Man Made Global Warming

[pencon]

It's just a huge tax swindle , i don't believe it for a second . The moment al gore opens his fat face you know he's spouting more BS .Climate has always and will continue to flucuate .It isn't like we're going to change it one iota by getting ripped off paying huge taxes .

[MD_Titus]

Originally Posted by CWMV

At one point there was overwhelming consensus, both in the science and layman communities, that Africans were inferior to Caucasians, the earth was the center of the universe, and that piltdown man was a legitimate human evolutionary ancestor.

Thank God we have this same consensus in this manner.
Taxes are always a bad thing, and taxes that support bigger government are the worst.
Deliver mail, protect the nation. Taxation for the support of extreem enviro-socialism is just awful.

got to love the summation of environmentalists as communists. must be an american thing? then again, i know brits who refer to anyone even remotely concerned about the environment as commie so who knows. right wing thing?

i'm unsure as to how much of global warming is down to man and how much is just a natural cycle (whihc i think probably reflects the general situation, we can't really know as the data, whilst indicative of human impact, is not wholly conclusive) but i basically come down on the "pumping chemicals and agents, whether naturally occuring or not, into the atmosphere at higher levels than they would naturally occur cannot be good" camp.

but then i also couldn't give two tugs of a dead dog's todger about it. i live on a hill and would like a beach front property within the next 50 years. i also laugh at the "we're killing the planet" brigade because, well, we're not. we're just responsible, to a greater or lesser extent, for a mass extinction event. the planet will be fine, life will continue. we may not.

i do laugh at the climate change denial stuff though. up there with the best conspiracy theories, in that it almost completely ignores scientific data, measurements of polar icecaps, glaciers, etc etc. like the "mmr causes autism" thing.

hilarious 'til you realise these people are serious.

[5./JG27.Farber]

Originally Posted by MD_Titus

... i basically come down on the "pumping chemicals and agents, whether naturally occuring or not, into the atmosphere at higher levels than they would naturally occur cannot be good" camp.

+1 A noble cause.

Originally Posted by MD_Titus

wait, generating electricity, albeit in as yet insignificant amounts and as inefficient as current tech is, is aesthetically undesirable and shouldn't be done?

No like I said, the concept is great. I will explain what I ment better. I am an electrician, I look at buildings differently because I was in the construction trade (thanks bankers!) the current PV panals are do not tie in with the fabric of the building that well. In 5 -10 years they will be knackered and will deduct value from your property. You also loose some space from the house for the batteries. The "pioneers" who have them now will suffer in the future. Once they start making an actually roofing material thats also a PV panal, then we are in business! How do the current ones actual fix to the roof? Are there any holes in the roof to support them? - if there are you can bet they sealed the holes with something retarded like mastic or silicone... I wouldn't want a load of holes on my roof sealed with silicone which will degrade with UV... They pay for themselves in 5-10 years depending on who tells you, so how much longer will they last than that? Also these firms that fit the things are mostly on a quick money band wagon (government grants) so I expect the work is not being carried out by Roofers and Electricians but more an adhoc crew proberbly with one sparkie and a load of numpties...

[Skoshi Tiger]

Originally Posted by 5./JG27.Farber

+1 A noble cause.




No like I said, the concept is great. I will explain what I ment better. I am an electrician, I look at buildings differently because I was in the construction trade (thanks bankers!) the current PV panals are do not tie in with the fabric of the building that well. In 5 -10 years they will be knackered and will deduct value from your property. You also loose some space from the house for the batteries. The "pioneers" who have them now will suffer in the future. Once they start making an actually roofing material thats also a PV panal, then we are in business! How do the current ones actual fix to the roof? Are there any holes in the roof to support them? - if there are you can bet they sealed the holes with something retarded like mastic or silicone... I wouldn't want a load of holes on my roof sealed with silicone which will degrade with UV... They pay for themselves in 5-10 years depending on who tells you, so how much longer will they last than that? Also these firms that fit the things are mostly on a quick money band wagon (government grants) so I expect the work is not being carried out by Roofers and Electricians but more an adhoc crew proberbly with one sparkie and a load of numpties...

It's actually quite funny, but when I got my Solar Power put on it was done through quite a good family friend. I took the day off work to be there when they were installed and had quite a good talk to the forman before it started..

He was blown away because I was the first person he had ever seen that had climbed up on the roof and talked about the installation.

