water cannon

[winny]

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II

Uh?! When did I say that?

You said about the rioters "What kind of low life scum idiot does what we saw happening? Someone we surely won't miss." Why would we miss them? Where did they go? The implication was shoot them.
You also said about robbers "If I get attacked by 6 robbers what shall I do? Put up a fight? I don't see the outcome of such a scenario as a positive one, unless you're Chuck Norris." Implying that if you had a gun (the subject about which we are talking) the outcome would be different. So unless they are attacking you in your house, you'd need to have that firearm in your possesion, in public. Which has nothing to do with your 'more explicit regulations' one of which was safe storage.

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II

yes, of course

So now you're calling me a liar?

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II

it was based on what you said: "I don't vote".

I didn't vote for anyone.
You assumed it was out of lazyness, which is lazy thinking.

[Sternjaeger II]

Originally Posted by winny

You said about the rioters "What kind of low life scum idiot does what we saw happening? Someone we surely won't miss." Why would we miss them? Where did they go? The implication was shoot them.

What?! It's your assumption! IF they get arrested and put in the slammer, I won't miss them.

You also said about robbers "If I get attacked by 6 robbers what shall I do? Put up a fight? I don't see the outcome of such a scenario as a positive one, unless you're Chuck Norris." Implying that if you had a gun (the subject about which we are talking) the outcome would be different.

..erm, Chuck Norris the man who kicks all a$$es, the internet joke about him being the ultimate a$$ kicker? The idea that anybody could have a gun is a deterrent, not shooting people in the face. You really have a distorted view of gun ownership.

So unless they are attacking you in your house, you'd need to have that firearm in your possesion, in public. Which has nothing to do with your 'more explicit regulations' one of which was safe storage.

You're nitpicking. It's not about whether I have a gun with me or not, but the potential, which would keep criminals far from me and my household. Don't think of me for a minute (I know you're obsessed), try and think of a lonely woman, who's physically weaker than a man on average, how's she supposed to defend herself in case of an attack? By talking herself out of it?

So now you're calling me a liar?

You said it, I called you other stuff.. besides what's this "so you're calling me this or that" bull? What are we, in primary school?

I didn't vote for anyone.
You assumed it was out of lazyness, which is lazy thinking.

if you don't go to vote you're lazy, if you go and deliver a blank vote then you're not. You are telling me that you haven't missed one election since you've been eligible to vote and you always delivered blanks?

[winny]

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II

What?! It's your assumption! IF they get arrested and put in the slammer, I won't miss them.

And how is locking rioters up relevant to a discussion on gun control?

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II

..erm, Chuck Norris the man who kicks all a$$es, the internet joke about him being the ultimate a$$ kicker? The idea that anybody could have a gun is a deterrent, not shooting people in the face. You really have a distorted view of gun ownership.

No you used it as an example not me. If you were attacked by 6 robbers on the street what would happen?

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II

You're nitpicking. It's not about whether I have a gun with me or not, but the potential, which would keep criminals far from me and my household. Don't think of me for a minute (I know you're obsessed), try and think of a lonely woman, who's physically weaker than a man on average, how's she supposed to defend herself in case of an attack? By talking herself out of it?

What? Obsessed, I thought I was standing my ground in an argument? So we're arming single ladies now? Do they fit your own set of criteria as a responsible gun owners? How do the robbers know you've got a gun? How can something unknown be a deterrant. The crime figures in the USA don't support the deterrant argument. There are still roberies and buglaries.

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II

You said it, I called you other stuff.. besides what's this "so you're calling me this or that" bull? What are we, in primary school?

Yeah, but I'm not lying. And your coment was ambiguous, I was clearing it up.
Are you?

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II

if you don't go to vote you're lazy, if you go and deliver a blank vote then you're not. You are telling me that you haven't missed one election since you've been eligible to vote and you always delivered blanks?

Nope voted first time, and second, it's the last 3 times I spoiled. Not that it has anything to do with you.

So, who are we arming and where can they have a gun in their possesion according to your rules? Which you contradict when it suits you.

[BadAim]

I just have to ask the question. Beowolf, Whinny and anyone else who may want to answer, why should you not be allowed to be armed? I know the answer, I just wonder if you know.

[baronWastelan]

Originally Posted by winny

The crime figures in the USA don't support the deterrant argument. There are still roberies and buglaries.

FYI the laws aren't uniform throughout the USA. Tell us what the rate of robberies is in jurisdictions where the State law allows citizens to arm themselves for self defense.

[winny]

Originally Posted by baronWastelan

FYI the laws aren't uniform throughout the USA. Tell us what the rate of robberies is in jurisdictions where the State law allows citizens to arm themselves for self defense.

I know. I also know that in those particular states robberies in occupied homes are practically zero. But, USA has the 3rd highest number of fatal Shootings in the world - so you have 2 sides of the same problem. I was generalising.

There's no perfect solution.

EDIT: I do have the figures, by state, for roberies and assaults involving firearms, but I'm lost when it comes to the laws. Name a state and I'll tell you the figure.

[robtek]

USA might have the 3rd highest number of fatal shootings, but i could bet, that of those shootings, the majority didn't happen where guns are allowed!

[winny]

Originally Posted by robtek

USA might have the 3rd highest number of fatal shootings, but i could bet, that of those shootings, the majority didn't happen where guns are allowed!

California has the highest number of firearms murders.

Figures from the FBI.
First number is total murders, second number is total firearms murders, sorry about the format. (2009)

Alabama 318 229
Alaska 22 13
Arizona 328 197
Arkansas 171 107
California 1972 1360
Colorado 167 94
Connecticut 107 70
Delaware 41 31
D/OColumbia 144 113
Georgia 543 378
Hawaii 21 8
Idaho 22 5
Illinois3 479 386
Indiana 293 209
Iowa 34 11
Kansas 118 85
Kentucky 170 112
Louisiana 486 402
Maine 26 11
Maryland 438 305
Massachus's 169 93
Michigan 625 437
Minnesota 72 38
Mississippi 151 105
Missouri 381 276
Montana 28 19
Nebraska 40 23
Nevada 156 91
New Hamps 10 4
New Jersey 319 220
New Mexico 144 78
New York 779 481
North Carolin' 480 335
North Dakota 9 3
Ohio 502 311
Oklahoma 225 125
Oregon 83 41
Pennsylvania 658 468
Rhode Island 31 18
South Carolina 286 197
South Dakota 11 4
Tennessee 461 295
Texas 1325 862
Utah 37 25
Vermont 7 0
Virginia 347 229
Washington 169 101
West Virginia 76 38
Wisconsin 144 95
Wyoming 11 8

There are no figures for Florida. I don't know the individual state laws so I can't comment on which ones have strict laws and what that tranlates to.