a top down, pub coin op clone and the PC game is the second coming of Christ (who looks Russian, I swear!).

I'm not discussing this with people that generalise numerical data...

You all massively need to know I'm off to self-aggrandise with a Perry Como tribute Sciffle/Ragga 4 piece synth progressive-rock outfit, I'm on wagon wheels me!



Who needs screaming modern warfail teens when there's such wonderful pomposity to be had here :rolleyes:...

Now if you'll excuse me I'm going to pointlessly let you know I'm off to count the bloated,undigested sultanas in my daughters nappy....hey look, 5 this morning!

[PantherAttack2]

What do you mean *insert console version of sim game here* is anything like *insert PC version of sim game here*?

The console game is just a top down, pub coin op clone and the PC game is the second coming of Christ (who looks Russian, I swear!).

I'm not discussing this with people that generalise numerical data...

You all massively need to know I'm off to self-aggrandise with a Perry Como tribute Sciffle/Ragga 4 piece synth progressive-rock outfit, I'm on wagon wheels me!



Who needs screaming modern warfail teens when there's such wonderful pomposity to be had here :rolleyes:...

Now if you'll excuse me I'm going to pointlessly let you know I'm off to count the bloated,undigested sultanas in my daughters nappy....hey look, 5 this morning!

Are you drunk or something? I didn't understand any of that. Honestly.

[zg26]

My original point is that Il2 BOP has sullied the Il2 brand. I never directly compared the games. The reason I had such high hopes for BOP (and indeed bought it without even considering 'Heroes over Europe') was because of the reputation of the Il-2 series. Now because I feel I've been let down by BOP it reflects on the whole brand. They can't have it both ways and trade on their brand for sales (as in " Famous title comes to consoles") and then say oh no thats nothing to do with their brand when it turns out to be a turd.

Why do you think Cadbury have trademarked their color of purple for chocolate packaging? Why do Walt Disney suits scour the world looking for unlicensed images of mickey mouse in kids playgrounds?

[draux]

Whats with all the pompous PC gamers all of a sudden? You guys just here to pour salt in our wounds or what? The forum for the version that has turning wheels is just one down from this one. You might find more people that care there.

[imnotgeoff]

hopefully the door will hit you on the way out

[PantherAttack2]

hopefully the door will hit you on the way out

Not sure who you are directing that at.

[juz1]

my original point is that il2 bop has sullied the il2 brand. I never directly compared the games. The reason i had such high hopes for bop (and indeed bought it without even considering 'heroes over europe') was because of the reputation of the il-2 series. Now because i feel i've been let down by bop it reflects on the whole brand. They can't have it both ways and trade on their brand for sales (as in " famous title comes to consoles") and then say oh no thats nothing to do with their brand when it turns out to be a turd.

Why do you think cadbury have trademarked their color of purple for chocolate packaging? Why do walt disney suits scour the world looking for unlicensed images of mickey mouse in kids playgrounds?

qft!

[Houndstone Hawk]

What do you mean *insert console version of sim game here* is anything like *insert PC version of sim game here*?

The console game is just a top down, pub coin op clone and the PC game is the second coming of Christ (who looks Russian, I swear!).

I'm not discussing this with people that generalise numerical data...

You all massively need to know I'm off to self-aggrandise with a Perry Como tribute Sciffle/Ragga 4 piece synth progressive-rock outfit, I'm on wagon wheels me!



Who needs screaming modern warfail teens when there's such wonderful pomposity to be had here :rolleyes:...

Now if you'll excuse me I'm going to pointlessly let you know I'm off to count the bloated,undigested sultanas in my daughters nappy....hey look, 5 this morning!

LOL. I know that was aimed at me & I believe ppl here have me wrong with this so-called pompous attitude toward PC games but when an attack is that well written & so funny, I can't do nothing other than praise you for your original wordage, That did nake me laugh. :grin:

[Houndstone Hawk]

Not sure who you are directing that at.

Originally Posted by imnotgeoff
hopefully the door will hit you on the way out



Was aimed at me.

[PantherAttack2]

Originally Posted by imnotgeoff
hopefully the door will hit you on the way out



Was aimed at me.

Well from what I know you have no intentions of leaving, so I guess that's not going to happen.

