4.13.2 de-bugging

[Tennie]

Originally Posted by Marabekm

Ok so you said you have realistic bombing enabled. Now this may seem like a stupid question but when you try and adjust the intervelometer settings are you in the bombardier's seat? You must be hear and not in the nose gun or pilots seat. Otherwise nothing will happen and you won't get any messages.

I've been using the bombardier's seat. I've basically been trying everything that I think I actually need: I have hotkeys for the basic bombsight input settings, but not for the more complex/heavily involved stuff for the Norden bombsight (e.g. clutch movement). I'm starting to wonder if that is necessary to get it to work (Though, logically, I don't think it should matter, unless there's something in the programming that disables it unless all the bombsight controls have been given hotkeys--which I hope actually isn't the case!).

[Tolwyn]

My first best guess is you're forgetting the Course Autopilot key.

What plane are you flying.
What map.

Fill out this form (edit it for yourself):
http://files.tolwyn.com/il2_keycommands.doc

Obviously you know of these keys:
Increase Sight Distance
Decrease Sight Distance
Increase Sight Altitude
Decrease Sight Altitude
Increase Sight Velocity
Decrease Sight Velocity



HOWEVER YOU MUST have a key bound to Course Autopilot (Mine is Z in the doc above) if you wish to control the plane in the bomber position. This is the only way (aside from rudder trim) that you can take advantage of the new features and the new bomber autopilot.

It is my STRONGEST recommendation that you ONLY engage or disengage the Course Autopilot command FROM THE BOMBER POSITION. NEVER from the PILOT position. You as the BOMBER are COMMANDING the Course Autopilot.

ONCE this is finished, depending upon the plane and if Realistic Bombing is on... the other keys you MUST have for guiding the plane are:
(depending upon the plane):

Toggle Bombsight Clutch (this is pointing the sight to a point on the ground with it DISENGAGED and then when engaged, it "flies" the plane to that point. So:

Toggle Bombsight Clutch

Sight / PDI / Course LEFT
Sight / PDI / Course CENTER
Sight / PDI / Course RIGHT

Obviously:
Open Bombay Doors
Toggle Bomb Release Mode (single, pair, (others), train)
Toggle Bomb Train Amount
Toggle Bomb Train Delay

Some planes you can command the compass COURSE with the clutch DISENGAGED and once the Clutch is ENGAGED, it will turn the plane to follow that course.

This needs the following keys:
Compass/Course Heading +
Compass/Course Heading -

Originally Posted by Tennie

I've been using the bombardier's seat. I've basically been trying everything that I think I actually need: I have hotkeys for the basic bombsight input settings, but not for the more complex/heavily involved stuff for the Norden bombsight (e.g. clutch movement). I'm starting to wonder if that is necessary to get it to work (Though, logically, I don't think it should matter, unless there's something in the programming that disables it unless all the bombsight controls have been given hotkeys--which I hope actually isn't the case!).

[Soldier_Fortune]

Hi all!

First of all: Thanks TD by your great work, and warm congratulations!

I've found a problem about the bombsight BZG-2 (it's not a bug).

What if a player needs to perform a recallibration of the bombsight before his bomber reaches the target?


Actually there is not a way to do it after the command "Bombsight Automation" is turned ON by the first time within the mission; and many things could happen: sinking of the plane, changes of TAS, miss of the chosen landmark by clouds, etc.

The Bombsight Automation of the BZG-2 works like a stopwatch; the elapsed time between the ON/OFF switching is computed together the input Altitude to solve the TAS internally, and finally we get the Drop Angle as output. Right?

Well... IMHO we would need a command "Reset Bombsight" to restart the BS callibration as many times as the player needs. By now, the only way to do it is... reflying the mission.

[Tolwyn]

You can reset the sight without a reset command.
POST UPDATED WITH NEW INFORMATION: See the proposed solution here.

What you need to do is follow the PDF for the FIRST angle, right?

And after your first run, you need to realize that YOU have to reset the bombsight yourself.

I've had the best success with the following

1. CLOSE your bombay doors.
2. Turn ON bombsight automation again until the hollow triangle (4) has made it's way counter-clockwise and stops. Wait a couple of seconds
3. Turn OFF bombsight automation. UPDATED: NO! See the proposed solution. Do NOT turn off bombsight automation. It will turn itself off.
4. Follow the INITIAL procedure as outlined in the PDF.
5. Make sure you remember to open the Bombay Doors again.

