The Blue Sun Mod

[Xiola]

Kyle, no offence but I think you are expecting alittle too much of this game You are testing things which are really too complex for this game in which you were meant to get jobs and complete them.

The conquering thing isnt even really worth doing, its just a money drain.

The campaign is the real aim to the game, not conquering cities, unless its a specific quest.

NPC's never pick up weapons on the floor, or at least I have never seen it happen yet, unless its their weapon that was shot out of their hand.

I dont think there is a way to be sure that you steathily enter a city, its just chance as to where the enemies are located.

[Kyle]

Xiola,

Part of the problem with the questions that I ask about the mod is that I have never played through the game even once, with or without a mod. That puts me at a disadvantage when trying to think through in-game issues. R@S is aware of this, as I informed him of it right at the front of our PM exchanges to one another.

I appreciate your response though, as it infers to me what the game engine "was" and "was not" designed to do, although I think it's fair to say that the game was released in a state with a lot of potential "wases" not being finished, or ironed out in regards to having bugs removed, leaving a number of features as "almosts," if you get my meaning. I also think that it's safe to say that R@S has done a lot to take a number of the "almosts" and made them "almost theres," which is a boon for us players.

Who knows, maybe one of my questions will lead him to think of a new approach, and before you know it, he'll have tugged out another miracle from the title.

My plan, unless R@S should inform me otherwise, is that with the next release, is to stay strictly to the missions till most, if not all of them, are completed. Then I'll go around conquering territories. It should help a lot that I'll have a full squad by then, with access to an enormous amount of resources.

And in regards to AI picking up weapons after they've lost their's... I'm 95% sure that I've seen police pickup weapons that weren't initially their own, for example, changing up from a shotgun to a MP5.

[R@S]

Entering hostile cities
There are several ways to do this, you can wear enemy uniforms and they wont turn hostile directly and that gives you a few seconds to clear the immediate area. Or you could rush for cover, it's what I usually does. Try entering through the spawn point nearest to the hospital, that buildings gives you many options. You can go inside, up on the roof or use the corners to wait out the enemy, the aim-at-point function will save you in those situations.

If you want to use dark as cover, the time between 00 and 03 is the most effective.

Militia will be "grown" if your funding is big enough, but it takes time. How fast depends on reputation and how much funding your militia has. I dunno how many militia men you can have in a city, I've had 200 when I set the funding to max and waited a few weeks. There is however a limit to how many militias there can be in a loaded city, which is 35, all else is regarded as patrols that will attack the city if an enemy patrol captures your city.

The AI doesn't pick up weapons the player drops, but it does pick up weapons fallen comrades drop and I think also their enemies' weapons.

[Vader]

nsc and enemys pick up any weapon, i have seen that for sure. and if i am not misttaken it is writen down in the booklet of the game as a warning...

as for conquering hostile cities:

i have done so out of mischief or amusement numerous times.
here are some of my strategies:
first find a secure area where you have good sight but your oponent doesent. meaning in short house fights!!!!
the KI is to dumb and also you get much better work out of grenades when fighting inside...
to do so i try to get my squad generaly inside a bar. the bars are all built the same. i position only my team on the ground lvl because when it gets to achieving unrealistic headshots the enemy is alwas better... and on the first floor the oponent can only see your head when you are crouching...
on the groundfloor i position mostly two soldiers at the rear entrance facing the door and being not seen through any windows. normaly windows are not seethrouable by the enemy but the get smashed sometimes...
one soldier is locatet at the toilet as backup for my other soldier located in the main bar room. if i got more soldiers than i put them in the Corridor that leads outside the main bar room. the guy in the main room is my char, also my main fighter. after every one is in their position and secure i await the incoming enemy. they will! get into a sloughterhouse. works always infailable.
after the initial wave of suiciders is drained he (main char) gets out hunting. i prefer silenced weapons for this. all german weapons (HK XY) are good for that early in the game. if you face more than one enemy together be sure to kill firstly the one thats facing you with a claer headshot. the other one wont be bewildered most times, also if he is alarmed then he still has to turn around and thats costing allot time for him...

one a side note: if posssible and my weaponry allows for it: a fight in a hostile city is far easier if you are on your own. the more mebers you have in your team the more you have to control. so if you plan to attack a hostile city then go alone. and as r@s says save often^^

hope i could help.....