[Robotic Pope]

My original point is that Il2 BOP has sullied the Il2 brand. I never directly compared the games. The reason I had such high hopes for BOP (and indeed bought it without even considering 'Heroes over Europe') was because of the reputation of the Il-2 series. Now because I feel I've been let down by BOP it reflects on the whole brand. They can't have it both ways and trade on their brand for sales (as in " Famous title comes to consoles") and then say oh no thats nothing to do with their brand when it turns out to be a turd.

Why do you think Cadbury have trademarked their color of purple for chocolate packaging? Why do Walt Disney suits scour the world looking for unlicensed images of mickey mouse in kids playgrounds?

I think you are forgeting that it is the Publisher 505 games that has caused this by not allowing the devs to continue to work on improving the game. BoP is a solid game that could have been added to and improved ten fold if the devs were given the green light. Sadly on console every update costs money and 505 are cheap arses. As Houndstone has shown us in videos the PC version of BoP is being updated and improved very regularly to become an exellent game just like the original IL-2 on PC. This proves BoP is not a "turd" and did not sully the brand, 505 did that by themselves.

Can you imagine how bad the original IL-2 Stumovik on PC would have looked if it was never once updated from the original code? And the brand certainly wouldn't have become what it is today.

Now its silly to say Il-2 1946 and BoP can't be compared because you can compare anything you lke together. Let me compare the two quickly how I see it.

1946 - A far more technical experierence and a lot more in depth, a true simulator for enthusiasts that has been constantly worked on and improved by many, many dedicated people.

BoP/WoP - A more bare bones title but still one that is very enjoyable for most people thanks to different skill modes. disposes of more technical things like engine management in favour of a more cinematic aproch than 1946 and has excelent graphics being a much newer game. Like any new game BoP had bugs, these unfortunatly were unable to be fixed. But with continued support WoP on PC has fixed this and also has the posibilty of adding to this some aspects of 1946 if that is what people want or more of the same.


SoW - What the hell i'm comparing this too seeing my bringing it up started all this ;) SoW at first will be like a brand new version of the original IL-2 which means it will be nothing like as big as 1946. But the basic bones of the Sim will be made of pure gold which will last for many years, over which time the game will flesh out and grow and grow untill it is a massive golden giant of epicness :cool:

[Robotic Pope]

I went on Xbox live purely for this title, No patch but I have met so many fantastic peeps all over Europe and the USA playing Xbox BOP and that more than makes up for the disappointment. Great bunch of guys and we all enjoy the game. No patch won't stop us playing I'm sure.

So True! I am great :-P

lol seriously though you are right. Ive never played another game on xbox live where almost everyone you meet is a nice person like on BoP. Its a pleasure to fly with you guys :)

[Houndstone Hawk]

Well from what I know you have no intentions of leaving, so I guess that's not going to happen.

Hey listen. If my opinions offend you so much then I'm sorry for you. I've only been staying around here to share my video work with you all but other than some mighty fine comments from some very nice forum users here, I've had nothing but snubbery & even jibes just because they don't portray your BIRDS of prey (& yes I do also post them to the 1c IL-2 site aswell as the WoP site.

Want me & opinions elsewhere? No problems. I'll take the vids down too for you.

Wanting virtual doors to hit me on the way out? Not nice atall really but there you go. Only makes the person in question sound like a bit of a jerk off.

[draux]

Hey listen. If my opinions offend you so much then I'm sorry for you. I've only been staying around here to share my video work with you all but other than some mighty fine comments from some very nice forum users here, I've had nothing but snubbery & even jibes just because they don't portray your BIRDS of prey (& yes I do also post them to the 1c IL-2 site aswell as the WoP site.

Want me & opinions elsewhere? No problems. I'll take the vids down too for you.

Wanting virtual doors to hit me on the way out? Not nice atall really but there you go. Only makes the person in question sound like a bit of a jerk off.

Its not that you're offending anyone so much as we don't appreciate the holier than thou attitude. We are all already aware that BoP has some glaring problems, but the majority of the people still hanging around have decided that the game is worth our time, patch or no patch. At this point, trying to convince us otherwise is futile.

