Poll regarding Steam users

[Blackdog_kt]

Originally Posted by Comrade_Mike

Is a community custom made solution really going to work better than what steam has to offer in the way of server browsers and multiplayer tools? i'm not convinced it will. hyperlobby is good, but it's not even close to the convenience of a good in-game browser.

modding support doesn't have to be mutually exclusive with steam. Mount and Blade have an epic modding community and excellent support for it in the game itself.

is cracking a game and setting up work-arounds really less of a hassle than having steam running while you play a game? or do you just want to satisfy your convictions without missing out on the game?

assuming of course that the extra sales they'll get from the anti-steam elitists will exceed the cost for setting up two different versions of the game.

steam is a bit more polished than hyperlobby, which came around primarily due to the lack of any alternatives.

i wont be, but then again, my actions aren't dictated by childish convictions. i have better things to do than spend my weekends patching and cracking games i legally bought, let alone having to fire up the game everytime i want to join a friggen server FFS. i really can't see people rushing from a perfectly functioning platform to a community-made one.

You seem to think i'm going by conviction alone while in reality it's a matter of simple preference and not having to deal with something that upsets my habits. The game is already able to interface with 3rd party multiplayer tools so yes, i do believe that a minimalist custom-made server browser that's specifically geared towards a flight sim and not much else is a very valid option for a lot of people. I don't mind one bit what the majority will use, as long as there's a small minority to justify its development and use i'm switching to that. People who don't like one won't have to use it and can stick with Steam's features, so it's all good.

This will depend a lot on how the in-game front-end is implemented: if all we get is a list of server names with their ping values i'm switching to something that shows a few more things, like which realism settings are in use and so on (aka Hyperlobby or something similar).

My comment on the modding community was not meant to say that mods don't work on steam. What i meant to say was that due to their higher % of disapproval i expect them to provide a steam disabling mod at some point.

As for the rest, i find that taking the time once in a while to bypass anything that potentially causes me trouble is worth my while: it stays disabled and i can focus on enjoying the game without distractions.

Of course your mileage may vary and you don't have to agree with me, just like i don't have to agree with you
What you say in your post is your personal opinion and you are perfectly entitled to one. Your reasoning is valid for you and how you want to use this piece of entertainment software, others will disagree and try to find workarounds to suit themselves.

Edit: As for the cost of having a non-steam version, there is none. If there was any cost in the matter it probably goes the other way around, since we know straight from the horse's mouth that steam integration was done very recently and work hours were spent to integrate something that was pretty much an afterthought and a decision from "above". The game didn't have anything related to steam until a 1-2 months ago, maybe even less. Maybe you should think about labeling us elitists when it's clear that it's some among the pro-steam crowd who are so eager to force their preferences on everyone and not the either way around. I don't care how you guys play your games, i just want a choice on how to play mine and there's nothing elitist about that

[Mick]

Blackdog, you have no idea how much I agree with you

I have no idea what Steam does or doesn't on a PC, I just don't want it simply because I don't NEED it to play CoD, which as you said, wasn't designed with Steam embeded in it right from the start but very recently ...

I just would like to BUY CoD and opt out of Steam ...

[MadBlaster]

Steam is lame spyware imo. I understand having to go through Steam to validate my DVD purchase. If that means I have to have an account with them to get the validation done, so be it. But beyond that initial validation, I do mind. I would much rather download the patches myself than put spyware on my machine. Having it do whatever it does in the background, or getting spammed with Valve e-mails everyday to buy more games...why would I want that???

Also, I am worried about the online gameplay experience under Steam. As it is now, I only like flying WoP server. They make good historical type missions, the server is moderated for following the rules and the players don't suck. And if I don't want to go through Hyperlobby for some reason, I can always just put in the IP address in the game directly and it connects. I guess we won't be able to do that anymore??? I have a bad feeling that playing online on Steam server will become a 128 player furball.

Anyway, I still waiting to find out technical stuff like Freetrack capability, how many cores it will run on so I know what chip to buy...etc. So, my CoD purchase is on hold for now until this stuff gets cleared up.

[David603]

Originally Posted by MadBlaster

Steam is lame spyware imo. I understand having to go through Steam to validate my DVD purchase. If that means I have to have an account with them to get the validation done, so be it. But beyond that initial validation, I do mind. I would much rather download the patches myself than put spyware on my machine. Having it do whatever it does in the background, or getting spammed with Valve e-mails everyday to buy more games...why would I want that???

I don't get emails from Valve, did you somehow sign up for them when you made your Steam account?

Also, I am worried about the online gameplay experience under Steam. As it is now, I only like flying WoP server. They make good historical type missions, the server is moderated for following the rules and the players don't suck. And if I don't want to go through Hyperlobby for some reason, I can always just put in the IP address in the game directly and it connects. I guess we won't be able to do that anymore??? I have a bad feeling that playing online on Steam server will become a 128 player furball.

Why? It will mostly be the same people running servers and creating missions, Steam is replacing Hyperlobby, not hosting the servers itself.

[Moggy]

I'm going to stick tin foil on my head, disconnect from the internet as Valve is trying to take over the global economy via my pc and steam...probably. Go live in a cave somewhere, put my fingers in my ears, shut my eyes really tightly and whine some more about conspiracies (the Cornwall conspiracy is my favourite) which don't really exist but in my mind they do.
IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD PEOPLE, CAN'T YOU SEE IT?

Either that or grow a beard and buy an Apple Mac as you can't run anything remotely bad on 1 of those beauties.

Oh and btw, I've never received any emails from Valve\Steam with any offers except to tell me when I've bought something. They must not like me or something.

