locked treads on IL-2 Sturmovik Forum

[SlipBall]

Originally Posted by Bearcat

. ..

.. I always did find it interesting though that the the most ardent fans of this sim preferred the term CloD over CoD... I never understood that. until I came here.

I think most did to differentiate from Call of Duty

[startrekmike]

I have a feeling that this thread will vanish, in fact, I hope it does.

I don't get it, we are all here for the same thing and yet there always seems to be a thread or two running on this board that continues the same circular arguments, posturing and finger pointing.

Well, lets hope that by the time I post this, the mods will have deleted this one also, it has gotten out of control, personal opinions about products are one thing, belittling and dividing the player base is another.

How long has this kind of stuff been going on here? How long can it continue?

[Skoshi Tiger]

Originally Posted by startrekmike

I have a feeling that this thread will vanish, in fact, I hope it does.

I don't get it, we are all here for the same thing and yet there always seems to be a thread or two running on this board that continues the same circular arguments, posturing and finger pointing.

Well, lets hope that by the time I post this, the mods will have deleted this one also, it has gotten out of control, personal opinions about products are one thing, belittling and dividing the player base is another.

How long has this kind of stuff been going on here? How long can it continue?

Threads like this will continue until people stop posting in them. If you are not interested in a thread don't post in it. If you do the thread will go to the top of the list and more people will read and possibly respond to any one of the comment in the thread. thus perpetuating the active life of the thread.

If you can't help your self and have to respond to comments made, try ignoring the people whos post you find annoying. The forum has that feature for a reason.

Some people have the attitude that they have to win a point when posting on a forum. This is of course complete rubbish. There are no winners and no loosers. Just opinions and people are entitled to those.

Personally if I find a persons opinions repulsive, in real life I wouldn't associate with them or communicate with them. In my opinion on-line is no different.

[Skoshi Tiger]

Originally Posted by SlipBall

I think most did to differentiate from Call of Duty

You might be right there.

I think the term was coined by haters to denigrate the sim. But just like Lord Haw Haw found when he used the term 'Desert Rats' as a put down, the men that he directed it at took it to heart and used it as a honorific.

I personally use the term CoD. But seening how I've only played Call of Duty 3 times I don't associate the sim with the FPS.

[Feathered_IV]

So far the new il-2 forum has been a pleasant place to visit. I hope the more rigorous moderation will continue and that it will help re-educate the community and teach them to conduct themselves better. I don't know why the moderation here has been so very poor for so many years. Whether it was laziness, personal agendas, or whether they just weren't sophisticated enough to make good decisions. Whatever the reason, there is ample evidence to show that they have failed in their duties. The degree of bullying, slander and relentless goading that goes on daily here is truly shameful. The forum seems to bring out the worst in every personality, and not a single one of us is free of blame for that. I'm just as dismayed by the demise of Cliffs' as anybody else, but one upshot of the entire debacle is that we might one day be able to put this place behind us.

[Skoshi Tiger]

Re-educate as in a re-education camp?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reeducation_camp

Originally Posted by wiki

Reeducation camp (Vietnamese: trại học tập cải tạo) is the official title given to the prison camps operated by the government of Vietnam following the end of the Vietnam War. In such "reeducation camps", the government imprisoned several hundred thousand former military officers and government workers from the former regime of South Vietnam. Reeducation as it was implemented in Vietnam was seen as both a means of revenge and a sophisticated technique of repression and indoctrination, which developed for several years in the North and was extended to the South following the 1975 North Vietnam takeover.[citation needed]

Hmmm! Maybe adults should act in an adult like mannor and not take everything as a personal insult, but as an adult I enjoy being able to have my own opinion and be able speak my own mind. As long as people can maintain a mature composure it shouldn't matter what they talk about.

It would be better if people behaived in an appropriate manner without the need of a big stick.

I have no complaints against any of the moderators at this site. It is a awful job and I would be loathed to do it. All praise to them that stood up and took on the responsibility.

Originally Posted by Feathered_IV

I'm just as dismayed by the demise of Cliffs' as anybody else, but one upshot of the entire debacle is that we might one day be able to put this place behind us.

You can do that any time you want? It's not as though your being held here against your will.

[Feathered_IV]

Originally Posted by Skoshi Tiger

You can do that any time you want? It's not as though your being held here against your will.

