Skills & Attribute Analysis

[Zhuangzi]

Well, if that's the case then it's not worth having, bman. There are much better skills to invest in.

In terms of the three spell classes, I am thinking now that Distortion is the best discipline of them all. It has very useful spells like Haste, Slow, Trap, Phantom and perhaps Pain Mirror too. By contrast I am finding Order to be less important. Chaos is poor early (except for level 1 fireball which owns everything at the beginning of the game as a Mage). However, Chaos becomes very important in the endgame. Therefore I would put the order of priority for upgrading, when playing as a Mage, as this:

1. Distortion

2. Chaos (hard to get to in the early game)

3. Order

Thoughts on the above? Am I selling Order short?

[Namel]

About order spells.

I haven't played past dwarves so don't really know later spells... But Phoenix is really great at least until that. What I do is summon phoenix as first move in battle and send it attack enemy.

It has attack that hits 3 targets so damage is decent. At level 3 it also got 800 hp. It ties most if not all enemy units hitting it for round while I shoot them with my spells, rage and ranged. When they finally kill it next round it resurrects. Then they waste another round hitting it while I keep bombarding them. It has given me many victories without single lost unit.

[Saridu]

For me, Phoenix began to wear quickly, esp as a paladin, later game monsters can easily do 800hp dmg in one hit and there are better spells to cast (mass haste, geyser etc) first round.

I think order is a must but I don't think its neccessary to max it, resurrection lv 1 or 2 are fine for the early game and later game you'll most probably be abusing sacrifice, I don't like the mass initiative spell (you get first round from the warrior tree and that's the most important) I'd rather have mass haste and get that all important first strike in.

[Namel]

So far I haven't found haste that useful. My aim is to slow enemy getting to me rather than rushing to it. Of course because of that I use lot of ranged units. And when enemy gets close I can see how far they can move next turn so I just leave my melee outside their attack range and hit them next round when I can be first.

Of course if enemies later have enough movement to get to me with one move then haste will be much more useful.

[LiveInABox]

I find chaos the worst but thats probs cos the only good chaos spells i have are DOOM and weakness..not sure if weakness lvl 3 is mass? i have sacrifice but doesnt seem to work for me..tried it on a load of peasants to give me some more black dragons but it wouldnt let me..

I,ve got some decent order spells...divine armor, demon/dragon slayer, dragon arrows..but my fave is easily distortion. Beserk is insane and Phantom is the best spell in the game that ive used so far. slow would be good if it was mass at lvl 3..but i guess that would be too good.

[waveform]

Originally Posted by LiveInABox

i have sacrifice but doesnt seem to work for me..tried it on a load of peasants to give me some more black dragons but it wouldnt let me..

Yeah... Black Dragons are pretty much immune to all magic and any special abilities or beneficial spells that other troops might have. Use Sacrifice to resurrect other troops.

[Zhuangzi]

Originally Posted by LiveInABox

I find chaos the worst but thats probs cos the only good chaos spells i have are DOOM and weakness..not sure if weakness lvl 3 is mass? i have sacrifice but doesnt seem to work for me..tried it on a load of peasants to give me some more black dragons but it wouldnt let me..

I,ve got some decent order spells...divine armor, demon/dragon slayer, dragon arrows..but my fave is easily distortion. Beserk is insane and Phantom is the best spell in the game that ive used so far. slow would be good if it was mass at lvl 3..but i guess that would be too good.

Yeah I used to think Chaos was the worst too, but they have some excellent lategame stuff. Distortion owns everything though - quite often I find myself only having the Distorion spellbook open during a fight.

Magic Spring is also Distortion I think...but I agree that Phantom is close to the most useful spell later in the game.

[Kosiciel]

Sacrifice is best spell ever, and it is Chaos Magic. If not this single spell, I'd vote for Distortion.

[alon]

Originally Posted by Namel

So far I haven't found haste that useful. My aim is to slow enemy getting to me rather than rushing to it. Of course because of that I use lot of ranged units. And when enemy gets close I can see how far they can move next turn so I just leave my melee outside their attack range and hit them next round when I can be first.

Of course if enemies later have enough movement to get to me with one move then haste will be much more useful.

Agreed. Slow is far better than haste.

Think: to slow an enemy troop for 4 turns, causing it to move just 1 single square per turn giving you virtually endless time to kill it off in whatever way you like or to completely and utterly ignore it. Doesn't it sound sweet?

Also there's the trick that you can simply place your units 2 squares away from the slow moving enemy unit, wait for it to move 1 square towards you , than simply attack it without it being able to retaliate at all. Best done with Royal Snakes. (no retaliation + easy to get early game)

Originally Posted by Yaster

Not only it has very high damage it additionally ends opponents move and works with black dragons, great stuff.

Thanks for the tip.
Didn't think about using it vs. Black Dragons.

Originally Posted by Yaster

And about sacrifice - it's awesome for replenish your army. You can take one low level unit (so it could be resurrected) in your army and keep huge replacement of them in reserve. You will have always something to sacrifice so rest of your units would be covered. No more need to run between shops. It is usable on nearly every unit in game except for black dragons. But hey, you can't have everything right?