[MadBlaster]

Originally Posted by Moggy

I'm going to stick tin foil on my head, disconnect from the internet as Valve is trying to take over the global economy via my pc and steam...probably. Go live in a cave somewhere, put my fingers in my ears, shut my eyes really tightly and whine some more about conspiracies (the Cornwall conspiracy is my favourite) which don't really exist but in my mind they do.
IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD PEOPLE, CAN'T YOU SEE IT?

Either that or grow a beard and buy an Apple Mac as you can't run anything remotely bad on 1 of those beauties.

Oh and btw, I've never received any emails from Valve\Steam with any offers except to tell me when I've bought something. They must not like me or something.

Actually, I'm sure they like you a lot since you are buying games through them. I wonder why that it is??? What's next??? Spend $800 on a stupid warthog??? Sucker!!!

[lwlooz]

Hello,

I don't know where the logical disconnect here is.
Especially considering Blackdog_kt makes such excellent posts explaining the situation.

Why are all the Steam fans / Valve fundamentalists / Valve employees so annoyed at people wanting to have a Steam-free version?

Would this stop you from using Steam? Not it would not.

Would you not like for Maddox to get additional sales from people that do not want Steam for whatever reason?

What personal disadvantage would you have if while you have a Steamworks-Version of CoD , someone else has a Steamworks-free version of it?

I simply can not understand why consumers would be against having more choice. It does not hurt you at all. It also does not hurt Maddox , for they would get additional sales.

As for the technical aspects. As pointed out , from the news we have Steamworks is not at all needed for the game. All it brings are unecessary social features as the DRM is covered by SolidShield.
Also Bohemia Interactive can for some reason ship Arma2 with Steam and without it. Do you think Maddox are not technically able to do so?

Can't we stop going in circles with people pointing that out only to have Steam-fans reply with "Old grandpas, steam saves PC gaming yo! Luddite nutjobs,I buy all my games on steam".
I have no problem with people using steam or steamworks , but that just doesn't make sense and people pointed out several times why making Steam optional has nothing to do with any of that.

This is not about being against STEAM , but for making STEAM optional

[Blackdog_kt]

Originally Posted by MadBlaster

Steam is lame spyware imo. I understand having to go through Steam to validate my DVD purchase. If that means I have to have an account with them to get the validation done, so be it. But beyond that initial validation, I do mind. I would much rather download the patches myself than put spyware on my machine. Having it do whatever it does in the background, or getting spammed with Valve e-mails everyday to buy more games...why would I want that???

Also, I am worried about the online gameplay experience under Steam. As it is now, I only like flying WoP server. They make good historical type missions, the server is moderated for following the rules and the players don't suck. And if I don't want to go through Hyperlobby for some reason, I can always just put in the IP address in the game directly and it connects. I guess we won't be able to do that anymore??? I have a bad feeling that playing online on Steam server will become a 128 player furball.

Anyway, I still waiting to find out technical stuff like Freetrack capability, how many cores it will run on so I know what chip to buy...etc. So, my CoD purchase is on hold for now until this stuff gets cleared up.

Well, you are certainly entitled to your opinion, but being overly aggressive usually detracts from our arguments. I too would like a non-steam version, but i don't think steam is lame spyware.

It's a delivery platform that has certain benefits for certain gaming genres and people with certain gaming habits, in return for the drawbacks of specific infringements on certain consumer rights and their EULA might even be illegal in certain countries, but i wouldn't go as far as calling it downright spyware.

What i'm trying to say here is, let's try to be calm and make a clear case of our point so that people who like it can keep using it and the rest of us can get an option to opt out of it in the near future

[Comrade_Mike]

Originally Posted by Blackdog_kt

snip

that all seems fair enough. the quality of most of the anti-steam wingefest posts here really just seem childish and pathetic. as for your concerns, i highly doubt there will actually be a void that will need to be filled by something like hyperlobby, and yes, in principle, steam should be optional. in reality they must have their reasons for making it mandatory.

[Blackdog_kt]

Originally Posted by Les

They should release the game in such a form that it only requires SolidShield activation for online or off-line use.

But the default built-in multi-player browser should still be linked to Steam, so that you require a Steam account to use those default built-in multi-player features.

That way, anyone can play off-line with or without installing Steam, and play online with or without installing Steam, though not using Steam would require connecting to a server via direct ip or by using a third-party browser.

Anyone see a problem with that?

SolidShield for DRM online activation, Steam registration for optional use of the default built-in multi-player browser.

Patches and extra content released through Steam and through the traditional channels.

I can't see any technical issues with that, and in terms of reaching your greatest potential audience and market, it's a better solution than what's been proposed so far. In my case, I'd buy a Steam version and a stand-alone version, as that's what I originally intended to do before all this bs blew up.

If you agree with this proposed solution give me some feedback in this thread, as it might be worth making a one-sided poll just to put some more solid numbers up on the board and perhaps make UBI/1C aware of the situation that's developed around this issue.

That's what i've been bitching about all the while, excellent solution that keeps everybody happy

Not to mention that it's also going to benefit the steam users if we have separate versions, because of what Fritz X accurately points out:

Originally Posted by Fritz X

What I don't really like is the thought of this game using Steam and the Solid Shield DRM. I'm pretty sure they have their reasons to do so, but afterall Steam performs pretty well as a DRM itself. Yes, of course games can be copied illegally on there too, but I doubt that Solid Shield is gonna be fully working, too. And how badly the gaming experience can turn out if two different systems (Steam and GFWL in this case) are used at once players of "Dawn of War II" and its' first expansion "Chaos Rising" might still remember...

The current situation will be equally cumbersome both for non-users and fans of Steam: they are forcing the copy protection i'm more comfortable with on the steam users and vice versa, when we could have an option to choose during installation. I think battlefield bad company did it this way? Players were presented with a choice when installing, one time online activation or disc in the drive to run the game.