Post made by Jason at Sim HQ

[zapatista]

Originally Posted by Tree_UK

Well it proves that ............ that I was right on target,.

even a dead clock is right twice each day, after your 1700 posts here deliberately sprouting negative crap for years the odds are you eventually would say something that per chance would have been partially right !! obviously that doesnt validate all the other nonsense you posted here for years, or did you think it magically would and you'r now lilly white ? its also somewhat disturbing to see you only perk up when something negative is being said, it seems to be the only thing you ever feed on and rejoice about

Originally Posted by Tree_UK

It also shows of the deception all were involved in to make us believe that Oleg was still captain of the ship, even down to telling us that Oleg's son was really ill so Oleg couldn't post.

no tree it doesnt, you'r again jumping to all kinds of conclusions and sprouting nonsense about facts you dont comprehend and new information you dont seem able to interpret.

jason's post has to be seen for what it is, he is somebody who (since recently) does have a commercial interest in the CoD project and he is in that context minimizing blame for luthier while dancing on oleg's grave and shifting all the blame to oleg (while oleg isnt present to defend himself, great sign of character there jason)

what is new (to me at least, and i have been out of the loop a bit while waiting for a decent fix/update to start using CoD), is the 8 million dollar CoD project funding figure over the 7 years. the rest of what jason says is entirely his spin on facts that are incomplete and open to interpretation.

for example, jason refers to luthier being handed the unfinished project 1 yr before release, which takes us to the point in mid 2009 when oleg was still posting here and him stating he had a fixed release date of "the anniversary of BoB" (which would have meant november 2010, and oleg 6 months before that date realizing it simply could not be done). the project then slipped pasted this nov/dec 2010 date and was then released early in 2011 (you must remember some of those dates, its when you kept weaseling out of puting your money where your mouth was ).

so when ubi (and/or 1c) put their foot down and said "no more delays, you have 1 yr and then its out the door", how did oleg react ? that is the real question. (its a minor issue whether oleg by then was still 5 days per week in the office managing it, or had taken on an additional part time positions with some other company as a consultant, since he by then was only macro managing the CoD project itself).

given olegs very good track record (in game creation and project management) he likely would have known that this forced early release date wasnt realistic, so did he tell them "either i do it right and i need more time", or if they tried to then force his hand "you do it without me" ? likely some years will go by before we find out, but that is much more likely then jason's recent spin story.

another piece of the puzzle we are missing is what exactly happened mid development that caused the lost 2 or 3 years which became the Achilles heel in this whole CoD project ? time wise this is the period we know oleg fired some people, or some left on their own (taking part of the code ?) and the RoF project was started. are all those facts linked, its all speculation at this stage, but those missing years caused the whole delay mess that landed us where we are now.

secondly, with luthier being oleg's trusted sidekick during il2 development (since pacific fighters or even earlier ?) and with the 2 being close friends, AND with luthier being called away from his own project (korea) to help finish CoD a couple of years ago....... with oleg suddenly leaving, luthier would have been about the only logical person the project could have been transferred to (inside their existing team). now the question that arises is, knowing the various good skills and contributions luthier has made to the il2 series, did/does luthier have the project management skills to pull of what oleg knew could not be done to oleg's exacting levels of quality ?

luthier took on an unthankful task to try and finish it, and tried to do so under very difficult circumstances no doubt, but, and how can i say this gently.... he didn not success, its a giant mess.

so nothing new has been provided in that simhq thread that lowers my opinion of Oleg, if anything it only lowers my opinion of jason with his obvious spinning to direct attention away from his own commercial interests (without giving solid facts that can be verified with the people that matter). And no that doesn’t make Jason the anti-christ either, it just means I take what he posts with a decent serve of salt and I see it for what it is

i do wish luthier well in trying to finish the project (he is our only hope, failing oleg coming back to pitch in), and whatever positive input that can be given him should be provided, but it doesnt remove our frustration (as customers and long term fans who had very high hopes for this project)

[Chivas]

Originally Posted by Tree_UK

Well it proves that when I posted Oleg had gone (during development) that I was right on target, It also shows of the deception all were involved in to make us believe that Oleg was still captain of the ship, even down to telling us that Oleg's son was really ill so Oleg couldn't post. It proves that Ubi were not financing the project from the word go (lol @ Chivas). Other than that, everything is the same, we still need communication.

How does Oleg leaving have anything to do with UBISOFT?

[Redroach]

Originally Posted by albx

So, when Oleg was present at the lunch of CoD in Moscow, he was there but he already left 1C. I think we need to give Ilya our apologizes and give him our best support to go ahead with the project, we need just to turn the page.

what the...? Are you guys so easy to reassure?
To quote myself:

Luthier and his team may have limited responsibility on things up to and including release, but what about the time from release until now?