[juz1]

LOL. I know that was aimed at me & I believe ppl here have me wrong with this so-called pompous attitude toward PC games but when an attack is that well written & so funny, I can't do nothing other than praise you for your original wordage, That did nake me laugh. :grin:

Mr Hawk,
I salute your genorisity sir. If I ever manage to sneak the expenditure of a combat-flightsim capable pc past the wife I would dearly like to see a decent "flight simmer" in action such as yourself, as I have much to learn. Until then I ,and many others ,are stuck on the il-poo version.
I do understand some of the percieved vehemence of your posts was merely a product of your entusiasm for the genre, and any negativity creeping into this thread is largely a product of our collective disappointment in a less than satisfactory transition of a series that ,on PC, demonstrated a work of love and realised the combatsim dreams of many.

With cap tipped to you sir,
Justin

[condorz38]

** The post in question from Anton**

Hi guys.
Unfortunately, no good news.
Publisher thinks that it is not commercially reasonable to create, QA, and release title update for X360.
Releasing PS3 update has not significant impact to sells, and it costs much. DLC was also not very popular (not popular at all).
In addition, I was told to communicate with gamers only via publisher's PR department - that's why I am being quiet silent.

Nothing we can do here with X360 version itself - we've already funded PS3 update from our own pockets (and we do not even benefit from potential sells increase).

So, to make it sweeter we've done the only thing we could done - we'll provide huge (50%) discount on PC version Wings of Prey for consoles users. I know that's not the same (some of console audience even do not have PCs or not gaming PCs), but PC-version is the only published by us.
I'll provide way of getting discount soon (in a few hours), here.

----------------------------------------

**EDIT** For those of you with a capable PC, DO IT!!!!! You'll be picking up a bargain that's head & shoulders above BoP. (Fact I'm afraid)

Thank you for trying, but I really do not want to go to PC since it would require uprgrading or replacing my computer and I do not know if my flight stick would work with a pc or not. Offer a sequel or DLC and I will buy it.

[trk29]

Thank you very much for saying we screwed you, but we have a great deal available. You could not get the first game right (because not one plane performs as it should) and now you have the unmitigated gall to say we have a better game on computer for half price. I might, just might buy a sequel since I like this game, but as for the rest of your offer I got to that famous American saying "You Can Kiss My"

No matter what your feelings are that language will not be tolerated. Theres no reason for me to try to convince you that they tried their best with the console version.

[haitch40]

Thank you very much for saying we screwed you, but we have a great deal available. You could not get the first game right (because not one plane performs as it should) and now you have the unmitigated gall to say we have a better game on computer for half price. I might, just might buy a sequel since I like this game, but as for the rest of your offer I got to that famous American saying "You Can Kiss My"

right
1. the console version isnt bad it just could be better
2. its the publishers who ripped us off not anton and the devs

[SEE]

The PC is the better platform for Flight Sims but the question is which is the more convenient for gaming and more suited to on-line play - consoles or PC's? For me its a console but I also accept that a console version will never fully equate to the PC version - something close is all I ask for! There was an opportunity to make BOP as good as it can get for consoles but sadly they missed it!

[SEE]

A lot more response from Anton concerning console sequel, reasons for updating PS3 only, PS3 v Xbox sales, etc.....worth reading on the Yu-play forum...........

[TRC Subaru]

A lot more response from Anton concerning console sequel, reasons for updating PS3 only, PS3 v Xbox sales, etc.....worth reading on the Yu-play forum...........

Thanks for the update Evangels, could you (or someone) please cut and past the info you mention here? I can't get to the site right now.

Thanks!

[SEE]

Antoms answers are in blue..................names of people asking the questions not shown (in Italics).

hey anton just a quick question,what's your honest opinion about flight sims being on consoles?do you think that the market is there to sustain a continual community with DLC and other things,i ask because BOP is really the only one trying to do the full sim thing,the blazing angels games dont count an neither does heroe over europe.Or do you think that with all the problems regarding the bop patch for 360 and the fact sims are niche titles,that there is a future for them?


I think, they will be one or two more shots in this generation. Probably, from us :)
But I don't think DLC thing is going to work. Yes, DLC that was released by 505 was pverpriced, but there is no any other flightsim game on the market and 5% DLC buy rate would be reasonable - but it never reachs this rate.

there had to have been more sales for the 360


1. PS3 vesion outsells X360 version.
2. MS charges for update itself, Sony charges only for traffic.
3. PS3 could have been improved more (support of some PC USB flight-sticks, for example, is impossible).

So, for less money publisher made better update for more people. That was reasonable.
However, sells haven't been improved, nor for the game itself, neither for DLC.