We got clay tiles on our roof and the battons that the pannels mount onto went on brackets that slipped under the tiles and were secured onto the beams of the roof frame. I was quite happy with the guys that did our pannels BUT I think my friend had words to them before they turned up.

There are a LOT of Cowboys out there and,as always, it is best to get a few opinions on the companies work before you sign the contract!

Just checked the inverter and we've clocked up 7,507.7 Kilo Watts produced sinced we've got it installed. Using the rule of thumb of a ton of coal per Mega Watt, that has to give you a good fuzzy feeling.

It 'almost' makes up for my 1972 Valiant Charger that I drive around!

[brando]

Originally Posted by 5./JG27.Farber

I am an electrician, I look at buildings differently because I was in the construction trade (thanks bankers!) the current PV panals are do not tie in with the fabric of the building that well. In 5 -10 years they will be knackered and will deduct value from your property. You also loose some space from the house for the batteries. The "pioneers" who have them now will suffer in the future. Once they start making an actually roofing material thats also a PV panal, then we are in business! How do the current ones actual fix to the roof? Are there any holes in the roof to support them? - if there are you can bet they sealed the holes with something retarded like mastic or silicone... I wouldn't want a load of holes on my roof sealed with silicone which will degrade with UV... They pay for themselves in 5-10 years depending on who tells you, so how much longer will they last than that? Also these firms that fit the things are mostly on a quick money band wagon (government grants) so I expect the work is not being carried out by Roofers and Electricians but more an adhoc crew proberbly with one sparkie and a load of numpties...

It's only by getting these sorts of project started that improvements will come. Once house-builders are asked to provide solar panels on new-build housing - thereby bringing the process under the aegis of "building-control" regulations - then there will be no 'holes' with 'mastic' allowed. And if Bovis or Wimpey ask for panels to be built to a specific size to fit with standard roofing techniques, the panel-makers will roll over if they have any business sense at all. Likewise if the big firms ask the roof-truss manufacturers to beef up their product - maybe add a number of king-post trusses to enable strapping back to - then d'you imagine they're going to refuse?

"...more an adhoc crew proberbly with one sparkie and a load of numpties.." LOL!
If there's just a sparks and a load of unskilled labour - who's going to tell them what to do? The sparks? I don't think so.

[arthursmedley]

Originally Posted by MD_Titus

got to love the summation of environmentalists as communists. must be an american thing? then again, i know brits who refer to anyone even remotely concerned about the environment as commie so who knows. right wing thing?

This is what interests me. Why has denial of climate change been turned into
this symbol of rightwing virility? I'm puzzled by this phenomena. Margaret Thatcher was one of the first western leaders to be convinced of the threat but she was a scientist by training. What has happened since?

Laughable debate here though. As has been said, whatever the Ostriches in this thread may think, climate change is here and now.

[5./JG27.Farber]

Originally Posted by arthursmedley

...climate change is here and now.

No one is denying climate change, only the reasons for it.

[WTE_Galway]

Originally Posted by arthursmedley

This is what interests me. Why has denial of climate change been turned into this symbol of rightwing virility? I'm puzzled by this phenomena.

Seriously ? I thought the connection was obvious. If climate change is true then fixing it would require government intervention in the profit making activities of American business and this, according to Accepted Right Wing American Doctrine, equates to Socialism.

Hence for these people, climate change MUST be false, even before they look at a skeric of scientific data, and furthrmore it is un-American and even downright communist to support climate change.

Its actually important to realise the initial denial is political and Climate Change is deemed a false doctrine for political reasons before any consideration of the science ever takes place. In fact the only reason to look at the science at all is to find means to undermine or discredit it.



Look up the George C. Marshall Institute if you want an example of how its done.

[ATAG_Doc]

I have a great idea! Why don't everyone pay for their own things such as education and we'll go our separate ways and live happily ever after.

[ACE-OF-ACES]

Originally Posted by 5./JG27.Farber

...is just another tax.

True

But the real reason behind it all is not MORE GOVERNMENT REVENUE.. it is all about MORE GOVERNMENT CONTROL

Changes in global temperatures are normal..

Thinking man had anything to do with it STARTING it, or worse yet, thinking we could do anything to STOP it is just plane silly.

The good news is more and more people are waking up to this hoax..

10 years ago, had you said what you said above in a forum you would have been unanimously labeled as a crack pot..

But what with all the data tampering discovered in the last few years by the so called 'scientist' the numbers of those who once believed in it are diminishing and thus only a handful still try and blame man for it instead of the big orange ball that shows up in the sky each day!