4.11 General debugging

[Aviar]

Originally Posted by -=MadCat=-

Just noted an issue with the plane list in online missions.

If you add another plane to an already existing plane set, say 5 planes and you add a 6th one, the "new" plane doesn't fall in its usual place in the list.
Instead it gets just added at the end of the list.
In the plane list in FMB it orders just as usual and how everybody is used to, but contrary to that, in the actual mission itself it's as explained at the end of the list.

So far I wasn't able to work arount this, even to the point of stipping the entire plane set and readding the planes again one by one.
I have to admit though, I didn't build the entire mission again from scratch so don't know if that would "fix" it, but highly doubt that would be worth it.
Neither do I know if this is related to 4.11 or was there earlier.

Thx guys

It seems as though Icefire is thinking you mean one thing and I am thinking you mean something totally different. So I am not sure now what you are saying.

Look at the first screenshot on the left. This is an Aircraft list for a coop mission. You can see how the flights are kind of scrambled...not in order. Is this what you are talking about? If so....read on.

If you look in your mis file near the top, you will see the flights listed here:

[Wing]
USA_BG_307z00
15AF_325FG_0HQ00
15AF_325FG_0HQ01
USA_BG_307z01
8AF_056FG_0HQ02
USA_BG_307z02
USA_BG_307z03
15AF_325FG_0HQ02
8AF_056FG_0HQ03
8AF_056FG_0HQ00
15AF_325FG_0HQ03


So, what I have been doing for many years is basically putting this list in the order that I want. You can take this list and make it look like this:

[Wing]
USA_BG_307z00
USA_BG_307z01
USA_BG_307z02
USA_BG_307z03
15AF_325FG_0HQ00
15AF_325FG_0HQ01
15AF_325FG_0HQ02
15AF_325FG_0HQ03
8AF_056FG_0HQ00
8AF_056FG_0HQ02
8AF_056FG_0HQ03


Now, look at the second screenshot. After you make the changes, this is what the Aircraft list in the coop will look like. I'm thinking that is more to your liking.

So the process is simply using Copy/Paste for individual flights and moving them to the position you want. Just be smart and make a copy of the mis file before making any edits. This way you have a backup in case you make any mistakes.

I do hope this has been a help to you. If I got it all wrong...oh well...maybe it will help someone else.

Aviar

[-=MadCat=-]

You're right Aviar !

I indeed forgot to mention I'm talking about DF missions, where you access the plane list via the arming screen.

As mentioned by IceFire, the possibility of the plane limitations causing this, I have missions with either type.
Both resulting in the same behavior to as planes getting added to the bottom of the list (inside the mission itself).
Whereas they fall in place in the FMB just as usual.

It's by far not a major issue but this way, looking for a specific plane, you are required checking in its normal spot and at the bottom of the list.

In addition to this, the line in the conf.ini, for either having the planes sorted as usual or alphabetically, seems to only apply to the QMB but not to online missions (again, just tried DF).
Don't know if it's intendet to work that way or not.

Thx for giving your thoughts on this !

[Phabius]

I don't know if it was mentioned before, but...

In QMB, often there's an aircraft with it's nose stuck in the ground (like it crash landed), since the begining of the mission. If you cicle through enemy planes, there it is. Usually I've seen Bf109s, but today I saw a pink untextured Mosquito. And it was making gun sounds like there were some ground units near it. But it was outside the map area, with nothing nearby. This case was with the Bessarabia map.

Changed the map to Slovakia Summer. The pink untextured Mosquito was still there, but no sounds. Changed to Normandy 1 map, and it was there but with its belly to the ground.

When you reset QMB, and with other configuration of aircraft (both friendly and enemy) strange crashed planes may not appear...

[IceFire]

Originally Posted by -=MadCat=-

You're right Aviar !

I indeed forgot to mention I'm talking about DF missions, where you access the plane list via the arming screen.

As mentioned by IceFire, the possibility of the plane limitations causing this, I have missions with either type.
Both resulting in the same behavior to as planes getting added to the bottom of the list (inside the mission itself).
Whereas they fall in place in the FMB just as usual.