I am not excusing anyone, I am just explaining. As for me, it would be very reasonable to make update for X360 version as well, while the game is still selling.
But I am not the decision maker here.

am i right in saying that now bop development is dead and i need to pin my hopes on you guys making a sequal??


We are very willing to make sequel (and are doing some development already, incorporating new features to Wings of Prey).
We hope, we'll sign deal with some publisher (developers can't release X360 game themselves, without publisher, even on XB Live) - the Birds of Prey was successful, probably not the best title of all times, but meets expectations.
We do not have publishing deal signed yet.


I gather from the above that the Xbox patch was never developed and that the sales of the patched PS3 version failed to improve (less than 5% sales for the DLC).

The PS3 was technically better in that it supported PC joysticks and the cost of releasing the patch for the PS3 was far cheaper than for MS Xbox due to differences between Sony and Microsoft regarding the costs of updates.

[TRC Subaru]

Anton - "We are very willing to make sequel (and are doing some development already, incorporating new features to Wings of Prey).
We hope, we'll sign deal with some publisher"

Hopeful news...thanks Evangels

[twentyONE]

Well I am glad to hear this! Sounds like they are working on a console sequal (maybe 'Wings of Prey'??) and that they obviously will be going with a different publisher but have not chosen one yet. I am also glad to hear that 'BoP' has sold enough to justify a sequal.

Something has to be done about the availability and ease for buying great flightsticks for the XBOX 360.
I think Microsoft should just third party 'HORI' to produce more "Ace Edge" flightsticks and make them available at either Wal-Mart or Best Buy.... or Microsoft needs to open the market for compatable flightsticks for the 360.

Well, The devs did a great job on this game and I wish them continued success. It is too bad that 505 had to screw up the update and their relationship with the devs and the gaming community. HOWEVER this is still a GREAT game that is really fun! I am hopeful for the sequal and I wish that everything goes better for the devs this time around.

Thanks again 1C and Gaijan for your hard work and making such a great game!

[SEE]

The worrying thing is that any sequel may be a PS3 exclusive given the costs of updating and the better platform....anyone want to buy a an Xbox! :grin:

[TRC Subaru]

The worrying thing is that any sequel may be a PS3 exclusive given the costs of updating and the better platform....anyone want to buy a an Xbox! :grin:

Don't sell that XBOX just yet....

Anton - "We are very willing to make sequel (and are doing some development already, incorporating new features to Wings of Prey).
We hope, we'll sign deal with some publisher (developers can't release X360 game themselves, without publisher, even on XB Live) - the Birds of Prey was successful, probably not the best title of all times, but meets expectations.
We do not have publishing deal signed yet."


I believe the Devs will make the XBOX version also, makes sense, if your doing one, might as well do them both, it means more $$$ overall.

[Yossarian]

I never bought the DLC because charging 800msp for DLC that is not DLC at all but content already on the disc is rip off pure and simple.

I'm glad only 5% of people bought it, that restores my faith in humanity.

If they do publish a sequel I have to admit I might pass if 505 games publish. I understand they are a small publisher and MS charges for updates, but the utter lack of any post launch support other than to attempt to sell content on media the user has already bought does not cut it for me.

The game itself was not bad, but MP was gimped by an atrocious damage/kill scoring system and impossible unlocks. They should have fixed that at least, it killed the online community in 2 weeks.

Lets hope a better publisher picks up the sequel, but there is no excuse if the devs don't test MP next time or make pathetically stupid unlock goals. If they do make one I'll wait for user reviews next time, no pre-order from me.

[stealth finger]

I never bought the DLC because charging 800msp for DLC that is not DLC at all but content already on the disc is rip off pure and simple.

I'm glad only 5% of people bought it, that restores my faith in humanity.




I got it when it was 400msp I thought that was a reasonable price point, probably wouldn'tve for 800msp

[twentyONE]

The worrying thing is that any sequel may be a PS3 exclusive given the costs of updating and the better platform....anyone want to buy a an Xbox! :grin:

That's a good point but .....

Don't sell that XBOX just yet....

Anton - "We are very willing to make sequel (and are doing some development already, incorporating new features to Wings of Prey).
We hope, we'll sign deal with some publisher (developers can't release X360 game themselves, without publisher, even on XB Live) - the Birds of Prey was successful, probably not the best title of all times, but meets expectations.
We do not have publishing deal signed yet."


