the air forces know the secret for uber piloting the sports world doesnt

[raaaid]

youre confusing the thing by throwing random facts

the fact:

modern fighters have short sticks

old fighters had long sticks

modern fighters have short run

old fighters had long run

modern fighters have high sensitivity

old fighters had low sensitivity


show me a picture of a new fighter with a long stick that is with low sensitivity

man i grant you in the future racers will go with insane high sensitivity in their wheels is a matter of a pioneer doing it and washing the floor with the rest

[hegykc]

Hahahaha, not one, not one thing you just said is correct

F-16 doesn't have short stick travel. It has 0 stick travel.
But then pilots started complaining that they have trouble orienting and realising where the stick acctually is. Then the designers introduced 1/4 inch or 6mm stick travel. And that is "empty travel" not connected to the control surfaces in any way.
Maximun noseup and nosedown pitch commands are genrated by 25 and 16 pounds of input, respectively. Roll commands are generated by a maximum of 17 pounds in cruise gains and by 12 pounds in takeoff and landing gains.

But that is still only one aircraft, and it was problematic.

Wanna talk f-14, f-15, 1-104, f-111, f-117 and literally hundreds and hundreds of airplanes before and after that from all the countries around the world that have conventional sticks, with 20-30+ cm of travel. Just like the WWII fighters.

Even if your statement would be correct, older fighter can still out-turn any modern one.

Have you actually checked any of your statements before stating them??

Oh, and by the way, I'm an inventor with a engineering degree. A professional one, making a living of it. So I'm all for open mindedness and thinking out of the box.

[raaaid]

ive seen many FIGHTERS in movies and all used short sticks

your confusing run with force feedback

f16 has a stick with extreme short run AND A STRONG FORCE FEED BACK

sensitivity is related with run not feed back

so the f16 and many other stick SHORT RUN give away my point of the high sensitivity advantage

the only sensible point ive seen so far except childish bias is that high sensitivity in racing is limited for safety reasons

[hegykc]

Name a modern fighter with your "short stick".

And please, movies Are you really kidding me
You do know that they film the cockpit footage on the ground, and mostly on mock-up cockpits

[raaaid]

the previous f16

and the f18 is pretty short if you ask me



edit:

i wont go into complex stuff but just exposing the obvious:

do you know why soome one designed a 0.5 mm run stick for an extreme plane?

because countersteering a stall like that is faster

nope it was not fashion

[hegykc]

F-18, 2G per one inch of stick travel. That's 4.5 inches or 12cm for pitch up. And there is more stick travel, but you can't achieve it because of the forces being too strong to pull of, again, for safety reasons.
So, the F-18 has exactly the same stick travel as a WWII 109.

F-16 doesn't have any force feedback, and that's where it becomes apparent that you haven't actually spent more than 5min researching the subject.

Again, name another modern fighter with you "short stick"

[raaaid]

why should i name another, one plane designer thought as me

so you dont agree that sensitivity is related with run

edit:

a force is a resistance to move, exactly what the f16 stick has, if you dont like the name force feed back thats all right we may call it the force onwards

[raaaid]

Originally Posted by hegykc

Again, name another modern fighter with you "short stick"

this one that you as an expert (copy pasting) can tell the plane





if someone still doubts how an f 16 side stick works:

to move it 1 mm you apply 1 kg

to move it 2 mm you apply 2 kg

to move it 3 mm, maximum range you apply 3 kg

just as i set up my wheel now

had anybody heard before of those force controls joystick before? sounds pretty interesting and just what i had found out best

[Fjordmonkey]

Originally Posted by raaaid

ive seen many FIGHTERS in movies and all used short sticks

your confusing run with force feedback

f16 has a stick with extreme short run AND A STRONG FORCE FEED BACK

sensitivity is related with run not feed back

so the f16 and many other stick SHORT RUN give away my point of the high sensitivity advantage

the only sensible point ive seen so far except childish bias is that high sensitivity in racing is limited for safety reasons

No. ABSOLUTELY NOT! If you don't believe me, go look up the history of the F16, the TCTO's for the F16's, and the horrendous amount of information on the F16's flightcontrol-system.

The F16's stick moves 1/4th of an inch. That 1/4th of an inch is built into the system to give pilots a deadband so that they don't input unwanted commands, especially in pitch. ABSOLUTELY NO force feedback is in the stick of an F16. AT ALL. Period. That's one of the things that catch new pilots on the Viper off when they transition from the T38 Talon (which is based on the F5) to the Viper. So I'll say this again: The F16's flight-control system is based on FORCE of the input, not the TRAVEL of the input. That's one of the key differences between the stick in an F16 and for example an F18. Both are fly-by-wire designs, but the F18's stick move in a more traditional manner.

But hey! Don't believe me all you want. I don't know jack shit about the F16's, even though I served as an F16 groundcrew during my RNoAF servicetime (yes, this is irony, since you seemingly need to have things fed to you with very small spoons). I've seen, touched and handled every single part of the F16's airframe and systems through that, I've spent more time with my nose in the TCTO's for the aircraft, and I'd daresay I know a TAD more about the F16 than you do. So stop talking out of your butt, and try to understand that there are people here with far greater knowledge, even hands-on knowledge, with the aircraft.

[raaaid]

youre trowing random facts again and trying to apply the autority criteria in your favour

what of this statements is false?

statement number 1:

the f16 stick has an extreamly short run


statement number 2:

a high or low sensitivity depends on the stick run

statement number 3:

the f16 has a short run which it implies it has high sensitivity

edit:

your making a sophism in your point:

the control is based on the force

oh yeah to move it farther you have to apply more force

then so its a 109 stick based on the force to move it farther you have to apply more force

a sophism