109 elevator and aileron behaviour with 18301(bugtracker)

[David198502]

honestly i dont see myself in a position where i have to proof something...
ernst ive read your documents, as well as the bugreport about stall behaviour.
that is still no evidence at all...there is still much room for interpretation and what the devs make out of it.

the same goes for this issue.ive read many articles, docs and some books, and pretty much everywhere its stated, that the 109 was a stable gunnery platform. i could now make quotes or paste whole pages of docs or books here, but that still wouldnt be an evidence. there were still too much freedom to interpret something out of it.its up to the devs what they make out of it.

fact is, that nobody complained before about the elevator and aileron controls.now many people do.
fact is, nobody complained about the stall behaviour either of the 109 before the previous beta patch.then they messed it up.
fact is nobody complained about the spit throttle behaviour before the previous beta patch, then they messed it up.

we all know, that with each patch, official or beta, something new got broken, which was okay before.
this and posts like this:

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/newrepl...reply&p=414147

Originally Posted by BlackSix

More correctly: we didn't have official flight tests for Spits and Hurris between 0 and 3000m for this test.
I don't know how our FM programmer made this planes for game in 2011.

make me assume, that there is a big possibility, that this change was maybe unintentional.
and if it was intentional, then the devs should proof whether its more realistic now than it was before, not me....they claim to have the most realistic combat flight sim not me.

if they support this change with hard facts, than i will cope with the new behaviour and adjust my flying style according to it and just have get used to it.then i would be happy, cause im all for realism for both sides, red and blue.
but i doubt, that the devs will give us facts that its more realistic now than it was before.....lets wait and see.
until this happens, i will tell my opinion, because maybe this behaviour is indeed a unintentional bug and the devs dont know about it....
and so far, it seems im not alone with this opinion...

[il_corleone]

i agree whit david, the 109 its hardly to aim now, the plane now just move up and down , and its a exageratiion, a little bit yes, but its like you are inside a tornado!

[Warhound]

I have noticed some "jumping" on the 109 elevator in this patch, similar to how the hurricane handled recently (not flown it enough in this patch to compare or see if the hurri was changed).
At times, out of nowhere, the nose jumps up during small adjustments as if you made a huge input or the trim was set to max "up" in one go.
This doesn't happen on other planes, besides the 109 and possibly still the Hurricane.

Here is the Hurricane issue with video's and all.
http://www.il2bugtracker.com/issues/197

[David198502]

+1
thats exactly what my problem is

but maybe i have just found the actual problem for this(actually it was a squad member who told me to try it),....which could be the source of the problem...

therefore we would need the devs to clarify things though, what exactly they changed in the current patch....however this is what i have tried now, and i feel a difference now...
its up to you guys whether you want to try it or not, but it would be good if some of you would do, as it could serve another bug report...maybe...

-my squad mate told me, to remove the FF folder in:
steam/steamapps/common/il-2 sturmovik cliffs of dover/parts/core

i just removed it to the desktop...

-and to change the entry : FF=1 to FF=0 in the conf.ini file...

this will make you lose force feedback though, but as i have a fighterstick and no forcefeedback anyway, i tried this, and so far it seems to make a difference!aiming seems now again possible...the flight model still feels different to the last patch, but those sudden jumps as warhound described, and what i experienced(which was my actual problem!), seem to be gone!
maybe this is a bug with the forcefeedback files, which possibly affect even non ff-users!?
give it a try chaps and tell me what you experience.

EDIT: ok im not sure if this is working actually,...its too early to confirm this working.ill have to test this further.

[catito14]

Is there any chance that the problem is in the hottas/joy or in the sensitive of these instead in the FM itself??
Because i reseted my x-52 pro after applied the patch and i don´t see difference in the ailerons of the 109.

[yobnaf]

The Bf 109 feels correct and realistic now. Keep up the good work 1C

[5card]

Same here with the 109, I can dive at 700km and the nose is moving around so bad its really hard to get a shot off. It's like when the nose moves to the right a rudder correction to the left does not put the reticle where it should be. Snapshots are very hard now also, nose bounces above and below target.

[skouras]

if its more close to the RL FM i have no problem with that [i doubt]
personally i don't think that RL 109 flying like that at all..
however i don't have problems on flying or shoot down an enemy opponent
i'm using warthog BTW

[David198502]

Originally Posted by catito14

Is there any chance that the problem is in the hottas/joy or in the sensitive of these instead in the FM itself??
Because i reseted my x-52 pro after applied the patch and i don´t see difference in the ailerons of the 109.

well one thing is for sure, its not my joystick.
as soon as i switched back to the official steam version, the problem was gone.it was as well gone when i tried the previous beta, and it was there again as soon as i reinstalled the current beta patch.

regarding the sensitivity,....i have no sensitivity applied neither in any joystick software nor in the game itself.never have and never will...

[catito14]

Originally Posted by David198502

well one thing is for sure, its not my joystick.
as soon as i switched back to the official steam version, the problem was gone.it was as well gone when i tried the previous beta, and it was there again as soon as i reinstalled the current beta patch.

regarding the sensitivity,....i have no sensitivity applied neither in any joystick software nor in the game itself.never have and never will...

Well, then, the 1c guys will need to prove (with historical documents) that this FM is the correct in the BF-109 instead the older one.