Friday 2010-06-17 Dev. update and Discussion Thread

[IceFire]

Never seen any software that did actual real time object deformation in that way. Virtually all games use tricks to change out one object for another that shows damage.

[SaQSoN]

It is possible to bent objects visually in real time, no problem. One would need to create so called "bones", each bone - is unbendable virtual object, to which vertexes from visual 3D object are assigned. Each vertex may be assigned to several different bones. While bones may be connected to each other under certain law. Move a bone - and attached to that bone vertexes will shift, visually bending the surface. Theoretically, one may create a set of bones for each structural element of airframe and bent it in any way he wants. The more bones - the more resources they eat, offcourse.

But from physical point of view (i.e. FM-wise), it hardly would have any sense. Or, to make it have sense, one would split physical model to the same number of fragments, as the number of bones in visual model and calculate all physics (aerodynamics, strength, etc.) for each of them. Which again quickly consumes calculation power of the computer. So, basically, such fidelity is far more then redundant for a game.

It is enough to have physical model split to a several dozens of fragments, for which the DM/FM calculated and respective to them visual parts with several state of "pre-modeled" damage, like you see on screenshot.

[JVM]

In any case the propeller will bend only on contact with ground/water, and it happens very fast (I saw it myself, more than once in real time), so fast that a two state modelling will simulate it well enough.
Fine tuning would be to add a model with only one blade bent, and a model with two blades bent (if 3 blades or more) to account for landings with a stopped engine.
Also the bent shape will not be the same for a fully solid propeller and a hollow core propeller; to finish wooden blade propeller and plastic propeller blades disintegrate but do not bend (no surprise there!)...

JV

[SaQSoN]

Originally Posted by JVM

In any case the propeller will bend only on contact with ground/water, and it happens very fast (I saw it myself, more than once in real time), so fast that a two state modelling will simulate it well enough.

This is true for an explossion, or brake apart damage.

Originally Posted by JVM

Fine tuning would be to add a model with only one blade bent, and a model with two blades bent (if 3 blades or more) to account for landings with a stopped engine.

What for? It is enough to make each blade a separate damageable object and change state for only damaged blades (damaged in physical model), leaving the other ones intact.

Originally Posted by JVM

Also the bent shape will not be the same for a fully solid propeller and a hollow core propeller; to finish wooden blade propeller and plastic propeller blades disintegrate but do not bend (no surprise there!)...

Since visual damage is pre-modeled by designers, it's up to them, to learn what the blades (or any other AC parts) were made of and model damage according to the material and damage conditions.

You should understand, that visual damage and physical damage are like two different worlds, with the later being actually invisible to a player, while the first one serves as visual representation of it.

[JVM]

Oh, I understand...but visibly some modellers were not completely aware of the finer details of the structure of what they were modelling...and Damage Modelling is an art which goes far beyond 3D modelling...a bit closer to aeronautical engineer, maybe?

[SaQSoN]

Originally Posted by JVM

Oh, I understand...but visibly some modellers were not completely aware of the finer details of the structure of what they were modelling...and Damage Modelling is an art which goes far beyond 3D modelling...a bit closer to aeronautical engineer, maybe?

To my knowledge, on all SoW:BoB models visual damage is modeled respectively to the materials the damaged parts were made of in RL and to their physical properties. Besides, some of the 1C modelers are former aviation industry engineers with experience in airframe design and material strength. So, they know very well, how materials in general and airframes of different design in particular behave/look like under damage.

So, here I wouldn't worry. Within the general game limitations the visual damage will be modeled as close, as possible to the RL and, certainly, will depict the physical damage modeling with the highest possible fidelity.

[nearmiss]

Several very nice improvements

Trees are placed next to the edges of the roads and streams.

This is so much an improvement over Il2.

Will ground vehicles be able to travel over countryside, passing around obstructions?

Can boats travel up and down waterways?

Is artillery now able to shoot over hills and obstructions?

Is artillery shooting distance comparable to actual distance?

[Foo'bar]

Originally Posted by IceFire

Never seen any software that did actual real time object deformation in that way. Virtually all games use tricks to change out one object for another that shows damage.

Remember the antennas of the armored vehicles Oleg has shown us recently. They bend actually.

[philip.ed]

Doesn't RoF incorporate some bending features....?

[ElAurens]

Originally Posted by philip.ed

Doesn't RoF incorporate some bending features....?

I have to laugh.

ROF doesn't even get crashes modeled correctly, in the least.

And now with neoqb being forced out in favor of takeover by 777 Studios, I believe that ROF is in it's last days.