The real IL2 focus group (Everyone come in here)

[jt_medina]

Originally Posted by Anton Yudintsev

I suppose, there are now a lot of flight sims on a market, and everyone of othem (except ours), has red-outs?

I've never called the game anyhow, except IL-2 Sturmovik:Birds of Prey.
We are making it, you are voting for it - with your money, and your (possible) loyalty. If it is so important for you - OK, do not even try demo. Or, buy the game, and vote for blackouts in this (and others) polls - than we'll make it in sequel.

But my guess is that this feature is not what make flight sim game a real simulation. Flight sim - by definition - is the simulation of the flight, of the plane dynamics - not of the pilot's body reaction to it. Should 'real' flightsim simulate vomit on a spins as well?

For sure I´ll try the demo. But I have been a fan of the original IL2 and this BOP has part of his name. IL2 made history and I expect at least from this BOP to be as realistic as the original IL2 is.

You want to take this feature out?. Ok, But don´t expect people say that it is an ultra realistic sim. Sorry this is what ""hardcore"" simmers are gonna think, including me. Blackouts play an important role and have been included since my first 16bits simulator.

To me this lower the standar of this sim, may be after I try out the demo I will change my mind but to me and for many others fans of IL2 are gonna see this like a weird decision.

You get angry because of my comments?.
Sr, critics said politely are good to improve things. I am not being rude but just trying to let you know how important this feature for many people is.

There you have the votes of the people. is not it enough to let you know what people really want?.

[Anton Yudintsev]

Originally Posted by jt_medina

For sure I´ll try the demo. But I have been a fan of the original IL2 and this BOP has part of his name. IL2 made history and I expect at least from this BOP to be as realistic as the original IL2 is.

You know, I think I can name more inaccuarcies in physics simulation, plane characteristics, and othe details in original game, than you.
Will it make original IL-2 bad game?
Was original Il-2 a console game? Why do you want the same game on another platform at all.
Was there any console flight simulation game at all? Why?

We made a new game.
Not a direct port of original PC game to consoles. A new one.
There will be parts of better simulation than original.
There will be parts of not-as-precise simulation as original one.
Because it is another game.

Redouts and blackouts - can be cool feature. But it isn't about plane flight simulation at all. It is about _game_. You are not really suffering from redout, when game shows you red screen, aren't you? So it is not about simulation, it is about indication, gameplay.

You want to take this feature out?. Ok, But don´t expect people say that it is an ultra realistic sim.

Yeah, OK.
Call it just realistic sim, without 'ultra'. Or simply just sim.
That means - sim.

To me this lower the standar of this sim, may be after I try out the demo I will change my mind but to me and for many others fans of IL2 are gonna see this like a weird decision.

OK, then don't buy it. No pressure from me.

You get angry because of my comments?.

No. I am getting tired, but not angry.
I understand your reasons.
I know a lot about our game, and about original game. More than gamers, and more than most of developers, and even more than some of developers of original game.
The thing is - you don't understand reasons.
It is hard to make a game, that will appeal to both audience. It is hard to make game with IL-2 name and even with another publisher, for another platform.

I am not telling that I am 100% sure, that that decision was right.
But it wasn't made because we've forgotten to make it, or were too lazy, or simply haven't known that such things happen to pilots. We made this feature, presented it on events, and yet it isn't in a release build.

Ask yourself, does this feature worth, let's say, possibility of ruining sales for a title? Spoil fun in multiplayer? Sequel? Simulation mode at all? Another year of development? Releasing the game at all?

That is what we were chosen (not in that specific case, I mean in general).

There you have the votes of the people. is not it enough to let you know what people really want?.

Nope. Most people in this poll here:
* are flight sim lovers. Moreover, hardcore once, who read forum
* are not against removing this feature. They'd like to have it (so do I), but not against removing it
* do not understand the whole picture (and not prentend to).
Besides, there are only 18 of them so far. Less than focus group, or even QA team.

