Inaccurate performance data for BOB fighters in COD comparing to RL data

[winny]

Originally Posted by Crumpp

NO, almost every military cycle their units especially during wartime. All units need time to rest, refit, and train as well as perform other administrative duties as required.

You are wrong.

Find me one example of an RAF fighter Squadron that was rested, pulled out of the front line for training, or for 'administration purposes' during the Battle of Britian. The only reason a squadron was 'rested' was because most of the pilots were dead.

They were not being rotated out for the reasons you state. They were moved to another active group. Almost without exception.

Just because you say it happened dosn't mean it did. Read Al Deers account of what hapened to his squadron, or Pete Brothers or Geoff Wellum or Baders, or Lane or Hillary or Viggors or Page or Malan or Townsend or Dundas. I've read them all and none of them were made non operational during the Battle of Britian.

They kept going till they died or broke down.

[Crumpp]

Air Chief Marshal Hugh Dowding had been the driving force behind the development of Britain’s air defences in the immediate pre war period. He had organised and overseen the the integration of radar within the RAF command structure and had championed the development of both the Hurricane and the Spitfire. When war came he had warned Churchill not to lose valuable fighter resources in the defence of France. During the Battle of Britain itself he had carefully managed the fighter Squadrons available and had worked tirelessly to respond to the various changing threats from the Luftwaffe. He had the strategic oversight to see the need for always keeping a proportion of fighters in reserve and the necessity of rotating Squadrons so that some could be ‘rested’ and fresh pilots brought into the battle successively. It was his supreme organisational abilities that put the RAF in the best possible position to combat the Germans.

http://ww2today.com/24th-november-19...d-from-the-raf

It was part of Dowding's strategy to keep all his groups intact as far as possible, rarely committing more than a minority of his force, rotating squadrons regularly but never denuding any one group.

http://www.battleofbritain1940.net/document-21.html

Although squadrons were being rotated around the country, with battered units being withdrawn to the North to rest and the fresher squadrons moving from north to south, the pilots were becoming increasingly worn out.

http://www.raf.mod.uk/history/thebattleofbritain.cfm

Altogether 16 squadrons were withdrawn from 11 Group in the one month between August 8 and September 8, 1940.

http://helena-schrader.com/bob.html

[fruitbat]

Rested in a quieter sector ie not 11 group and withdrawn totally from ops are not the same thing.....

[winny]

Originally Posted by Crumpp

http://ww2today.com/24th-november-19...d-from-the-raf



http://www.battleofbritain1940.net/document-21.html



http://www.raf.mod.uk/history/thebattleofbritain.cfm



http://helena-schrader.com/bob.html

They were moved to other operational Groups! All of them.

Find me a squadron that was moved to a non-operational Airfield.

From memory I think the only squadron that was actually withdrawn was 54 squadron - mainly because nearly everybody was dead! (this is probably why the number of Spitfire Squadrons in 11 group went down by 1 between July and September)

[winny]

Oh and you even missed this - you highlighted the wrong bit..

Although squadrons were being rotated around the country, with battered units being withdrawn to the North to rest and the fresher squadrons moving from north to south, the pilots were becoming increasingly worn out.

Not very well rested then were they?

[Crumpp]

The publication is over-ridden by orders and by leaflets issued by the Air Ministry

That does not have anything to do with new editions of the Operating Notes being published.

You as the operator are always responsible for getting the latest information about your aircraft. It is telling the operator that new Air Ministry orders and leaflets are supplements too that edition of the Operating Notes. The Operator is responsible for keeping his information up to date.

New editions will incorporate all the Air Ministry Order and Leaflets enacted since the previous edition.

Once again...

It is a fact the RAF did not complete conversion to 100 Octane until around January 1940. That is evident in the Operating Notes.

[Crumpp]

They were moved to other operational Groups! All of them.

Winny,

It is a fact Dowding rotated and rested his squadrons. All Groups did not bear the same operational burden.

[fruitbat]

Originally Posted by Crumpp

Winny,

It is a fact Dowding rotated and rested his squadrons. All Groups did not bear the same operational burden.

But they were still on ops, hence why withdrawn and rotated are two different things. 12 and 13 groups still flew ops, no one is arguing that they weren't rotated in and out of 11 group.

[Crumpp]

Rested in a quieter sector ie not 11 group and withdrawn totally from ops are not the same thing.....

It does not matter.

All Groups did not bear the same burden and if only part of your force is using the fuel, I would give it to the guys with largest operational burden.

It is all speculation.

[fruitbat]

Originally Posted by Crumpp

It does not matter.

All Groups did not bear the same burden and if only part of your force is using the fuel, I would give it to the guys with largest operational burden.

I agree with you, and have been saying that from day one in this rather long thread, that it makes sense that 11 group had it over the other groups, as a priority.

But at the start of this thread even that notion was disputed, and clearly even you have to admit, 100 octane fuel was used, and the were spits running around with the potential to go to 12lbs boost, and they were almost certainly in 11 group during the BoB, yes/no?