Energy Maneuverability

[IvanK]

Nothing to do with G Suits in this chart. The red and Blue convex lines merely represent the sustained G that each aircraft can pull without energy loss i.e. Ps=0. The Red line represents the Mig15 sustained turn boundary, The Blue line the F86F (doesnt say hard or slatted wing) sustained turn boundary. The left hand margin is the Lift limit, the top the structural limit, the RHS the Vmax limit.

This chart is pretty historical as it was one of Boyds first comparative EM charts. It is my belief that this chart was in fact based totally on calculation. Its origin is I believe from a presentation Vu graph used by Boyd in one of his early presentations. The original graph was taken from Boyds archival papers. I recall its covered in the book "Boyd the fighter pilot that changed history" by Coram.

[MadBlaster]

Originally Posted by IvanK

Nothing to do with G Suits in this chart. The red and Blue convex lines merely represent the sustained G that each aircraft can pull without energy loss i.e. Ps=0. The Red line represents the Mig15 sustained turn boundary, The Blue line the F86F (doesnt say hard or slatted wing) sustained turn boundary. The left hand marhin is the Lift limit, the top the structural limit, the RHS the Vmax limit.

This chart is pretty historical as it was one of Boyds first comparative EM charts. It is my belief that this chart was in fact based totally on calculation. Its origin is I believe from a presentation Vu graph used by Boyd in one of his early presentations. The original graph was taken from Boyds archival papers. I recall its covered in the book "Boyd the fighter pilot that changed history" by Coram.

ah well thanks for clarification. it seems coincidence though. wiki says gloc occurs around 5 g for average human. so to get to those outer performance curves, you would need a g suit.

so, i wonder if the lower curves maybe are just normal operating curves and the outer ones, performance curves under combat condition, or something like that?

[IvanK]

The lower curves are simply Ps=o lines that represent the Sustained G (at the altitude the chart is calculated for) that each aircraft can sustain with out losing altitude or TAS.

Correction to the Book title its

"Boyd The fighter pilot who changed the art of war " essential reading if you are into this stuff. The book covers in great detail how these early EM charts were calculated... the story about how they got the computing assets and time is a classic.

http://www.amazon.com/Boyd-Fighter-P.../dp/0316796883

Boyd was the father of the OODA loop.

[MadBlaster]

Originally Posted by IvanK

The lower curves are simply Ps=o lines that represent the Sustained G (at the altitude the chart is calculated for) that each aircraft can sustain with out losing altitude or TAS.

Correction to the Book title its

"Boyd The fighter pilot who changed the art of war " essential reading if you are into this stuff. The book covers in great detail how these early EM charts were calculated... the story about how they got the computing assets and time is a classic.

http://www.amazon.com/Boyd-Fighter-P.../dp/0316796883

Boyd was the father of the OODA loop.

got it now! thanks.

[ATAG_Doc]

Originally Posted by IvanK

The lower curves are simply Ps=o lines that represent the Sustained G (at the altitude the chart is calculated for) that each aircraft can sustain with out losing altitude or TAS.

Correction to the Book title its

"Boyd The fighter pilot who changed the art of war " essential reading if you are into this stuff. The book covers in great detail how these early EM charts were calculated... the story about how they got the computing assets and time is a classic.

http://www.amazon.com/Boyd-Fighter-P.../dp/0316796883

Boyd was the father of the OODA loop.

Even better http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/158365-1

But I believe this topic is well over the heads of your average person that's plays this GAME and doesn't care. But there is a magazine for everyone I guess.