Very Confused about the Filter and Fix Please Help :) ???

[15JG52_Brauer]

Originally Posted by BobTuck

Most of what I have said is informed and not rumour, because it has come directly from various posts that Luthier has made about the issue, usually on russian forums.

BobTuck.

fair enough - but can you quantify the impacct? what do the visual changes look like? Is it really 10 fps hit, or more/lss? How does it impact a high/mid/low end machine? Until those questions are answered the impact is all just based on hresay and rumour - I want quantifiable facts which the devs should be able to supply - if they don't know these things how can they fix it?

[Kikuchiyo]

Originally Posted by 15JG52_Brauer

fair enough - but can you quantify the impacct? what do the visual changes look like? Is it really 10 fps hit, or more/lss? How does it impact a high/mid/low end machine? Until those questions are answered the impact is all just based on hresay and rumour - I want quantifiable facts which the devs should be able to supply - if they don't know these things how can they fix it?

I'm more curious if there is any commonality in the systems that are experiencing problems. I.E. Using Nvidia/ATI, Intel/AMD, DDR3/DDR2 memory, etc. or is it completely random. We seem to be seeing people having few issues in mid to low range systems, but larger numbers of people with issues with upper end systems. I am just trying to figure out if there is some commonality at this point.

[BobTuck]

Originally Posted by 15JG52_Brauer

fair enough - but can you quantify the impacct?

Well, put it this way, it makes enough of an impact to get Luthier to make repeated posts about it, and to promise to the Russian audience that the mechanism will be removed for them.

Any filter that does pre-screening calculations by comparing screen with screen has got to add unwanted extra load, and Luthier admits that this is a quick and dirty way of tackling the issue.

By the way, I am all for supporting the devs through this, and I have still got my western CE version pre-ordered.

BobTuck.

[Biggs]

Originally Posted by 15JG52_Brauer

fair enough - but can you quantify the impacct? what do the visual changes look like? Is it really 10 fps hit, or more/lss? How does it impact a high/mid/low end machine? Until those questions are answered the impact is all just based on hresay and rumour - I want quantifiable facts which the devs should be able to supply - if they don't know these things how can they fix it?

No he cant quantify the impact because there shouldn't be any negative "impact"... Tuck is purely peculating.

(im going to paste what i posted in another thread about this)

"Where does it say that the "fixed" version is going to be some visually altered version from the "untainted" Russian one?

Think about it... The filter thats on the game does everything that is needed to make it "epilepsy" compliant. But it kills the cpu, therefore must be done away with.

When they go in and make it "epilepsy compliant" without the filter it should look exactly the same as it does WITH the filter..."

[swiss]

Originally Posted by Biggs

When they go in and make it "epilepsy compliant" without the filter it should look exactly the same as it does WITH the filter..."

If it did - why would I need the filter in the first place?

It was one of Luthiers earlier posts, maybe even a translated one, can't remember..

[Biggs]

Originally Posted by swiss

If it did - why would I need the filter in the first place?

It was one of Luthiers earlier posts, maybe even a translated one, can't remember..

because they ran out of time... throwing the filter on was the only way they were able to make it compliant in time for the release.

you have to remember, this was not planned... they didnt want to put the filter on originally.. this was a stop-gap-quick-fix to something they were already trying to do "by hand" if you will...

[BobTuck]

Originally Posted by Biggs

No he cant quantify the impact because there shouldn't be any negative "impact"... Tuck is purely peculating.

(im going to paste what i posted in another thread about this)

"Where does it say that the "fixed" version is going to be some visually altered version from the "untainted" Russian one?

Think about it... The filter thats on the game does everything that is needed to make it "epilepsy" compliant. But it kills the cpu, therefore must be done away with.

When they go in and make it "epilepsy compliant" without the filter it should look exactly the same as it does WITH the filter..."

I'm not speculating at all, this is what Luthier says...

