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FM/DM threads Everything about FM/DM in CoD

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  #1  
Old 09-25-2012, 04:02 PM
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ACE-OF-ACES ACE-OF-ACES is offline
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Here are a few more P-38 accounts..

That prove it was no big deal to fly on one engine..

Keep in mind these accounts are from actual military trained pilots that flew the P-38 WWII!

That is to say, a modern civ trained pilot may read something in the pilots manual some 70 years after the fact and falsly conclude that all twins require must land ASAP and avoid any sort of maneuver other than level flight while looking for a place to ditch..

But as you can see from the following accounts, that was not the case at all


Quote:
Stan Wood: Two engines in the P-38 gives a person a feeling of security that one engine can never do. I came back once with an oil fire in my right engine and landing with the remaining engine was no trouble.

Regarding flying the 38 with one engine feathered, I was told that one should not turn into a dead engine. However, I remember a demonstration by Tony Lavier who feathered an engine on takeoff and then did a slow roll into the dead engine. Tony was one of the original test pilots on the 38 for Lockheed and could do things with it that were almost impossible. I wouldn't have even tried it at altitude let alone on takeoff.

Quote:
Captain Stan Richardson: The airplane was a "dream" on single-engine. While I was instructing in P-38's at Muroc AAF, on occasion the instructor and three students (four ship flight) would each feather the right propeller (remember, only a single generator, and that on the left engine) for a "tail chase" which included loops, slow and barrel rolls, and just generally having a good time. The exercise was to instill confidence in the pilots ability to control the aircraft on one engine.

It was a dandy flying machine in instrument conditions associated with poor weather. I had to return once from Berlin on one engine. No problem."
Quote:
Richard E. Smith: I liked flying the P38 the most, out of all the airplanes I flew, mainly because it had two engines. There were many missions, when our guys would fly back to base on one engine. I remember one time, flying back from Rabaul, I saw two P-38;s . One was the C.O.’s and he had one engine out. I trotted back to stay with him, but he waved me on home. Later when he got back over base, he turned on the other engine, and landed on two. The guys would often do that. If the engine got damaged, shut it off, and save the fluids, then they could try and restart it when the got back. In New Guinea, especially, that was very important because you didn't want to bail out!
And that is just three accounts.. There are many more of these out there on the web and in books

Enjoy!
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Theres a reason for instrumenting a plane for test..
That being a pilots's 'perception' of what is going on can be very different from what is 'actually' going on.
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Old 09-25-2012, 04:28 PM
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Quote:
That prove it was no big deal to fly on one engine..
Wow... Send your stories to Lockheed so they can re-write the Flight Operations Manual!!

Obviously, they got it all wrong and you are right.

Quote:
In the P-38 Flight Operating Instructions, located in Chapter
IV EMERGENCY PROCEDURES, you will find the instructions for single engine operation on page 39, section 5.
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Old 09-25-2012, 04:37 PM
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Its groundhog day again, and its always the same person.......

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Old 09-25-2012, 04:57 PM
JtD JtD is offline
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Groundhog day or not, flying on one engine is an emergency procedure. Doesn't necessarily imply immediate, mortal danger.
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Old 09-25-2012, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JtD View Post
Groundhog day or not, flying on one engine is an emergency procedure. Doesn't necessarily imply immediate, mortal danger.
Bingo!

Loosing an engine in any plane would more than likely result in an emergency procedure (DUH)

The difference being a twin has options a single does not have!

And the emergency procedure is not even the question!

That was just a tangent topic Crumpp started to take the focus of his initial reply to the original question that implied all twins have to stop what they are doing and start looking for a place to put down..

Which may be the case for the Bf110? I don't know, but based on the P-38 pilot accounts, that certainly was NOT the case.

As noted, a P-38 could do loops while running on one engine.

Which is not to say a P38 pilot would want to dog fight on one engine, it just highlights the silly notion that it is a characteristic of ALL TWINS must stop what they are doing and start looking for a place to put down

But I digress

The question was.. can a Bf110 be flown on one engine?

To which the answer is yes, both in game and real world
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Theres a reason for instrumenting a plane for test..
That being a pilots's 'perception' of what is going on can be very different from what is 'actually' going on.

Last edited by ACE-OF-ACES; 09-25-2012 at 05:38 PM.
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Old 09-25-2012, 05:46 PM
kohmelo kohmelo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crumpp View Post
Wow... Send your stories to Lockheed so they can re-write the Flight Operations Manual!!

Obviously, they got it all wrong and you are right.


You are just one of those people who just like to insist that earth is flat even when Columbus came back from america. It written right here in this book you hear! and sun does circle the earth because this book says it!

Now this threat was speculation and discussion about "Is it possible to fly the Bf-110 with 1 engine." Its not discussion did every 2 engine plane have emergency procedure for one engine flight. I could swear that they even had emergency prodecure for 0 engine flight but that does not mean that plane could maintain alt or speed in that condition.

As for manuals: Most manual are written for 90% performance just because part quality varies in different stages of production and part quality is nearly never 100% even in peace time as there are flaws. It would be dangerous if manuals were written for 100% performance because people would try to push it to that what manual states and when failure occures they would blame the manufacor for said failure.

As for this offtopic P-38 discussion there are really many flaws in manuals on that plane. For instance 'best fuel performance boost and RPM.' but then again you would not believe man who was the first to fly over atlantic know anything about engine performance.

As for Crumps 21st century aviation trivia that every plane should fly with one engine for safety. Say that to 1940s pilots flying with HS-129. Plane was nearly too heavy even for 2 engines.
And I really believe that many planes were not at their best conditions back then and would not get a takeoff permit from 21st century officials. No DeIcing, engine maintain schedule overdue, fabrics broken, parts missing, warning lights on, pilot have not had enought rest prior to flight, too much snow/water on runway Etc.
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