HOWEVER, I've had mixed success with this. Normally if I "re-do" the procedure no matter what the bombsight angle is off by about 15 degrees and bombs almost always land 100-200m LONG of the target.

I'm posting a track for the developers to confirm. Maybe *I* am doing something wrong.

Originally Posted by Soldier_Fortune

Hi all!

First of all: Thanks TD by your great work, and warm congratulations!

I've found a problem about the bombsight BZG-2 (it's not a bug).

What if a player needs to perform a recallibration of the bombsight before his bomber reaches the target?


Actually there is not a way to do it after the command "Bombsight Automation" is turned ON by the first time within the mission; and many things could happen: sinking of the plane, changes of TAS, miss of the chosen landmark by clouds, etc.

The Bombsight Automation of the BZG-2 works like a stopwatch; the elapsed time between the ON/OFF switching is computed together the input Altitude to solve the TAS internally, and finally we get the Drop Angle as output. Right?

Well... IMHO we would need a command "Reset Bombsight" to restart the BS callibration as many times as the player needs. By now, the only way to do it is... reflying the mission.

[Soldier_Fortune]

Originally Posted by Tolwyn

You can reset the sight without a reset command.

What you need to do is follow the PDF for the FIRST angle, right?

And after your first run, you need to realize that YOU have to reset the bombsight yourself.

I've had the best success with the following

1. CLOSE your bombay doors.
2. Turn ON bombsight automation again until the hollow triangle (4) has made it's way counter-clockwise and stops. Wait a couple of seconds
3. Turn OFF bombsight automation.
4. Follow the INITIAL procedure as outlined in the PDF.
5. Make sure you remember to open the Bombay Doors again.

HOWEVER, I've had mixed success with this. Normally if I "re-do" the procedure no matter what the bombsight angle is off by about 15 degrees and bombs almost always land 100-200m LONG of the target.

I'm posting a track for the developers to confirm. Maybe *I* am doing something wrong.

Hi Tolwyn!

Thanks by your advise: I've tested your method, and it works fine.

About your "red" comment, I'll test it also for to watch the outcomes by myself. But let me ask you: What was your altitude? Were you flying with wind or without it?

[Tolwyn]

Mission attached.

[MAIN]
  MAP Net3Summer/load.ini
  TIME 12.0
  CloudType 0
  CloudHeight 1000.0
  player g0100
  army 2
  playerNum 0
[SEASON]
  Year 1940
  Month 6
  Day 15
[WEATHER]
  WindDirection 0.0
  WindSpeed 0.0
  Gust 0
  Turbulence 0
[MDS]
  MDS_Radar_SetRadarToAdvanceMode 0
  MDS_Radar_RefreshInterval 0
  MDS_Radar_DisableVectoring 0
  MDS_Radar_EnableTowerCommunications 1
  MDS_Radar_ShipsAsRadar 0
  MDS_Radar_ShipRadar_MaxRange 100
  MDS_Radar_ShipRadar_MinHeight 100
  MDS_Radar_ShipRadar_MaxHeight 5000
  MDS_Radar_ShipSmallRadar_MaxRange 25
  MDS_Radar_ShipSmallRadar_MinHeight 0
  MDS_Radar_ShipSmallRadar_MaxHeight 2000
  MDS_Radar_ScoutsAsRadar 0
  MDS_Radar_ScoutRadar_MaxRange 2
  MDS_Radar_ScoutRadar_DeltaHeight 1500
  MDS_Radar_HideUnpopulatedAirstripsFromMinimap 0
  MDS_Radar_ScoutGroundObjects_Alpha 5
  MDS_Radar_ScoutCompleteRecon 0
  MDS_Misc_DisableAIRadioChatter 0
  MDS_Misc_DespawnAIPlanesAfterLanding 1
  MDS_Misc_HidePlayersCountOnHomeBase 0
  MDS_Misc_BombsCat1_CratersVisibilityMultiplier 1.0
  MDS_Misc_BombsCat2_CratersVisibilityMultiplier 1.0
  MDS_Misc_BombsCat3_CratersVisibilityMultiplier 1.0
[RespawnTime]
  Bigship 1800
  Ship 1800
  Aeroanchored 1800
  Artillery 1800
  Searchlight 1800
[Wing]
  g0100
[g0100]
  Planes 1
  Skill 1
  Class air.HE_111H2
  Fuel 40
  weapons 8xSC250
[g0100_Way]
  NORMFLY 15145.09 11494.06 4000.00 340.00 &0
  NORMFLY 35228.80 28308.23 4000.00 300.00 &0
  NORMFLY 36197.48 34953.23 4000.00 300.00 &0
  LANDING 13389.31 29569.14 0 0 &0
[NStationary]
[Buildings]
  0_bld House$DBmbTargetRing 1 35231.60 28321.12 440.00
  1_bld House$DBmbTargetRing 1 35951.46 29063.56 450.00
  2_bld House$DBmbTargetRing 1 36703.34 29695.65 435.00
[Bridge]
[House]