"The main protivopripadochnaya shell, which is above everything that was done two weeks ago, the total despair. It compares each previous frame with each frame and compares the brightness of the pixel by pixel, and if it is too large, averaging pixels to give pleasing epileptic-limits. This crap brakes at the ground, and does not work with cards SLI. Off with her we can not yet make it optional, too, can not yet."

and...

"This is what the team will work in the coming days:

1. Anti-epilepsy will once and forever banished from the Russian version of the game. This adds up to 10 fps on older machines. You now can manually disable the filter - the instructions were given repeatedly."

and...

"Filter solves the large number of different outbreaks. Change and check them one by one - work for many weeks and even months.

Remove the filter on the western version can only when individually fixed all flash and no longer need the filter."

and...

" You can not imagine how much blood has spoiled us this epilepsy over the past three months. For all those usilisya that we spent on it, you can write a little new game.

We hope to resolve these issues within days rather than weeks.

Exactly say that epilepsy always poporchenny propellers. Rotate them to the murder rate and transparency of their wildly high, and this fix will not let us."

and...

"It is difficult, it is not connected to the filter. From the international version of exactly the kind of remove, and whether it is possible to keep the propellers in two different versions, I just can not say. Likely that he will remain as is."

see the original threads in the sukhoi forum here:
http://translate.google.co.uk/transl...803%26page%3D2



BobTuck.

[Biggs]

But you see Tuck, you are speculating... Or rather misunderstanding what Luthier is saying.

When he says individually fixing the flashed he mean going in and program it out by hand rather than using the filter....

The filter is just a big clumsy thing that does the SAME job as what the programmer was trying to do but just in a Quick and very innecficient way...hence Luthier calling it a "stop-gap" measure, and is why they are goig to remove it.

They arent going to make the game any worse looking. They are just goingto do what he filter is already doing, just without the hit on the frame rate.

We are talking about pixels here...

[BobTuck]

I know what you are saying Biggs, and I agree that the filter is a temporary measure that kills FPS, but they must have to make a visual change, to subdue the flash effect (so that epileptic people are unaffected). I also read somewhere that the rotational effect of the propellers can affect epileptics.

Guns and explosions produce flash, unfortunately for the sim, and if there was no overall change to be made, then there would be no issue and no filter at all.

I just wish that we could have the sim as originally intended, and I'm quite sure that the devs share that sentiment (Luthier described it as a 'damn feature')

BobTuck.

p.s. this has just been posted, where someone asks Luthier concerning the changes to propeller visuals (note the suggestion of removal of shimmer from western version), and the improbability of an unofficial 'leaked' fix:

Guys with epilepsy we wildly ticklish situation. Epilepsy is fraught with the court. The court is fraught with huge fines. Giant fines fraught closing the studio forever.
The court may not care where the code came out, especially if it can be traced back to us. Even if it is completely unofficial mod, and it may haunt us.
Understand that the "bourgeois stuff 'type of epilepsy are not on tupizny and zverstvovanya, but from self-preservation instinct in vexatious culture - which is also a non-frivolous reasons but as dosatochno well-functioning self-protection of society from unscrupulous manufacturers.
This all may be a little strange and ridiculous from the standpoint of Russian culture, but the danger is real, and we have no means to look for trouble and tempting fate."

p.p.s. I think Luthier is saying here that you can't activate a Russian version outside of Russian area:

See above about Canada - as well, and you've already answered Peace, my direct supervisor. We hope to solve once the problem in the future.
So you know, Russian and English versions are in the neighborhood under one address to the incentive, so there are all sorts of idiosyncrasies as we contract them to keep apart. If it had not been in the neighborhood, everything would be much easier with some small but - two versions would be incompatible network

[Sutts]

I can't begin to describe how upset I am about all this. How can you have realistic explosions and muzzle flash without flashes? How about the sun flashing through the framing of the canopy as you turn? How about the quickly changing contrast of sky and land as you roll your aircraft? Flight sims NEED this contrast in order to properly simulate the environment.

The international version will be totally screwed over....be sure.