To All You COOP LOVERS!!!

[ATAG_Doc]

Originally Posted by Thee_oddball

once COOP starts mission is locked.

p.s it can be player VS player VS AI

Man I don't know if I like that idea. But I understand how squads would like it and desire it. I totally can see that. But we can only be as real as what it is.

I tend to do work from home sometimes and I literally have to make time for this and I do. I'd be very turned off if I opened a beer and settled my butt into my chair and tried to get in some airtime only to find out the server is locked.

But this is where I part ways with the whole idea of coops. I'm not against the game having it. I just want to be able to sleep late and join up when I am ready and not when others are. I'm kinda lazy.

[JG53_Valantine]

Doc,

The main thing for Co-ops is taht it sets everything up and starts everyone at the same time: not great for ATAG as ATAG is a dogfight server: even if it has missions / objectives and teamwork it is still an old IL2 styled Dogfight server game-mode wise. (admittedly with AI spawns etc. although modded IL2 46 had this with the Moving Dogfight Server stuff)

Co-Ops on the other hand are missions where X number of pilots join the mission at the same time: select their aircraft, loadouts and read the breifing before the host then hits "start" everyone is started where they aircraft they selected was palced: be it in the air or on the ground. This is a CO-OP server and can be either human vs human or human vs AI or a mixture of both on each side. They are extremely useful for Co-Op squads and were a very popular part of the old IL2 mix that is sorely lacking in CloD. Both Dogfight servers and Co-op servers have their advantages and disadvantages, however to not have that option is really a reversal of many years of progress in lots of people's eyes.

Sometimes you WANT everyone to be in the mission and "starting" at the same time, exactly where you placed their aircraft: these tend to be pre-organised things either on a squad level, online war level or even just a historical scenario (Take the 633 mossie mission that ran on hyperlobby frequently: NOW THAT was great fun and a fully co-operative experience that simply wouldn't work on the dogfight map) - Dogfight maps are great for those who want to jump on when they can: be it for a bit of "air-quake fly/gun/die/rinse & repeat stuff" or for an objective based "mission" but very poor for other things like a co-ordinated start, historical missions, co-op squadrons etc.

Sure: keep the dogfight server in CloD the way it is (as in IL2 46 MDS Moving Dogfight Server) but give us a proper Co-Op interface as well: it's not as if we are asking for all online experiences to be Co-Op only - we just want the option we used to have without spending hours messing around with scripting before we can even get missions in - time is limited for lots of us as it is.

So adding Co-Ops isn't "a step abckwards" in any shape or form: it is just giving us more options for us to enjoy the online experience.
V

Doc,

to add in: it really may help if you pick up a copy of IL2 46 and just spend an hour or two playing about with the co-op mode and you'll understand it. Trying to explain it is a little like trying to explain how the combustion engine works to an uncontacted tribesman: no matter how much you say it's like, or it does it is doubtful they will get the full picture.
V

[furbs]

Originally Posted by ATAG_Doc

No no no no please don't misunderstand me. This sounds cool to me it does sounds like fun. But I just want to know is there a condition where you have to all start at the same time and is the mission locked? I mean you cannot join if its already in progress? And if it isn't locked can I do whatever I want?

P.S. Ok so I finally connect the dots and DFS is dog fight server. So I think I am understanding you more. I just want an answer to my questions above.

COOP's are locked, they had up to 16 vs 16 pilots plus other AI flights.

Think of a COOP as a set piece battle between 2 squads plus AI.
Or think of all the pilots on ATAG starting at the same time and flying a sortie as squadrons together.

[ATAG_Doc]

Originally Posted by furbs

COOP's are locked, they had up to 16 vs 16 pilots plus other AI flights.

Think of a COOP as a set piece battle between 2 squads plus AI.
Or think of all the pilots on ATAG starting at the same time and flying a sortie as squadrons together.

Ok I am clear. And I understand.

I hope you get what you want.

But I hope I don't ever try to log on and get met with a message that its in mission. lol

[JG53_Valantine]

Originally Posted by ATAG_Doc

Ok I am clear. And I understand.

I hope you get what you want.

But I hope I don't ever try to log on and get met with a message that its in mission. lol

Co-Op missions when "launched" on Hyperlobby disappeared from the browser: the interface for Hyperlobby though was much clearer and much more efficient than the one for CloD though that seems to have been designed on the back of a used napkin with a cigar burn as the telescope lense.