I believe the Devs will make the XBOX version also, makes sense, if your doing one, might as well do them both, it means more $$$ overall.

...I am optimistic that this is what will happen. But like I mentioned earlier, the flightstick situation needs to be resolved meaning that the "Ace Edge" sticks need to be re-released or Microsoft needs to make a patch or adapter that allows the 360 to work with PC/PS3 flightsticks.

[markyboyacebassist]

That's a good point but .....



...I am optimistic that this is what will happen. But like I mentioned earlier, the flightstick situation needs to be resolved meaning that the "Ace Edge" sticks need to be re-released or Microsoft needs to make a patch or adapter that allows the 360 to work with PC/PS3 flightsticks.

The "Ace Edge" flight-stick is manufactured by Hori ,Is available in black(see my earlier post) & works perfectly with BOP. (apart from brakes!)
:grin:

[fritzwendel]

If your going to do a sequel, do us all a favor and play some of the Current top of the heap Multi player games.

Heroes of the Pacific for PS2 had a better lobby system than BoP.

We want in depth stat tracking, completion updates in real time(ala Gears 2 and ODST), and bragging rewards(skins, emblems for the plane, paint schemes, etc.) to name a few.

Also, a better hosting system that auto merges lobbies and migrates hosts, all things you expect from video games in the 2010.

I would much rather get a patch for the 60 bucks I already spent, though.
Needless to say, I won't be buying any video game published by 505 ever again.

:evil:

[bobswar]

only cost you $60?? It cost me $140 pre-ordered. Plus there is no flight sticks available in NZ, & it was gona cost at the LEAST $140 to get one sent over from OZ. so im real gutted that theyve washed their hands of this game.

Any more DLC gona be available??
Any idea on how long a sequel would take? 1 year, 2 years?

[fritzwendel]

only cost you $60?? It cost me $140 pre-ordered. Plus there is no flight sticks available in NZ, & it was gona cost at the LEAST $140 to get one sent over from OZ. so im real gutted that theyve washed their hands of this game.

Any more DLC gona be available??
Any idea on how long a sequel would take? 1 year, 2 years?

The full game is out: it's called "wings if prey" for the PC.

Judging from the response of Anton, no DLC. I guess if your game isn't Ace Combat or Tom Clancy related, then no DLC for you.
:-x

[jimn10]

Dear All

505 are releasing a submarine warfare simulator (WWII) so have e-mailed them asking how can I be sure they will support it after not supporting BOP. Suggest you might wish to do the same and keep the pressure on.

Regards

Jimn10

[BRIGGBOY]

cool that sounds interesting. let the hunt for red october begin.

[gbtstr]

Dear All

505 are releasing a submarine warfare simulator (WWII) so have e-mailed them asking how can I be sure they will support it after not supporting BOP. Suggest you might wish to do the same and keep the pressure on.

Regards

Jimn10

Is this for the consoles or PC? If consoles, it'll be interesting to see how they make it work. If PC, we already have Silent Hunter, why would we need their crappy version of sub warfare?

[jimn10]

It's on the 360

Regards

Jimn10

[SEE]

I had the original Silent Hunter PC version and it bored the pants of me after a short while......so 505 are publishing it? Hmm....bad mix here...........Torpedo's and no patch for the holes in the game = Another 505 Title Sunk! ...not on my shopping list for sure....:grin:

[BRIGGBOY]

was it that bad

[SEE]

It was ok but repetitive.....raise periscope, spot ship, fire torps....ship sinks with endless sailing and navigating across maps. Not a lot of strategy but games have moved on since then so it may be ok. IIRC, a second updated version was released but I didn't buy it! Best to wait for the demo....and wether it needs patching............

[BRIGGBOY]

thats a good idea

[gbtstr]

I had the original Silent Hunter PC version and it bored the pants of me after a short while......

They're up to SH5 now - it runs like crap on my computer, but 4 runs ok and I just picked up a used copy of 3 which runs very nicely. Right now, I'm mostly playing a modded version of SH3.

I'll admit there is a lot of down time - just sailing around. Of course, that's not too far off. Lots of time was spent at sea just getting from A to B or patrolling and waiting for something to cross your path. Fortunately, there's time compression so it doesn't take too long.

