Fresh stuff from sukhoi.ru (Discussion)

[philip.ed]

AoA, they say they will finish with it. It's not a finished game by an offliners standards like mine and Kendo's certainly.

There's a big difference. Before you and Force started arguing, my last post corroborated what Kendo just wrote to show that the situation between Il-2 and CloD is quite different.

Here's the original GameSpot review: http://uk.gamespot.com/il-2-sturmovi...eview-2829773/

Now look at CloD's: http://uk.gamespot.com/il-2-sturmovi...eview-6308918/

The score has more than halved. So a sim that scores so low is worthy to proceed with? It's improved since then, but only so that it can run better and look better. The content that's been added is extremely minimal.

This, really, is our point. Unless this sim morphs into the perfect BoB sim with the next patch, the team's position with BoM won't be as tangible as it could have been. I really want BoM to do well. I think the SDK can solve a lot of issues, but you're fooling yourself if you believe that this sim is the finished product.

AoA, this discussion isn't about understanding Luthier's perception on the sequels. Everyone understands that. It's interpreting the situation and seeing how it really compares to the example Luthier uses, of Il-2, to show that actually the similarities are only clear at first glance, but fall apart under careful analysis.

[ACE-OF-ACES]

Originally Posted by philip.ed

There's a big difference. Before you and Force started arguing, my last post corroborated what Kendo just wrote to show that the situation between Il-2 and CloD is quite different.

Again, if you want to change the topic at hand.. Be my guest

But my answer to you delt specifcally with the 'aproach' that 1C took with IL-2 with regards to sequals.. And how Luither said they plan on using the same 'aproach' with CoD

Where each sequal includes the previouse version of the game..

As in all the planes, maps, features, etc.

And the sequal adds to it (planes, maps, features, etc)

Hope that helps!

[philip.ed]

Originally Posted by ACE-OF-ACES

Again, if you want to change the topic at hand.. Be my guest

But my answer to you delt specifcally with the 'aproach' that 1C took with IL-2 with regards to sequals.. And how Luither said they plan on using the same 'aproach' with CoD

Where each sequal includes the previouse version of the game..

As in all the planes, maps, features, etc.

And the sequal adds to it (planes, maps, features, etc)

Hope that helps!

Aye, but the sequel to Il-2 extended the front, whereas BoM is going into new territory.

This thread has been derailed, but I was under the impression we were discussing the future as a whole.

[ACE-OF-ACES]

Originally Posted by philip.ed

Aye, but the sequel to Il-2 extended the front, whereas BoM is going into new territory.

Actually IL-2 sequels broke into new territory too over it's 10+ years..

In that new 'things' were added that did not exist in the original IL-2..

So even that analogy of yours does not apply

But keep digging I am sure you will find something!

But in doing so you will miss the whole point!

That being Luither said 1C's method of providing new features is to re-package the game into a new version (sequel) that includes the previous version of the game while adding new content (planes, maps, features, mission making tools, graphics card support, etc)

As in that is how they did it with IL-2 and that is how they plan on doing it with CoD

Where as other flight sims do it in different ways.. Some like warbirds charge monthly fees, and flight sims like RoF charge you for individual addons (planes, maps, scarf, etc)

At least that was the 'plan' at the time Luiter said it!

Should a large asteroid hit the earth next week I am sure the plan will have to change..

At which point you can rest assured that there will be a hand full of whiners floating in space complaining that the 1C plan for CoD never transpired as originally intended!

[philip.ed]

You miss the point

Forgotten Battles added to the Russian Front and gave it so much more substance. It improved a game that had already received glowing feedback.

This isn't happening with CloD. Moscow is not Britain or France. The point I am making is that for the forseeable future, the Battle of Britain has been abandoned by the dev team. If they were expanding the game to include the BoF and the later Rhubarbs and Circus's, I would agree with everything you are posting in an attempt to prove my posts wrong.

The point I am making is that on relative terms, the future of CloD is only following the same lines as Il-2, but it's not being done identically. If it was identical the next expansion would be in the same theatre of operations, and the team would ensure that theatre actually had some meat.

So keep weasling your way around. You might actually post something that can weigh up to my facts.

[ACE-OF-ACES]

Originally Posted by philip.ed

You miss the point

Hardly.. see following where I prove it

Originally Posted by philip.ed

Forgotten Battles added to the Russian Front and gave it so much more substance. It improved a game that had already received glowing feedback.

This isn't happening with CloD.

omg...

So let me get this straight..

Your saying no sequal to CoD has been produced yet?

DUH!

But when 1C does produce a sequal, in this case the Russian Front, it will surly add more substance (planes, maps, features, updates, etc)

That is the point your missing, that you thought I missed

But keep digging!

I am here with a rope ready to pull you back into reality!

[Force10]

Originally Posted by ACE-OF-ACES

That being Luither said 1C's method of providing new features is to re-package the game into a new version (sequel) that includes the previous version of the game while adding new content (planes, maps, features, mission making tools, graphics card support, etc)

As in that is how they did it with IL-2 and that is how they plan on doing it with CoD

I'm not sure how they can "re-package the game into a new version" when they weren't able to properly "package" the original game into a functioning version. I would think all the talk of sequels and MMO's would have been better announcements if they had waited until they fixed the first game. As it stands right now, not very many are confident they have the chops to fix it and they have done nothing but used stall tactics instead of actually fixing much.

BTW: Nice pic Ace! If you need help learning how to post it properly without the mini thumbnail....let me know.

[ACE-OF-ACES]

Originally Posted by Force10

I'm not sure how

QTF as in understatement of the year

[ElAurens]

I hesitate to wade into this, but I do feel the need to.

Our British friends (and others to be sure, myself included) are bitterly disappointed with CloD, and it is understandable. The Battle of Britain is their touchstone campaign of the entire war, or even of all time really. The RAF is an iconic service to this day because of their actions in the summer of 1940. It is a "sacred" thing and as such the hopes for it's portrayal in the new sim were at an amazingly high level.

Curiously, those of us on this side of the Atlantic had a similar experience with the expectations for the release of Pacific Fighters. The campaign in the Pacific is as "sacred" to us as the BoB is to our British cousins. And we were as let down by it's release as those fretting over CloD are today.

Amazing similarities abound...

Lack of knowledge of the events.

Lack of aircraft types.

Very poor campaigns for off line play.

And in the case of PF, bizarrely chosen maps, and glaring omissions in maps and other areas of content that left gaping holes in gameplay both offline and on.

I won't even get inot the NG issue.

At least CloD has the right map.

So... here we are.

Most of us are not happy to one degree or another.

I suspect that Luthier and the team are not very happy either.

We all have had our pet kicked in the gut by the suits at 1C, who chose to run Oleg off, and release the sim too early, and to add Steam and it's complications at the last minute.

Will beating each other up in the forum fix any of this?

No.

So why keep hammering away at each other like any of us are at fault?

Why?

[Force10]

Originally Posted by ElAurens

Amazing similarities abound...

Lack of knowledge of the events.

Lack of aircraft types.

Very poor campaigns for off line play.

And in the case of PF, bizarrely chosen maps, and glaring omissions in maps and other areas of content that left gaping holes in gameplay both offline and on.

I won't even get inot the NG issue.



Most of us are not happy to one degree or another.



Will beating each other up in the forum fix any of this?

No.

So why keep hammering away at each other like any of us are at fault?

Why?

Everyone understands this except Ace. He has stated in the past that he has got more than his money's worth...so apparently, he's ready to move on. He will continue to bash anyone that would like to play the sim they paid for and get more than an alpha for their money. Ace doesn't understand the value of a finished product, and he is basically the last of the vocal supporters.