It's not trolling, it's not the money...

[Insuber]

Originally Posted by Talon89

It's the fact that Oleg et al have over-promised and under-delivered since day one on this thing, we waited for the better part of a decade, and the game *still* seems like a beta.

Meanwhile, the IL2:1946 online community seems to have been decimated by fragmented versions, mods, and the emergence of IL2:Clod.

So we're left with much less than we were say, 4 years ago.

I hope it all works out, but if you like WW2 air combat sims, it seems to me that you would have to be delusional to think that this is a good state of affairs.

Yes, I do have a life, in fact, I've been so busy that I haven't had much time to sim over the past couple of years, so all of this nonsense hasn't affected me a ton. It is kind of sad though, to see what's become of the IL2 series.

Mini-rant aside, I've been wondering -- is Oleg still involved, or has he stepped away from this completely? If he has stepped away completely, that probably explains a lot.

Any one up for creating one of these: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/...2/posts/193810 to get him back? I'm in for $150, I'd prefer donating $150 up front to get his butt in gear than I would paying steam/1C $50 to be annoyed by this current product. If the programmers are doing the best they can, their best is pretty poor. If they're not doing the best they can, that's also pretty poor. Either way, it seems to me that someone needs to come in and kick these guys in the butt.

Reality could be very different from your speculations about Oleg saving the situation.

[Verhängnis]

If Oleg was brought back all we would get is bias, I think a lot of people are glad he has no influence over the series anymore.

[irR4tiOn4L]

Since when is the man who launched the entire series regarded as a bad influence? This is a surprise to me, to hear him spoken of in those terms, when did that happen?

I understand (vaguely) that he had a bit of a russian spin on which aircraft were/were not good. I can speculate that his approach and attention to detail may have delayed CLOD and caused it to be in an unfinished state on release.

But Oleg as introducing bias? That is not the impression of him I recall. I recall him as being a person so intent on realism that he was able to deliver products that were exceptionally detailed and thorough portrayals of WWII air combat among an already fairly realistic and saturated WWII sim market. Bias seems to be something that could be attributed as much to the demands placed by the community each patch, which often seemed more motivated by balance than realism, than to oleg. I still recall the arguments some pushed about .50 cals killing tigers by bouncing shots into their bottom.

[Verhängnis]

What about russian pylons with no weight? I guess that was just game balancing eh? While I don't disagree that he created a brilliant series and is owed due credit for his work on bringing us an amazing combat simulator, he was still biased.

[irR4tiOn4L]

Originally Posted by Verhängnis

What about russian pylons with no weight? I guess that was just game balancing eh? While I don't disagree that he created a brilliant series and is owed due credit for his work on bringing us an amazing combat simulator, he was still biased.

My point was not that he is NOT biased. It's that he is not SO biased that his input is no longer welcome!

Because I still credit him as being the force behind such detailed simulations in the first place.

I should clarify though, that I don't know what bias he has shown in the past. I don't know anything about the issues you speak of. I would like to know, so please enlighten me, but keep in mind that my point was that his leaving should still be regarded as a great loss. You said the series is better off without him. I don't agree.

[Verhängnis]

The modders since discovered that Russian pylons had a weight of 0kg compared to 150kg + for other nations and the Pe-2 has a structural G-limit of 18.

I think they will do fine without him, really there is no reason for him to return. If they can't get their act together and produce a great sim based of over 10 years experience in the market, then they deserve to fail. And I don't think he would have left if he knew his team wasn't up to the challenge.

[irR4tiOn4L]

Originally Posted by Verhängnis

The modders since discovered that Russian pylons had a weight of 0kg compared to 150kg + for other nations and the Pe-2 has a structural G-limit of 18.

I think they will do fine without him, really there is no reason for him to return. If they can't get their act together and produce a great sim based of over 10 years experience in the market, then they deserve to fail. And I don't think he would have left if he knew his team wasn't up to the challenge.

Well now again, I didn't say they WOULDN'T do fine without him. I said that its a pity they no longer have his input and that they weren't better off without him.

As for the Russian pylons, I don't know why that was the case. I can't say it was bias without that.

But again, even if it was - I think we would never have got IL2 or CLoD without Oleg, and I think that kind of person's input is always welcome. Too many other companies and teams, without such a strong lead, would have cut corners a long time ago. It's a bit like Apple and Steve Jobs. Sure, Apple is doing fine without him and in many ways his input was that of an unwelcome autocrat. But ultimately the value of a person like that can only be measured when you consider what might never have been.

[beepee]

Originally Posted by Verhängnis

The modders since discovered that Russian pylons had a weight of 0kg compared to 150kg + for other nations and the Pe-2 has a structural G-limit of 18.

I think they will do fine without him, really there is no reason for him to return. If they can't get their act together and produce a great sim based of over 10 years experience in the market, then they deserve to fail. And I don't think he would have left if he knew his team wasn't up to the challenge.

maybe he left for that reason - who knows-looking at the state of the game that was released!!!