It's by far not a major issue but this way, looking for a specific plane, you are required checking in its normal spot and at the bottom of the list.

In addition to this, the line in the conf.ini, for either having the planes sorted as usual or alphabetically, seems to only apply to the QMB but not to online missions (again, just tried DF).
Don't know if it's intendet to work that way or not.

Thx for giving your thoughts on this !

I wasn't sure if it was the limitations but I had assumed it might be the case. I will do a little more testing on this if I have a moment.

[-=MadCat=-]

Back from some quick tests I just did.

This time I set up a FMB mission with 4 B-29 as "Target Drones" and a Bf110 / Hs 129 for me (both armed with BK 3.7).

Bf110:
Ordered the 4 B-29 to fly a straight path across the map with 400 km/h at 1000m altitude.
Convergence for cannons was set to my usual 400 meters (didnt test other convergences now).

According to Wikipedia the BK 3.7 used in the Ju87 had a muzzle velocity of 780 - 1170 m/s, so I estimated a rough 950m/s (const.) for this test.
For the projectile to cover 400m it takes ~0.42 seconds, where the B-29 covers ~50m. So I took my shots from ~350m distance, primarily aiming for the engines 2 and 3.
Result was the bullets going too low, no hits unless I aimed over the wing or when my aim was sluggish and I didn't keep the plane stable. I took about 30 to 40 shots.
In addition I discovered a pattern, every 3rd shot goes sligtly low but still low, the 2 shots in between go way low.

Hs 129:
Adjusting the bombers' speed to 300 km/h and after taking the moving system into account again, I took my shots from about 360m.
This time aiming for engines 1 and 4.
5 shots 4 dead or burning engines, with the sight right on the engine nacelles. I give that one missed shot to my sluggish aim again.
In total I did about 10 shots with the Hs 129, but it got clear early that the bullets went where I aimed.

I might do more testing when there is more time, but so far my first impression got confirmed.
I even think taking a moving system into the equasion with muzzle velocity, travel time and bla wouldn't be necessary, but hey.

Once time permits and I did more testing on this, I will report further results.
In the mean time, maybe someone else could try some testing too, so we get more results from more than just 1 person.

So far thx all, have a good evening !

[EJGr.Ost_Caspar]

I tried all in a fast rough test at ground targets and recieved very high percentage of hits.
There is some random dispersion, which may influence.

However, it will be looked into. Thanks!

[-=MadCat=-]

Thank you Caspar !

I don't think my tests are the all and end of how to test stuff.
Maybe I'm really missing something or doing something wrong, I'd not take bets that the error isn't on my end.
It's just the the way how well the BK3.7 of the Hs129 alligns with the sight and with the Bf110 I always have the feeling and observe my shots traveling below gunsight center,
that makes me scratch my head.
I just like to point out stuff that I notice, even if this leads to the confirmation that all's right the way it is and it's just me at the end having trouble aiming with the BK3.7.

Thank you all, you do a marvelous job !

[Aviar]

Just wanted to report a small issue with the Do-335A-0.

I've seen them on fire until the end of a mission and they never explode. In the screenshot you will see one where the pilot has already ejected. I watched this one burn for a good 20 minutes until the mission was ended.

Aviar

[SPAD-1949]

Originally Posted by Aviar

Just wanted to report a small issue with the Do-335A-0.
I've seen them on fire until the end of a mission and they never explode. In the screenshot you will see one where the pilot has already ejected. I watched this one burn for a good 20 minutes until the mission was ended.

But others explode very fast and the sphere of ejected debris is large.
Dont let a I-16 or a Mig3 fill the reticle when you shoot. Prepare for the chute, if you do.

[jermin]

The slipball of Bf-109s from G6-Late up to K4 C3 won't be centered until their airspeed reached 640 km/h. Historically, the rudder trim tab of Bf-109s should be trimmed for coordinated cruise at 400 km/h.