Dogfight servers remained "listed" and joinable. One of the key benefit sof co-ops is that everyone joined at once so it can launch at once: it's not about dropping in and out willy nilly - it's about organised missions starting at the same time with everyone who is going to be in, in already.
V

[41Sqn_Banks]

Originally Posted by ATAG_Doc

But I hope I don't ever try to log on and get met with a message that its in mission. lol

This was the only unrealistic part of coops. Everyone started at the same time, which is in no way realistic, e.g. for a intercept mission the bomber and escort had to be already in the air to allow the fighters to scramble from the ground.

Theoretically the CLOD engine now allows players to join even if the mission is in progress, so a player can join 5 minutes after mission start and choose a aircraft - which was so far controlled by AI and obviously would be already in the air together with the rest of the squadron.

[JG26_EZ]

Pre Edit Of course there's been 7 posts here since I started laying this out hehehe


S~ all..

I was reading earlier on and saw that some haven't played IL2:46 before. May this give you a better view on the process that existed.

I hosted this coop alone, so there won't be any extra names in the windows, but you'll get the idea. And keep in mind, that once you die in this mission, you're dead.. The only thing you can do once you're dead is go jump into someone else's server, or watch the mission unfold with the cameras (watch the missions is what the majority seems to do).

First off, we have the hyperlobby, where people jump into a room, with the host in the top slot of the room. The host can set parameters for the game from here (difficulty settings), so that it doesn't have to be done in game.

Pic#1



This is where I get taken when i launch form Hyperlobby. This lets me select the game type.. ie, coop, dogfight, campaign.

Pic#2



Now, that I've selected which game type, the players start to pour in (automatically) that were in my room at the hyperlobby (my server is now "open"). This is where I can select which mission we will be flying from my mission folders.

Pic#3



Players all enter, and this is what they see first. (No briefing yet, because they haven't chosen a side yet, and you wouldn't want them to see the opposition's orders. You can also see the difficulty settings that are in place, aswell as choosing your aircraft. (Note.. If you pressed fly from here, it would direct you to the aircraft selection screen, coming up next)

Pic#4


This is where you'll see more than just my name if you've had more people join your mission.. they all appear at the bottom, and as they select planes, they appear beside the plane that they have selected. Once you have selected an aircraft, you can arm it.

Pic#5



And this is your arming screen.. self explanatory.

Pic#6



Once you've done your arming, you would want to read your brief, if you hadn't already done so once you selected your aircraft.

Pic#7



Once you're all done, you'd hit the "Fly" button on pic#4, and you appear in this room, the final ready room. Note, there would be a list of the players that joined in this window. The host cannot launch the game until all players are ready.. The "Kick Player" is readily available for those taking too long "grabbing those extra beers" for the flight" Once all appear ready in the list, the host clicks the final send off button that starts the mission..

Pic#8



And we fly the mission. In this mission I downed 2 friendly bombers so I could get some points to register on the next pic..

Pic#9



When the host feels that the mission is over (ie after all have landed/all enemy down, etc,.,. different hosts have different ways of deciding), he/she then ends the mission and all are brought to this screen. This is the screen where we get to see the players' accomplishments for the mission. In my case I didn't accomplish much except for maybe a bullet in the head for what I had done
Scores are a whole other story, as for what's worth what and I won't get into that.. but this is where you'd see the scores.

Pic#10



If the people would like another mission, the host now can bring himself back to Pic#3 and can start the whole process without going back to the lobby if they so choose.


I hope this helps people that have no clue what we're talking about, "see" what we're talking about.

Peace.

[JG53_Valantine]

Good post EZ!
Think that's pretty much co-ops wrapped up into a neat understandable package this evening.
V

[fruitbat]

After seeing this thread, i wish i'd taken a screenshot of the lobby from multi squad SEOW mission i've just flown tonight.

Its a co-op obviously, with 38 humans on each side, planning and then flying the missions in a historical campaign setting (Marianas 1944 in this case) where one mission affects the next, nothing comes close to this as an online flying experience, its simply awesome.

I dream of the day we might do this in Clod/BoM......

[furbs]

Something else...

COOP's other real strength is for training, say you have 8 guys from your squad and you want to practice something for a couple of hours, say dogfighting as a flight, with a COOP you can make a 4 vs 4 mission.

You can all start all at the same time at 12k ft, in formation with a 2 min flight time to intercept.
You have your dogfight and when it ends you can stop the mission, swap sides or what ever and be ready to go again in 1 min, or try something else.

Now it could be other missions, bombing in Stukas, bomber intercept, ship bombing, airfield attack with one side scrambling.
All this can be done with 5 mins flight time to target.

You get 10 training missions in 2 hours, you cant do this on a DFS.