Soviet fighters and 4.12

[gaunt1]

Originally Posted by jermin

It's not because I think they are correctly modeled (they never been), but rather if they get rectified, the last active online IL2 community in the world - the Russian one - will be gone.

Interesting. I mainly fly russian planes, but I got bored of them, because everything is too easy. My favourite fighter is the La-5, but its like cheating. And cheating is boring. The germans cant turn, cant climb and cant run. I'd like to "feel" how a real russian fighter fly. I'd like to have more challenge too. OK, you can say that then I should fly german planes. True they are challenging, but I simply dont like the 109 and the 190 at all.

[Jure_502]

Originally Posted by gaunt1

Interesting. I mainly fly russian planes, but I got bored of them, because everything is too easy. My favourite fighter is the La-5, but its like cheating. And cheating is boring. The germans cant turn, cant climb and cant run. I'd like to "feel" how a real russian fighter fly. I'd like to have more challenge too. OK, you can say that then I should fly german planes. True they are challenging, but I simply dont like the 109 and the 190 at all.

+1, I never could fly La-5 and 7 beacuse they felt so easy to fly...too easy. AFAIK russian pilot flying La-5 and others had to use 6 different handles in cockpit to get fighter on full throttle (emergency boost included).

[gaunt1]

Not just the 6 levers. Ingame, the La-5 can outturn any german, allied, and even soviet plane, including the Yak-3! (OK, except the La-7) In RL, the turn performance of the La-5FN was comparable or slightly worse than a 109. Climb rate and acceleration is again exaggerated. The german test report describe these very well. But still, it was an excellent plane.

[omi89]

It would be hard to simulate real historiacal performance..I read interview with WW2 YAK Soviet pilot and he said he never changed prop pitch settings..only throttle to adjust for proper RPM. Im sure this was not SOP in WS ,but that is how many pilots did it. OFC this affected performance, and altough Soviet aircraft were one of the best they often couldnt cope with contempoary German fighters.

[K_Freddie]

As an 99% axis man .. I've never had a problem with any allied aircraft.
It depends what tactics you use, your flying skills and of course.. your Imagination.
All the aircraft are better than than others in certain respects.. one has to use your advantages.

[Luno13]

I'm sure TD is open to revising FM's, but you need to provide or cite quantifiable data. Just saying "X turns too well..." doesn't help much unless you've actually flown in the type German tests of Russian aircraft can be prone to bias: The pilot might not have used the correct settings, the plane may have been a war-weary example with reduced performance, or some top brass fudged things for propaganda, etc. Russian tests of their own aircraft are also biased for similar reasons, but in the other direction. A "reasonable compromise" between all sources might be necessary to make the best FM.

TD have no affiliation with any one country (they are an international volunteer group). Besides, I think Il-2 has a bigger market in the US anyway, so I doubt there's a pandering to Ruskies only.

Also, on the topic of engine reliability: you need to apply this to all aircraft in some form or another. Yaks weren't the only planes with problems. Every engine has to have the potential to suddenly fail (but some more than others).

As for levers, you're never going to see that in Il-2. It's just too much work to apply the same standard for all planes. That's why CloD was released.

Finally, it's important to consider skill and tactics. Now, I'm sure you're all great fliers, but on the Eastern Front, the Russians generally lacked pilot training, discipline, and skill, and didn't use the best tactics, at least at the start. Online, if the team is balanced numerically, I find that on average the skill levels are quite similar. However, there are no tactics employed, and everyone is gunning it out, lone-wolf style. This type of environment is better for Russian aircraft. By using historical situations and tactics, the picture changes.

[IceFire]

Luno is right on the money. FM's can be revised and changed I'm sure... but it's very important to have actual data to support such changes. Even for what may be trivial things... myself and a few others did some pretty difficult research to fix the armament on the Yak-9UT from something totally bonkers to the correct loadouts. We knew generally that they were wrong but in order to do it right, we did the research and found reasonable documentation to support the corrected loadouts and the ammo counts.

With flight modeling it's even harder but if there is solid documentation then gather it up and submit it as a package. Some people have previously said "Well isn't it obvious, the information is out there" and the answer is.. if you want to affect change. Then do some legwork yourself

[DKoor]

Originally Posted by K_Freddie

As an 99% axis man .. I've never had a problem with any allied aircraft.
It depends what tactics you use, your flying skills and of course.. your Imagination.
All the aircraft are better than than others in certain respects.. one has to use your advantages.

+1

Russians except Yak-9U are not a serious match for German late war crates. On most levels encountered in this game in spite of popular belief.

It's just that after some time with this game when I get past turning and circling I learned to appreciate speed and big cannons. With time it felt like cheating especially if you are teamed up with FW guys who use brains.

[IceFire]

Originally Posted by DKoor

+1

Russians except Yak-9U are not a serious match for German late war crates. On most levels encountered in this game in spite of popular belief.

It's just that after some time with this game when I get past turning and circling I learned to appreciate speed and big cannons. With time it felt like cheating especially if you are teamed up with FW guys who use brains.

Bingo. I remember a few good runs in with FW190 crew where we just swept through swarms of Russian fighters in a few online scenarios. Whatever was in front of the group was shot at (and probably blasted to pieces). We never stopped... never turned around or manoeuvred in any meaningful fashion. At least not until we were well out of the battle area and then we swept through again... Late war German aircraft are top level. IRL the Russians just had so many more and the training was good for the Russians at that point and seriously hit and miss for the Germans.

That said... the Yak-9U, the Yak-3, and the La-7 are all top performers but they make a few sacrifices to get there. None of them have the same level of firepower for example. But I do have considerable fun in a Yak-9U showing what it can do... not many pilots have really gotten to know this fighter.