71/2 Minutes at +11 Boost, Spit Ia100oct

[Matt255]

Afaik, fully back should be auto rich and it's lean in CloD. So if you're saying that you moved the mixture lever fully forward, you used rich mixture.

I think this is also the thing, that causes the most engine problems, because you're supposed to run the engine auto rich at high boost, but thanks to the mix-up in CloD and the mixture automatically going to fully lean, if you pull the throttle back and then forget to set the mixture back to rich, you easily ruin your engine.

Anyway, many thanks for this video. Definately helps as a workaround for the current FM. Even though it's still a bit tricky at higher altitudes. I just never know, which RPM is still "save", because even if you keep temperatures low enough, the engine might still "blow up".

[ATAG_Dutch]

Originally Posted by Matt255

Afaik, fully back should be auto rich and it's lean in CloD. So if you're saying that you moved the mixture lever fully forward, you used rich mixture.

Yep. This is where some of the mixture confusion is coming in. As I said a few posts back, rich and lean seem to be opposite in some models.

So when I say 'rich' I mean 'lever back', when I say 'lean' I mean 'lever forward'. Whether it's opposite to what is actually modelled seems to vary between aircraft, but what I tend to do is just put it in the position which runs smoothly with the most power, then adjust slightly to give a blue flame.

Testing mixtures is next on my list, unless some other kind soul would do it..........

[IvanK]

This is the current bug situation with Mixture in CLOD... its a tad complex:

WRT RAF Mixture settings there are multiple issues. Here are the bugs, how it should work. Stick with me here its a tad confusing

In Ver 1.08 the link between the throttle and the mixture lever in that when the throttle is closed it brings the mixture lever back is now correct this is how it was in both the Hurri and the Spits. IRL this means AUTO RICH.

However the Mixture strength going to the engine is operating in reverse in all Hurris and Spits in CLOD at present.

The Correct setup in real life is:
Mixture lever Back Mixture is AUTO RICH
Mixture Lever Forward Mixture is AUTO LEAN
There were only 2 positions Forward or Back
In Both AUTO RICH or AUTO LEAN compensation for altitude is automatic.
The only real difference between AUTO RICH and AUTO LEAN is each is running a slightly different mixture strength schedule. One suitable for General and all power settings (AUTO RICH) and the other for range/endurance flying at low power settings (AUTO LEAN)

You only really need to run AUTO LEAN if you are really trying to minimise fuel consumption. Anytime you are running AUTO LEAN there are max boost limitations to be adhered to or engine damage will result. (+2.25Lbs Merlin II and III and +4Lbs Merlin XII). Max power and or Boost Cutout operation at 12LBS must have Mixture in AUTO RICH.

VER1.08 IN COD MIXTURE BUGS
MIXTURE LEVER BACK is giving LEAN MIXTURE WRONG
MIXTURE LEVER FORWARD is Giving RICH MIXTURE WRONG
Lever has infinite movement WRONG it should be 2 position only.
MIXTURE LEVER is not working in any AUTO function since passing around 12,000ft you need to select LEAN to get smooth operation. This is WRONG as AUTO RICH should automatically compensate for altitude.

VER1.08 Workarounds
You will get better cooling using RICH MIXTURE .. it helps on the climb in the Spit IIA especially (though its still out of wack). On take off once full throttle is selected push the mixture lever fully forward to the RICH (WRONG POSITION IN VER 1.08 ) Passing around 12,000ft you will start to get rough engine operation so pull the lever back to the LEAN (WRONG POSITION IN VER 1.08 ) If Activating BOOST CUT OUT you must be in RICH so push the lever forward (WRONG POSITION IN VER1.08 )to RICH .... if you don't you will get rough running and engine damage.

HOW IT SHOULD BE USED IRL
In Reality all you really need to do is just leave the Mixture in the rear position in AUTO RICH and forget about it. You then have Automatic Altitude compensation, No BOOST limitation restrictions, no issues with the throttle moving the mixture lever just go fly.

All of this has been communicated to the Devs ... we now wait for the fix.

[NZtyphoon]

Originally Posted by IvanK

This is the current bug situation with Mixture in CLOD... its a tad complex:

WRT RAF Mixture settings there are multiple issues. Here are the bugs, how it should work. Stick with me here its a tad confusing

In Ver 1.08 the link between the throttle and the mixture lever in that when the throttle is closed it brings the mixture lever back is now correct this is how it was in both the Hurri and the Spits. IRL this means AUTO RICH.

