Horton

[ElAurens]

Other than the fact that they are both flying wing type aircraft, comparing the Horten interceptor to the Northrop bomber and claiming that the Horton was somehow better/more stable/etc... makes no sense.

In the fighter/interceptor role, the kind of long frequency yaw translation instability that plagued all flying wings before the advent of computer controls, would never be an issue. In fact I doubt it would have even been detectable through a reflector gun sight at the ranges and with the short time "on target" that a first generation jet interceptor would have on a piston engine bomber.

The simple fact is that the Germans never tried to level bomb with a Go229 from 30000ft, as that is not what it was made for.

Saying the German design is somehow better/more advanced/whatever than the Northop bombers is just the same kind of flag waving, fanboy wishful thinking that proponents of American/Allied aircraft have been constantly accused of over the ten plus years of this simulation.

Was the Go229 a "superplane"? A world beater? I guess we will never know, as it never met a P-80 in combat.

[Bewolf]

Originally Posted by ElAurens

Other than the fact that they are both flying wing type aircraft, comparing the Horten interceptor to the Northrop bomber and claiming that the Horton was somehow better/more stable/etc... makes no sense.

Originally Posted by Bewolf

Northrop was too ambitious in the way they build a huge bomber, which amplifies stability problems.

As such, agreed.

In the fighter/interceptor role, the kind of long frequency yaw translation instability that plagued all flying wings before the advent of computer controls, would never be an issue. In fact I doubt it would have even been detectable through a reflector gun sight at the ranges and with the short time "on target" that a first generation jet interceptor would have on a piston engine bomber.

Small flying wings has the very same problems, just not as pronounced as weith a big wing. Nevertheless it was an issue, especially in the kind of high maneuver dogfighting that still occured at times.

The simple fact is that the Germans never tried to level bomb with a Go229 from 30000ft, as that is not what it was made for.

Saying the German design is somehow better/more advanced/whatever than the Northop bombers is just the same kind of flag waving, fanboy wishful thinking that proponents of American/Allied aircraft have been constantly accused of over the ten plus years of this simulation.

Was the Go229 a "superplane"? A world beater? I guess we will never know, as it never met a P-80 in combat.

The "better" stuff is something you read into here. Nobody claimed that in this debate. As ACE, do not make the mistake to assume ppl debating here take this youtube video at face value. And better then what? There was no other flying wing jet fighter around at that time to compare it to.
The p80 was a great aircraft, but as conventional as an aircraft could get at that time, bar the jet engine and the wing tip fuel tanks later on.

Again, Northrop was a visionary. The Hortens were visionaries. With one big difference in regard to making their military aircraft.
One build a bomber, one a fighter bomber. One, at least from the few documents and sources we have, worked. The other one, however, and that is a documented fact, not.

Nobody ever claimed that the Go229 was a superplane.
It was a highly ambitious and for the time highly advanced aircraft with the pontential to produce a flying wing jet fighter in the 40ies, including some of the features that made flying wings a real possebility in the first place, the tail section in this already mentioned, the wing mounted air brakes to use as Rudder another one.
The Northrop wings of that time period did not have that, instead they tried to solve the problem with horizontal stabilisation.
The modern B2 went the Horten way in this regard, not the original Northrop designs.

Who knows what would have happend if Northrop tried to build a fighter in the 40ies/50ies instead, but they built a bomber, so there is as much speculation in here as to over what the final Go229 production fighter would have been like.

[Sternjaeger II]

The 229 was the sign of how the concept of dogfight was changing: you didn't need something powerful AND manoeuvrable anymore, you needed to take X amount of firepower at Y altitude and at Z speed, make a couple of passes and bugger off.

This imprint will be the signature style of all the interceptors of the 50s and 60s, reaching its apex with the F-104 Starfighter.

[Bewolf]

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II

The 229 was the sign of how the concept of dogfight was changing: you didn't need something powerful AND manoeuvrable anymore, you needed to take X amount of firepower at Y altitude and at Z speed, make a couple of passes and bugger off.

This imprint will be the signature style of all the interceptors of the 50s and 60s, reaching its apex with the F-104 Starfighter.

That was already the case from 1941 onwards, if not earlier.

[Sternjaeger II]

Originally Posted by Bewolf

That was already the case from 1941 onwards, if not earlier.

mmmh I'm not sure about that. Granted that it was the theory, but the manoeuvrability aspect was still very important, maybe the 229 wasn't the first, as things like the Natter and Komet came before, but it definitely shows a different trend from the concept of the conventional propeller driven air superiority aircraft. The advantage of superior speed of jets was the edge they needed really.

[Kodoss]

The XB-35/YB49 had it's outer rudder flaps as air brakes, an evelon (combined aileron/elevator) and trim tabs. Primary controlles were all hydraulic powered to reduce the forces for the pilot.