BETA PATCH v.1.08.18956 - August 3, 2012

[Freycinet]

Originally Posted by Baron

imo though, this CEM everyone is raving about is all but the same as IL2, it`s just made more complicated to use by forcing one to click this god da* cockpit dials and nobs when one needs to focus in more important things.

...ie.e the whole reason for having CEM, namely to emulate the actual conditions for fighter pilots in WWII.

[_YoYo_]

Does communications with wingmen work or not (combat attack for enemy plane: fighters, bombers, ect.) with this beta ?

[Continu0]

Not for me. But it did last patch, right?

[Winger]

Originally Posted by camber

Hmm, you are describing the fight reds are always complaining about! Let me try to explain it from a red perspective, as I've had plenty of them

I was fighting a 109 who started with slight advantage. Every time I turned into him he pulled up into a long zoom climb into the stall. If I pulled my nose anywhere near him, I stalled within a couple of seconds. I couldn't increase rpms above 2700rpm or use overboost because my engine would just blow a minute later. All I could do is pull a tight break and try to keep track of him, so I could break again at the right time. Every zoom got him more advantage and I never had even a chance of taking a shot.

Lucky he kept missing each time with the cannon and I just copped a few MG rounds. I just hoped I could keep this going until another Spit arrived. One appeared co-alt with him, so he turned away and disengaged and we didn't see him again as it we can't catch him at any alt.

I certainly don't begrudge you these useful tactics. I guess this match -up would be fine if it was historically correct for performance, but that doesn't seem to be the case. Of course demanding historically correct planes to have historically incorrect fights (1v1) is a bit funny anyway.

I just hope you weren't one of the 109 drivers lecturing me when I used the same tactics in the old Spit IIa Once I got a right earbashing in chat from Mk Mr X for dishonorably flying the IIa and ruining his technique, it was hilarious.

camber

See? Thats what i am saying. WHY THE HELL should this fight not have been correct? I mean he started with higher energylevel. So if he does his job right its nothing but fine that you cant reach him. The other way around with a spit starting at higher energylevel the 109 would have been smoked in seconds if he didnt run. You reds already have your advantage: maneuverability. Broken down we have a turn and burner and a BnZ-Type plane here. And thats OK. I mean if you prefer BnZ then just get into a 109... Btw. the Spit this is FAAAAR better turning than the 109. And what you abviously want is a spit that performa better than the 109 so you can negate his energyadvantage just by a better engine. And thats plain wrong.

Winger

[Stirwenn]

Best way to understand what we mean Winger is to have a try in SpitIIa and discover yourself all advantages you describe. I'd be please to be your wingman.

[jf1981]

Originally Posted by Winger

Btw. the Spit this is FAAAAR better turning than the 109. And what you abviously want is a spit that performa better than the 109 so you can negate his energyadvantage just by a better engine. And thats plain wrong.

Winger

We all want accurate flight model. Both types were a match except spit had lower radius turn, its wing load is lower so that's normal.
There's no point arguing the sim shall have balanced forces, they have to be accurate to history and we have to do the rest.

So 109 would substantially loose the advantage on climb and dive speed but they can do negative G and dive steeply which Spit cannot follow without a half roll first.

That's how it has to be until better german side aircrafts are available. The 109F was not matched because it had very much improved aerydynamic.

Any other discuss has no point, IL-2 has always been a sim and hence need to be realistic. Only FM are wrong currently, and I'm not sure either about the 109 characteristics.

[Baron]

Originally Posted by Freycinet

...ie.e the whole reason for having CEM, namely to emulate the actual conditions for fighter pilots in WWII.

CEM is one thing, what one have to do to use it is another. Having to use a mouse cursor with your right while flying with your left is in no way, shape or form realistic.

Im saying this cuz i have still no idea if we are suppose to be able to assign keys to all the vital functions, like rad control, pp etc. It doesnt work for me and if anyone knows if it does indeed work im arguing for no apparent reason.

[robtek]

I have no problems to use keys for rads and proppitch.

[Osprey]

Winger seems to think that unless he wins every single fight on co-e then the flight model must be porked. His loss.

[CaptainDoggles]

Originally Posted by camber

Hmm, you are describing the fight reds are always complaining about! Let me try to explain it from a red perspective, as I've had plenty of them

I was fighting a 109 who started with slight advantage. Every time I turned into him he pulled up into a long zoom climb into the stall. If I pulled my nose anywhere near him, I stalled within a couple of seconds. I couldn't increase rpms above 2700rpm or use overboost because my engine would just blow a minute later. All I could do is pull a tight break and try to keep track of him, so I could break again at the right time. Every zoom got him more advantage and I never had even a chance of taking a shot.

Lucky he kept missing each time with the cannon and I just copped a few MG rounds. I just hoped I could keep this going until another Spit arrived. One appeared co-alt with him, so he turned away and disengaged and we didn't see him again as it we can't catch him at any alt.

I certainly don't begrudge you these useful tactics. I guess this match -up would be fine if it was historically correct for performance, but that doesn't seem to be the case. Of course demanding historically correct planes to have historically incorrect fights (1v1) is a bit funny anyway.

I just hope you weren't one of the 109 drivers lecturing me when I used the same tactics in the old Spit IIa Once I got a right earbashing in chat from Mk Mr X for dishonorably flying the IIa and ruining his technique, it was hilarious.

camber

Hmmm, your example is a fight where you started at a disadvantage and didn't get shot down but couldn't kill the other guy.

That's a really bad example if you're trying to illustrate how bad it is for RAF pilots.