However the Mixture strength going to the engine is operating in reverse in all Hurris and Spits in CLOD at present.

The Correct setup in real life is:
Mixture lever Back Mixture is AUTO RICH
Mixture Lever Forward Mixture is AUTO LEAN
There were only 2 positions Forward or Back
In Both AUTO RICH or AUTO LEAN compensation for altitude is automatic.
The only real difference between AUTO RICH and AUTO LEAN is each is running a slightly different mixture strength schedule. One suitable for General and all power settings (AUTO RICH) and the other for range/endurance flying at low power settings (AUTO LEAN)

You only really need to run AUTO LEAN if you are really trying to minimise fuel consumption. Anytime you are running AUTO LEAN there are max boost limitations to be adhered to or engine damage will result. (+2.25Lbs Merlin II and III and +4Lbs Merlin XII). Max power and or Boost Cutout operation at 12LBS must have Mixture in AUTO RICH.

VER1.08 IN COD MIXTURE BUGS
MIXTURE LEVER BACK is giving LEAN MIXTURE WRONG
MIXTURE LEVER FORWARD is Giving RICH MIXTURE WRONG
Lever has infinite movement WRONG it should be 2 position only.
MIXTURE LEVER is not working in any AUTO function since passing around 12,000ft you need to select LEAN to get smooth operation. This is WRONG as AUTO RICH should automatically compensate for altitude.

VER1.08 Workarounds
You will get better cooling using RICH MIXTURE .. it helps on the climb in the Spit IIA especially (though its still out of wack). On take off once full throttle is selected push the mixture lever fully forward to the RICH (WRONG POSITION IN VER 1.08 ) Passing around 12,000ft you will start to get rough engine operation so pull the lever back to the LEAN (WRONG POSITION IN VER 1.08 ) If Activating BOOST CUT OUT you must be in RICH so push the lever forward (WRONG POSITION IN VER1.08 )to RICH .... if you don't you will get rough running and engine damage.

HOW IT SHOULD BE USED IRL
In Reality all you really need to do is just leave the Mixture in the rear position in AUTO RICH and forget about it. You then have Automatic Altitude compensation, No BOOST limitation restrictions, no issues with the throttle moving the mixture lever just go fly.

All of this has been communicated to the Devs ... we now wait for the fix.

Nice one Ivan! in spite of the complexity this is a model of clarity.

[ATAG_Dutch]

Originally Posted by NZtyphoon

Nice one Ivan! in spite of the complexity this is a model of clarity.

It certainly is. Half of the problem with the current RAF fighters is the incorrect mixture modelling, the other half appears to be connected with the way drag is modelled in the radiators.

In my opinion, if these two issues were addressed, many of the FM complaints would evaporate.

Here's hoping for a rectification of both issues in the 'release candidate'.

[JG52Krupi]

I also hope the sound radar is removed and a fully animated cockpit is added I.e. trim wheels etc.

[ATAG_Dutch]

Originally Posted by JG52Krupi

I also hope the sound radar is removed and a fully animated cockpit is added I.e. trim wheels etc.

Agree on sound radar, but there is something very atmospheric about approaching a bomber formation and hearing the thunder of their collective engines, so it's not all bad.

Animated cockpit doesn't worry me any where near as much as the mixture and drag though. Plus in programming terms, altering a + to a - and reducing a numeric factor in a calculation would take minutes. Modelling cockpit animations a little longer I think. I'm oversimplifying there of course but I'm sure you understand where I'm coming from.

[svanen]

Ok, thanks for the replys, I will do some more testing. I was able to climb to 15000 feet with +6.5, 50% rad and 2600 rpm, changed to 2400 rpm at 12k, I had mixture fully backwards. After a while I increased the rpm to 2800 and almost instantly got an engine failure.

If I try the same with +11 boost amd mixture fully forward (to get it to run clean) I have a engine failure after a couple of minutes in a climb (keeping speed at 230mph). But the same settings at sea level not climbing I do not get an engine failure. But as soon as I increased rpm to 2800 at sealevel I got an engine failure again.

So the 2600/50 looks like a magic number, good find Dutch!

[svanen]

Ok, thanks IvanK!

[ATAG_Dutch]

Originally Posted by svanen

Ok, thanks IvanK!

Yep. Thanks for jumping in there Ivan!