[albx]

Originally Posted by Redroach

what the...? Are you guys so easy to reassure?
To quote myself:

What you want we do? crucify him? We can't give Ilya all the problems CoD have, I hope he is doing his best to fix it, but, if we want accuse him for something then is the poor communication with his customers. Probably he found so many problems when he picked the project that had so small resources to fix it, they had to release CoD in this beta state to make cash or close it. What you prefered? a beta CoD or nothing at all? and right now I believe Jason is also helping him giving his best devs (see who is redoing the sounds). I'm not a patient guy, I really want a patch right now that fix not all but most of the problems, but I know it is not possible. Again, what is missing here is the communication, lack of info from them.

P.S.
I'm still a whiner, not a fanboy...

[Corto]

Originally Posted by albx

So, when Oleg was present at the lunch of CoD in Moscow, he was there but he already left 1C. I think we need to give Ilya our apologizes and give him our best support to go ahead with the project, we need just to turn the page.

I gave him my best support like others here: my money.....
And I dont apologize for nothing...

It is the turn for 1C now not for the community

[albx]

Originally Posted by Corto

I gave him my best support like others here: my money.....
And I dont apologize for nothing...

It is the turn for 1C now not for the community

well, apologizes is too much... of course we gave his company money buying the product, a beta version of a game... now what we paid is gone... we can only hope for a better support, if will be one.

[furbs]

Originally Posted by Blackdog_kt

Seeing someone who took over another project that was down in the dumps during release and turned it around speak highly of Luthier, it pretty much solidifies my belief that Luthier is in it for the long haul and has the skills needed.

It also gives us something nice to quote for the future. It seems to me that in an attempt to take a jab at Chivas in their old argument about the whole Ubisoft matter, Tree has given everyone else who would wish to confront his speculation all the ammunition they'll ever need for the foreseeable future.

Pretty unexpected i should say, i'm genuinely confused.

That's a very strange post from a mod i must say.
Luthier took over a year before the release of CLOD and since then CLOD has still been a mess.
We may know more about it now but it doesn't change what's happened, the development decisions have still been questionable IMO and the release was handled very badly and pretty shambolic.
Since the release the communication has been terrible and the patches so far have been mere fluffing with the core of the sim is still unchanged and buggy as hell.
Music update anyone?

Plus this new info doesn't change what Tree was saying at all, in fact it proves quite alot of it was spot on. We were being fobbed off alot of the time, Oleg was still posting updates and showing his face at shows but its clear now it was just keep people believing he was still the man in charge.

The reason behide it may now be more open but it doesn't change anything.

Luthier is trying his best im sure, but im still not convinced.

[andrea78]

8 million???

With just 1 milliony - in Italy (my country) - you can hire 10 experienced researcher for at least 5 years of works!

I'm joking (ehm... not to much!), but my impression is that budget was enough for a complete game...

[FrostGuru]

Originally Posted by andrea78

With just 1 milliony - in Italy (my country) - you can hire 10 experienced researcher for at least 5 years of works!

I'm joking (ehm... not to much!), but my impression is that budget was enough for a complete game...

8 million is nowadays only a drop on the bucket in the field of game development. Recent game developments have today a budget that compares to low-budget Hollywood productions, means 25-30 millions are a good start.

[Blackdog_kt]

Originally Posted by furbs

That's a very strange post from a mod i must say.
Luthier took over a year before the release of CLOD and since then CLOD has still been a mess.
We may know more about it now but it doesn't change what's happened, the development decisions have still been questionable IMO and the release was handled very badly and pretty shambolic.
Since the release the communication has been terrible and the patches so far have been mere fluffing with the core of the sim is still unchanged and buggy as hell.
Music update anyone?

Plus this new info doesn't change what Tree was saying at all, in fact it proves quite alot of it was spot on. We were being fobbed off alot of the time, Oleg was still posting updates and showing his face at shows but its clear now it was just keep people believing he was still the man in charge.

The reason behide it may now be more open but it doesn't change anything.

Luthier is trying his best im sure, but im still not convinced.

Well, i'll just admit that's me somewhat venting off a bit of steam in a mild manner there, i had just gone reading through and moderating a bunch of threads before seeing this one.

On the other hand, being a moderator doesn't exclude someone from being a regular poster too and expressing personal opinion, that's why colored text is used when moderating to distinguish between the two, when i'm just typing like this i'm simply taking part in the discussion like everyone else. I truly didn't expect that kind of post from the OP.

In any case don't worry, it's my "once per month/every few weeks" venting mechanism

Other than that i don't really care for the score keeping, it just happened to bring forth a bit of interesting information from another source.