Sacrifice doesn't work on undead either.

Originally Posted by Kosiciel

Sacrifice is best spell ever, and it is Chaos Magic. If not this single spell, I'd vote for Distortion.

Agreed.

Also, using 2 Reserve slots you can even go beyond your leadership max and let them "run free" in the battlefield, than after game you can keep the extra troops you can't control in your reserve until you need them or the space in the reserve, whichever comes first.

Also, using the "Peacefulness" spell you can increase the troops hit points by a factor of %30 to %50 more - thus you can resurrect a LOT more troops using the same group of Fodder. Best used on Dwarfs which have a huge amount of hit points and are relatively cheap to come by. (Just check the ratio of Leadership per Hit Point and you'll be set to go).

Also, when you don't have any "fodder" troops but you really, REALLY need more troops and you played smart and have the Mana to spare in battle, arm yourself with a full troop of Inquisitors, Sacrifice at Level 1 one of your best troops that has lots of Hit Points, than Resurrect it with the Inquisitors, than on the next turn use the Gift spell (Order) to re-equip the Inquisitors with the resurrect skill - and resurrect, than gift them again and resurrect - until you have all your "first line" troops back - and you don't even need fodder anymore.

Also use Hypnosis if/when you can and than Sacrifice their lives for your own troops. The very best way to kill off enemy troops by far!

I also use Shaman Totems to keep my newly sacrificed units at top health before I resurrect them with the weak Inquisitors - easily saves me that extra troop.

I even resurrect the "Fodder" troop if my Inquisitors got it available, so I will have max troops.

Originally Posted by Zhuangzi

In terms of the three spell classes, I am thinking now that Distortion is the best discipline of them all. It has very useful spells like Haste, Slow, Trap, Phantom and perhaps Pain Mirror too.

I %100 agree and would demand to know where is the "Target" spell in the list of best spells? and what about Hypnosis...

Don't you just hate Archers? now imagine you can tell them to only shoot at the unit who has the best defenses and hit points in your army + a Healing Totem standing right behind him... isn't it worth at least a mention?

And has anyone tried setting up a Target+Magic Fountain Combo going in a +3 archers battle for some great free Mana boosting? I have. It is amazing fun to see the Mana going up for a change!

Besides all that, I just had a battle with "Magic Shackles" at Level 3, and it was my second time against an army of Devils. DAMN! did you know that at Level 3 and for 40 Mana (10 Mana for Levels 1 and 2 ) the ENTIRE enemy's army can't use their annoyingly powerful talents in battle? (Imps - Fireballs, Seductress - "switch" trick etc. ) Not worth mentioning, ha? I also fought once against 2 Fairies with their annoying "sleep" crapiola who had half my army snoring! 2 quick "Magic Shackles" and BYE BYE!

You also didn't mention the "Teleport" spell! shame on you!
If I didn't have the spell at full power, my Inquisitors would have been mints meat after a seductress-she devil switched places with him. Or the trick where you take a group of huge Giants, plant them right in the face of a group of archers and have him Stump his boots really hard on the ground right next to them! Or the trick where you Teleport your Royal Snakes from one end to another in the ever hard Guardian Battle Screen (where you fight Gremlin towers) having them destroy Tower after Tower - with a single Blow!

And you didn't mention the Stone Skin spell that gives %40 resistance to everything and %40 defense for only 7 Mana at Level 3... I just put them on my Giants which originally have 58 Defense and it turns to 78 for 5 turns!!!

Nope.
All these spells are not even worth mentioning.

Originally Posted by Zhuangzi

By contrast I am finding Order to be less important.

To a degree, but should I get started on Peacefulness, Fit of Energy and Phoenix, and even the "lame" Healing spell?

Originally Posted by Zhuangzi

Chaos is poor early (except for level 1 fireball which owns everything at the beginning of the game as a Mage). However, Chaos becomes very important in the endgame.

In your opinion as a Chaos-only mage.

Can you say that you beat a Hero Level 26 when you were Level 17 and had half your army at the end? I sure can. (I will start as a warrior on Impossible after this easy run though)

Originally Posted by Zhuangzi

Therefore I would put the order of priority for upgrading, when playing as a Mage, as this:

1. Distortion

2. Chaos (hard to get to in the early game)

3. Order

Thoughts on the above? Am I selling Order short?

Sacrifice is so important that it moves Chaos before Order but Distortion takes the cake - hands down.

[Kosiciel]

Chaos magic offers one great damaging spell. Armageddon. With Glot's Armor and hight Int it works wonders. I do almost 9k dmg with one hit of this baby. Black Dragons die easily. It's not fire damage, which is a bit confusing looking at its description. First round, Armageddon, rage fills up, Glot's Armor on my only stack of units, then Armageddon again. Next round, ressurection/some damaging spells. Could be repeated in few (2-3) turns. I wonder how to use Time Back with Armageddon.
One thing with Stone Skin - it takes one initiative point, and AFAIK it only gives physical resistance. There is a nice Order spell, God's Armor, on level 3 gives 51% resistance to all.