Friday 2010-10-01 Dev. update and Discussion

[philip.ed]

Freycinet, you neglect the fact that our views on how the sim should look are largely based around current models/sims. IMO, if SoW is to achieve graphically it should be the best in all departments (I'm focusing on graphics here) whilst your post sounds great, it is flawed in this sense.
For example, the current terrain doesn't look as good as RoF (or WoP although this is debateable). It may look different at Oleg's end, but from the shots shown to us that's my opinion. The grass and objects are completely different, they blew me away, but from a distance the terrain lacks realism IMO. I think this is due to the contrast of the tree colour with the texture colour, but also because the textures look quite low-res. I agree with the clouds; but whilst the texture may not need to be changed, the model of the clouds (IMO) is wrong, and based around my scientific evidence this is true. Editing the model should not be too much of a job I don't think, and in any case should not impact on FPS.
I think the FPS issue is a good point, but clearly in SoW it's the FM and DM models which will be limiting fps, as from what you've said they'll be impacting on the eye-candy available

An interesting concept; no doubt about that!

[Freycinet]

Most of the above posting was unintelligible to me, but I think I understood the last phrase:

Originally Posted by philip.ed

I think the FPS issue is a good point, but clearly in SoW it's the FM and DM models which will be limiting fps, as from what you've said they'll be impacting on the eye-candy available

I think there are some basic issues about making a flight sim that you don't understand.

Every single element of the sim takes processor cycles and therefore impacts FPS.

Rendering textures is one thing, FM, DM are other things, and several calculations and processes "under the hood" such as AI impact the fps as well. If we all had Craig supercomputers we could just pile it on, but we don't and we can't.

[philip.ed]

That's exactly what I meant! SoW seems so advanced, that it will probably limit how high we can turn the graphics up. My point is, the terrain we've seen looks worse than RoF, so if this is as high as we can turn it up without limiting the amount of planes etc then IMO this will mean that (in the short term) certain aspects of the game may not live up to everyone's expectations.
Of course, this may not be 100% true (as most of the game is still being worked on and will be post-release) so of course the terrain is by no means final. The same goes for the clouds too.

[Azimech]

I won't mind playing with settings at minimal if I can enjoy full functionality, FM and DM. Someday I'll build a new PC.

At worst it will probably look like IL2.

[Chivas]

Originally Posted by philip.ed

That's exactly what I meant! SoW seems so advanced, that it will probably limit how high we can turn the graphics up. My point is, the terrain we've seen looks worse than RoF, so if this is as high as we can turn it up without limiting the amount of planes etc then IMO this will mean that (in the short term) certain aspects of the game may not live up to everyone's expectations.
Of course, this may not be 100% true (as most of the game is still being worked on and will be post-release) so of course the terrain is by no means final. The same goes for the clouds too.

Personally I have no doubt that the SOW terrain will be far superior to the ROF and WOP terrain even though SOW is developing a much larger area. Just the fact that SOW terrain will have elevated riverbanks will make a huge difference to the overall look of the terrrain. We haven't seen a few terrain and cloud features because of bugs yet to be ironed out.

[MD_Titus]

Originally Posted by Sutts

Sorry but I can't see why a simulation needs a feature like this. Flying around like this will just lead to bad habits and folk will never learn to operate with an engine in the way. I think it would be better in Over-G fighters or something like that.

People will be asking to see through clouds and hills next.

Just my opinion of course.

thankfully
with the overlay of instruments it will mean that the one handicap for open pit flyers is removed - the lack of instrumentation.
people play this game for fun, and i would hate to dictate to people that they have to only have my kind of fun.

Originally Posted by Richie

It's funny I've been flying full real for years. When a subject like this comes up I think who will care but Spit VS 109s isn't the only server in Hyperlobby is it.

exactly. there's a lot of open pit players out there. and quite a lot of them have flown those settings for years, because that is what they get fun out of.

Originally Posted by Qpassa

You should always fly with full real, maybe with speed bar but no icons and and always cockpit enabled, no external views

why? if folk want to fly open pit and labels visible for 15km, who are you to say that it's wrong? with externals you can appreciate the models of the planes, the skins of other players the terrain at angles that you would otherwise only see very fleetingly just before you disintegrate...

the snobbishness of closed pit flyers is sometimes breathtaking.

Originally Posted by Baron

On the transparent cockpit issue.

Its not everyones job here to make sure new players play the game the "right" way, it is however Olegs job to make sure as many "newbies" as possible buys SoW and more importantly, sticks with it.

yep.

[Fafnir_6]

Originally Posted by MD_Titus

the snobbishness of closed pit flyers is sometimes breathtaking.

+1 I use the "closed 'pit" but I can appreciate the challenges faced by newbies, since I have trained a number of them. I find training works best when you can slowly ramp up the difficulty to full real.

Cheers,

Fafnir_6

[robtek]

Originally Posted by MD_Titus

thankfully
......the snobbishness of closed pit flyers is sometimes breathtaking.

Well, the ability to fight well in a closed cockpit is hard earned!
One should be able to be proud of a achievement and not get called a snob for that!!!
Everybody has the same problems in a closed pit, really no reason to elevate those who go the easy way!

[Fafnir_6]

Originally Posted by robtek

Well, the ability to fight well in a closed cockpit is hard earned!
One should be able to be proud of a achievement and not get called a snob for that!!!
Everybody has the same problems in a closed pit, really no reason to elevate those who go the easy way!

Pride can easily turn into arrogance. I agree that your pride is justified but please don't put down those who are at an earlier stage of their development as a virtual fighter pilot. This coming from someone who also flies fullreal but wishes to avoid negativity.

Cheers,

Fafnir_6

[philip.ed]

Originally Posted by Chivas

Personally I have no doubt that the SOW terrain will be far superior to the ROF and WOP terrain even though SOW is developing a much larger area. Just the fact that SOW terrain will have elevated riverbanks will make a huge difference to the overall look of the terrrain. We haven't seen a few terrain and cloud features because of bugs yet to be ironed out.

Well said