What settings did you play it on? I used to truck around with most of the helps on, which made hitting targets pretty easy, but less rewarding. Now, I've been playing with manual targeting on - which means figuring out the firing solution myself - target speed, AOB, range and bearing. It's a lot more challenging. Very frustrating at first, until you learn the finer points of how your equipment works and how to find all that missing information. It took me a few patrols before a good percentage of my torpedoes started finding their marks. Now, if I can keep stealthy, I can usually set up a high percentage shot and hit a spot on the target within about 20 meters. So far, I've been playing it safe and hunting where I'm bound to find single, unescorted ships - building my skill before I go take on a convoy with escort. Then, there will be the fun/challenge of sneaking past a destroyer screen, or if spotted, evading them before they put you on the bottom.

[Yossarian]

Meh, that sub game looks like pure arcade rubbish. Type VII subs with US markings and torps that float on the surface. I'll stick with Silent Hunter 3 GWX on my PC.

Plus

I WOULD NEVER BUY ANOTHER 505 GAMES PRODUCT, BECAUSE THEY REFUSED TO PATCH THE BROKEN MULTIPLAYER IN THIS GAME.

[The M00ps]

I WOULD NEVER BUY ANOTHER 505 GAMES PRODUCT, BECAUSE THEY REFUSED TO PATCH THE BROKEN MULTIPLAYER IN THIS GAME.

+1, and I'll never get tired of saying so. Plus I'll tell anyone that will listen.

[markyboyacebassist]

+1, and i'll never get tired of saying so. Plus i'll tell anyone that will listen.


ditto!

[FOZ_1983]

When your a small publishing company such as 505, then every sale really does count.

I for one will be doing the same as many of you and not buying anything they throw out, good or not. Purely because i fear they wouldnt patch isuues and screw over the community.

So with so many people turning it down, it could affect them deeply.

I'll be giving this game a miss.

[Robotic Pope]

When your a small publishing company such as 505, then every sale really does count.

I for one will be doing the same as many of you and not buying anything they throw out, good or not. Purely because i fear they wouldnt patch isuues and screw over the community.

So with so many people turning it down, it could affect them deeply.

I'll be giving this game a miss.

I'm not sure that is true. If games like this fail to sell it doesn't hurt 505 nearly as much as it does the small DEVELOPERS that make these type of niche games, and in turn us, the people that want to play sim games. 505 will just ignore the next could be great sim, and just publish more junk like doll games instead.

I instead suggest that if you are intrested in a game but see it is a 505 published game, play the demo or rent it before you buy, wait a month or two after launch and read forums to make sure its not completly full of bugs. If you do like it then decide wether to wait till you see it at a bargin price or not, taking into acount that it probably wont be supported by 505 with updates and dlc (just like on a PS2).

[iannik]

+1, and I'll never get tired of saying so. Plus I'll tell anyone that will listen.
I agree, I'll never buy a 505 or oleg game anymore. They released a bugged and unfinished game

[PantherAttack2]

I agree, I'll never buy a 505 or oleg game anymore. They released a bugged and unfinished game

I'm not sure about never buying an Oleg game... 505 is the problem, not Oleg.

[fritzwendel]

Don't buy their games new. Buy them used. That way, they get nothing for the sale, other than the initial buy.

I saw that A submarine game is coming from them, and needless to say, I'll be waiting till after its been out awhile.

[iannik]

I'm not sure about never buying an Oleg game... 505 is the problem, not Oleg.

the game was produced from oleg or not? WHY release a bugged game or unfinished?
I don't agree the problems are both: 505 and oleg, and I repeat this was my last game from them

[PantherAttack2]

the game was produced from oleg or not? WHY release a bugged game or unfinished?
I don't agree the problems are both: 505 and oleg, and I repeat this was my last game from them

Oleg didn't actually participate in the development of the game, correct? So why blame Oleg? Or am I missing something?

As I recall Birds of Prey has no relation to the PC series IL-2 Sturmovik other than the name (IL-2 Sturmovik: Birds of Prey).

[iannik]

looks strange, I thought we were posting on oleg forum.

[PantherAttack2]

looks strange, I thought we were posting on oleg forum.

So??? 1C Company did not develop this game. That said, neither did 505, but 505 was the main publisher of the game. From what I remember, 1C Company had to do with shipping and distribution.