I know, I know!
I can quit any time, honest... :shifty expression:

[kendo65]

Originally Posted by Feathered_IV

So far the new il-2 forum has been a pleasant place to visit. I hope the more rigorous moderation will continue and that it will help re-educate the community and teach them to conduct themselves better. I don't know why the moderation here has been so very poor for so many years. Whether it was laziness, personal agendas, or whether they just weren't sophisticated enough to make good decisions. Whatever the reason, there is ample evidence to show that they have failed in their duties. The degree of bullying, slander and relentless goading that goes on daily here is truly shameful. The forum seems to bring out the worst in every personality, and not a single one of us is free of blame for that. I'm just as dismayed by the demise of Cliffs' as anybody else, but one upshot of the entire debacle is that we might one day be able to put this place behind us.

The moderators had a really difficult job here. I think their over-riding concern since the launch was to allow for free speech and honestly expressed opinions as much as possible. It was a thankless and near impossible task. Whatever they did they would annoy someone or other. People were banned when they really over-stepped the mark, as Tree's repeated absences showed.

If they had clamped down really hard a year ago there would have been a backlash with (some) people complaining of over-zealousness and blocking of free speech.

Maybe with hindsight (?) that would have been a price worth paying? But I don't think it would have changed the final outcome.

Originally Posted by Feathered_IV

'bullying, slander and relentless goading',

I usually have taken a stance of either accepting people's right to express what they feel or have tried to respond respectfully and carefully with reasoned arguments where I may disagree, BUT recently it has gone beyond where this is an adequate response, with certain people repeatedly attacking forum members and other sims in the most personal, unbalanced, aggressive and unreasonable way, despite having their 'points' repeatedly shown to be unfounded.

When logic doesn't work and when they won't stop trying to shove you around it is finally time to start pushing back in the same manner they use...
or walk away completely...something that may yet be the best idea.

[Wolf_Rider]

Originally Posted by Feathered_IV

So far the new il-2 forum has been a pleasant place to visit. I hope the more rigorous moderation will continue and that it will help re-educate the community and teach them to conduct themselves better.

There is this "re-educate" thing again...
I don't know what it is with people and their insistence that others must be re-educated (or made to see the one point of view), as the very worst countries on Earth all had re-education on their books. How, some say, the more we forget the past, the more we are doomed to repeat that past.

There was this country in central Europe which tried it pre and during WWII along with another small country to the south, there was another larger country, to the east, which tried it a few decades earlier whilst going through a revolution. Someone mentioned a S.E.Asian country bunging it on in the 70's... well there was another country to the west of that one which also did it, and opened up entire fields for the end result. To the north of those two is another large country trying it on again today.
A certain 'church' also tried it a couple of centuries ago, and man did they have the tools to do it with! As well, there is another "church" also trying it on today.


The mindset of "making" people see only the one point of view IS WRONG!

Originally Posted by kendo65

When logic doesn't work and when they won't stop trying to shove you around it is finally time to start pushing back in the same manner they use...
or walk away completely...something that may yet be the best idea.

the aim of that tactic is to have "dissenters" walk away

[Fjordmonkey]

Originally Posted by Wolf_Rider

There is this "re-educate" thing again...
I don't know what it is with people and their insistence that others must be re-educated (or made to see the one point of view), as the very worst countries on Earth all had re-education on their books. How, some say, the more we forget the past, the more we are doomed to repeat that past.

There was this country in central Europe which tried it pre and during WWII along with another small country to the south, there was another larger country, to the east, which tried it a few decades earlier whilst going through a revolution. Someone mentioned a S.E.Asian country bunging it on in the 70's... well there was another country to the west of that one which also did it, and opened up entire fields for the end result. To the north of those two is another large country trying it on again today.
A certain 'church' also tried it a couple of centuries ago, and man did they have the tools to do it with! As well, there is another "church" also trying it on today.

The mindset of "making" people see only the one point of view IS WRONG!

the aim of that tactic is to have "dissenters" walk away

It's more about getting people to discuss things in a sensible, constructive and adult manner (something I'll wholeheartedly and honestly admit that I fail at from time to time) instead of being small-minded, foul-mouthed and frothing trolls. People are entitled to having their point of view, but they should also be able to discuss that point of view in, again, a constructive manner. Which is something that we've seen fail time and time again here.

Or to put it bluntly: Behave, or face the consequences. Forums on the 'net has never been, is not and will never be a democracy. ALL of them are dictatorships in one form or another, and you accept that when you create your account and when you log into them. Free speech does NOT exist on a forum, although that's something many people utterly forget or don't bother realizing.

In my opinion, the moderators should have been way harsher in removing those that cannot or will not behave and post in a sensible manner. At this point it's not even worth discussing, as most of the posts on this forum has long since outlived their usefulness apart from a historical record of a game that had impossibly high expectations facing it from the community.