Originally Posted by Soldier_Fortune

Hi Tolwyn!

Thanks by your advise: I've tested your method, and it works fine.

About your "red" comment, I'll test it also for to watch the outcomes by myself. But let me ask you: What was your altitude? Were you flying with wind or without it?

[Soldier_Fortune]

Originally Posted by Tolwyn

HOWEVER, I've had mixed success with this. Normally if I "re-do" the procedure no matter what the bombsight angle is off by about 15 degrees and bombs almost always land 100-200m LONG of the target.

I'm posting a track for the developers to confirm. Maybe *I* am doing something wrong.

I've been testing this and my outcomes are quite similar than the yours... it seems the BZG-2 actually admits one callibration per mission only.


After the first callibration, I followed your procedure for a second one. But I included the #2 action indicated below:

1) Close bombay doors.
2) Set BS elevation to 0.
3) Switch BS automation ON. (The hollow triangle turns counter-clockwise to its starting position)
4) Switch BS automation OFF once the hollow triangle stops.
5) Look for a new landmark, and restart the callibration following the manual's procedure.

... And always the output is a smaller BS angle than the first, no matter if the BS angle was 0 before the second try or any other value. So, the bombs fall LONG.

My tests were done with 4 x SC250 bombs, 100% fuel load, and steady TAS and altitude along the whole pad.

I'll repeat my tests with your mission data. But surely I'll not get better accuracy than you.

[Tolwyn]

Ok. I had another post here, and I deleted it in favor of this one.

I believe I have this one solved. My mistake was assuming that when resetting the (4) Hollow Triangle back (refer to the readme PDF) to its original position, you should manually turn Bombsight Automation OFF again. YOU DO NOT. It automatically turns itself off. So, after you send the triangle back to its starting position with the Bombsight Automation ON command, DO NOTHING. It'll turn itself off.

There is a NTRK recording attached to prove that this is indeed CONFIRMED.

So, the updated procedure is:

1. Calculate the angle as outlined in the PDF for your first run.
2. Drop Bombs.
3. At your discretion, close your bombay doors.
4. Toggle Bombsight Automation ON until the hollow triangle (4) has made it's way counter-clockwise to its initial starting position and stops. Bombsight Automation will turn OFF automatically (you don't need to do anything).
5. Calculate the angle as outlined in the PDF for the next drop
6. Repeat for any subsequent drops.

[Soldier_Fortune]

Originally Posted by Tolwyn

Ok. I had another post here, and I deleted it in favor of this one.

I believe I have this one solved. My mistake was assuming that when resetting the (4) Hollow Triangle back (refer to the readme PDF) to its original position, you should manually turn Bombsight Automation OFF again. YOU DO NOT. It automatically turns itself off. So, after you send the triangle back to its starting position with the Bombsight Automation ON command, DO NOTHING. It'll turn itself off.

There is a NTRK recording attached to prove that this is indeed CONFIRMED.

So, the updated procedure is:

1. Calculate the angle as outlined in the PDF for your first run.
2. Drop Bombs.
3. At your discretion, close your bombay doors.
4. Toggle Bombsight Automation ON until the hollow triangle (4) has made it's way counter-clockwise to its initial starting position and stops. Bombsight Automation will turn OFF automatically (you don't need to do anything).
5. Calculate the angle as outlined in the PDF for the next drop
6. Repeat for any subsequent drops.

Yes! That works!

I was a bit confused because when the hollow triangle stops after the reset, the sound of the little motor of the BS can be heard yet. So I thought it was necessary to switch the BS Automation to OFF. But we only need to wait few seconds and the device will switch OFF itself.


Thanks by your research!

[Tennie]

Originally Posted by Tolwyn

*Snip*

I found that, once I put in the Course Autopilot hotkey, the intervalometer became usable. That little suggestion helped me a lot, thanks!