OK, I have an idea.
Let's stop discuss redouts for a while.
I was going to release some Q&A instead, but I think I've used all my time for a weekend.
Talk to you all next week!

[Jimatay]

Im not THAT fussed about the black out/red outs being taken out the game (as in i can live without it) Im still more fussed about hearing German radio Chatter in Sim/realistic mode. I know Anton gave the reason that it was too quiet without more chatter (which is fair enough) but the easy and more realistic solution to this is to add more Allied chatter. Its little things like that that can take away the realism for me.

[The_Goalie_94]

I only read about three posts Anton replied too, but even without reading them, i do have to stand up for Anton. You cannot simulate something that cannot be simulated in more ways then one. Blackouts and/or redouts would, in the long run potentially ruin the game. And to be truly truly honest, if these so called ""HARDCORE"" simmers would want this, then tell them to get a pilots lisense, and try it themselves. I'm really sure most are in their late 20's or 30's and waist so much money on getting the right computer, or screen or updayes and mods where they can just get a lisence.

In other words, if you want a true flight experience, get a license, other words, the game should just be fun. I'll leave it at that, sorry for being a little rude but points have to get proven one way or another, even if this post didn't cut it...

[Tomo]

Gee there are some real psycho's on this forum.

Anton i would suggest you stop wasting time responding to them.

[Rittmeister86]

Originally Posted by Raw Kryptonite

I'd rather have the game at this point than wait on one feature. If I pull 6 g's I'll just close my eyes until I level out.

Ha Ha I'll go with that idea!

Originally Posted by HauptmannMolders

Of course we'd all love to have these things and frankly I did expect these features to be here so yes I'm dissappointed BUT I'm sick of people whining about every single little detail of this game. This type of moaning is what makes even slightly more casual gamers think sim fans are losers and make no mistake this game is trying to straddle both sides ON PURPOSE. Lets be honest it would appear at this stage, prior to its release, that this game is going to set a new bench mark for flight games on consoles. That is all I ask. We may be abe to get pickier on the second edition but for now the guys that have made this game have poured untold millions of dollars and tens of thousands of hours into a game that if unsuccessful may ruin their company. I for one want every espect to be perfect but even if it is missing a few things the first time around, I am extremely excited and very grateful for the work they have done.

+>>

Amen brother!

[mondo]

Originally Posted by Anton Yudintsev

Moreover, it were actually us who made this feature. And it is painful to know that the feature that was made, implemented, tested, polished and even presented to public already - isn't in the game now. There were reasons for it. Probably, not good enough for some of you - but we have to make choices all the time, a lot of them.

All other sims have blackouts/redouts including the original IL2 and it was never an issue with anyone, it was a 6G blackout, not one person ever had a problem with it. Not having it means this is not a simulation by any stretch of the imagination. Being able to blackout through high G manouvers is probably one of the core elements of a flight simulation where no G suits are factored into it. Nearly every half decent book written by a WW2 pilot has paragraphs on blacking out and its affect on combat.

This is a massive disappointment as I was hoping consoles would finally get a simulator. Thankfully Storm of War:BoB will be out this year also.

[OntheCrab]

Originally Posted by mondo

Thankfully Storm of War:BoB will be out this year also.

lol

[Soviet Ace]

I JUST WANT THIS GAME SO DAMN MUCH!!! I FEEL LIKE A CRACK ADDICT OR SOMETHING!!! COME TO ME!!!!

*Straightens self up*

I just really really really really really want this game to come out already. The wait is KILLING me.

[Spitfire23]

Originally Posted by Soviet Ace

I JUST WANT THIS GAME SO DAMN MUCH!!! I FEEL LIKE A CRACK ADDICT OR SOMETHING!!! COME TO ME!!!!

*Straightens self up*

I just really really really really really want this game to come out already. The wait is KILLING me.

Nicely put