[Xiola]

Thats reallyt interesting, Vader, as my strategy is completely the opposite.

I try and engage the enemy at long range using fast auto snipers or assualt rifles.

Each of my team has a pistol,mp5 or P90, an assualt rifle such as the tavour or HK416 6.8mm and a fast firing sniper such as the g36 sniper version(forget its name) it has a to ready of .31 and accuaracy of 71.

I try and pin the enemy down with my assualt rifles while my snipers aim their shots and fire. Seems to work good for me

I like having 6 team members as it gives me more options in a fire fight.

I hate indoor fights at close range as I always seem to get caught by grenades

[Vader]

for sniper weaponry i strongly recomend the range of stefan uribe from cali cantinos. he has a silenced 7,62 and a russian equivalent sniper rifle all silenced and rather quick. i have to give it to you that the sniper g36 is the fastest siper rifel in the game, but since this cant be equiped with a silencer it is pretty useless in the game. since every enemy (regardless Fighter or thug) has a gps spotter and nightsight and a radio to get alarmed instantly when someone is loudly inhumed, giving a clear shot unsilenced is tantamount to alarming the whole crew of his fellows...
but when you aim and shot a silenced weapon then eaven in the night you can switch off sometimes four or more enemies on one spot. my favort weapon for this is the norinco (7,62) it has but a capacity of 10 rounds but the are well placed and deadly as hell. she had about 85% accouracy, and that is as i recal the best silenced one in the game...

[Kyle]

Interesting feedback on addressing hostile towns. I'm happy to see that there is a time of night that's superior than others when attempting to use concealment to the maximum.

Also useful is the interesting tidbit that a location can have 200+ units assigned to it, but that only 35 will appear when a map's reloaded. The others are "patrolling" in the region, which is a clever explanation for the engine's limitations.

Thank you all for the feedback.

I too use the interiors for most of my engagements, but since so many of the enterable structures are identical, it starts to feel sort of like a rail-shooter. I want to be able to utilize the inside and the outside simultaneously, but the AI seem to have the eyes of a hawk and simultaneous communications with one another. As was mentioned earlier, if an AI isn't killed immediately, it seems as if all of his buddies know exactly where you are.

R@S, do you think that it would be possible to supply some extra entry points to the maps? I'm thinking about having them located in areas where it's more unlikely for AI to automatically spot the squad. Too many of them are located RIGHT UNDERNEATH STREET LIGHTS, and who, in their right mind, would decide to infiltrate there?

For example, Porto Viejo could have additional entry points at:
1) either end of the beach since the squad entered by walking along the shoreline
2) in a dark alleyway, since the squad negotiated itself through the city by deliberately staying on the routes with the least lighting
3) or, for a sizable amount of money, a NPC could be supplied near a bar who will see to it that the squad is smuggled into a region in the back of a truck. If a map has a number of trucks present, then an entry point can be assigned near the tailgate of a truck, and to make this even more interesting, this entry point could be randomly assigned to wherever trucks are parked.
4) Perhaps supply one-three randomized entry points at ideal locations, such as a park with heavy foliage and nearby walls.
5) Entry points available near sewer grates (if there are sewer grates available, I can't recall right now if they are).

And so on and so forth.

Anything that avoids having just the entry points where they are now would be an improvement. In my opinion, the default entry points are just too obvious.

[R@S]

Originally Posted by Vader

when someone is loudly inhumed

Do we have yet another reader of our dear and beloved Terry Pratchett in our midst? And one that has also discovered the joy of reading his books in English, with all the puns and play with words

Kyle
I feel that adding more spawn points, ones that gives you cover, would make the game too easy. As it is now there is a random element when you enter a town, and that causes you to alter your tactics accordingly. If you have a safe place you'd use the same tactic all the time and the game would become tedious after a while. I want the game to continue to be challenging, forcing you to try different tactics and evolve ones you already use, that way the game never gets boring.

But there could be a compromise. When working on the Field Radio I discovered that I could add a spy to the game. You could use that spy by sending him to enemy cities, and through the radio you could find out how many enemy defenders the city has. This spy could be used to "smuggle" you into a city for a fee. But I fear it would be too easily exploited and I would have to add a hefty cost to prevent it. I'd have to think about it further.