experienced 110pilots here?
 

hey guys!since the release of COD i almost flew exclusively the 109 variants, with a few exceptions now and then.so i got really confident with the handling of them...
now i want to discover the 110...
i already made a few flights with it and even tried some dogfights with it.
but i just cannot get it faster than 400kph in level flight and as soon as proceed wide turns or shallow climbs, it looses speed pretty fast....
so its really hard to fight even the stupid AI in cliffs of dover with that crate.
i would like to use it online as well after i got used to it, but somehow i already see myself ditching in the channel attempting it.i cannot see how one can win a fight against a human flown spit or hurri, if the oponent is aware of your presence.

so i ask for every possible advice regarding the handling,operating limits,manouvers and just everything about the 110...


i would really appreciate every advice by experienced 110 pilots..thx in advance

As the LW found out in 1940...
I have not spent much time in the 110, in CoD I have a feeling it is not as good as it should be.

Two points.

1. In the real deal, the 110 was meat on the table for any single seater fighter. Goering's lot deployed it stupidly as a long range escort.

2. In the current state of the sim the only aircraft that hits it's "real world" performance numbers is the Spit IIa. So don't expect any aircraft other than that to fly to it's proper potential.


Cardinal Blggles... the third point!!!

Given pilots of equal talent in the sim, the Bf 110 is a death trap, and it should be against real fighters.

I have seem 110ers handing their ar**s to human-flown Spit 5s (piloted not always by newcomers) in old IL2. The magic word is team work. You need two to three proficient 110 drivers to bag a spit.

And I think it should manage to make more than 400. I will research data and make some trial flights (I have not spent much time in the 110).

But be aware: the 110 is not a fighter and you never ever should go into a turn fight with a single engine fighter that is about or nearly as fast as you. Always attack with a altitude advantage and avoid turning. After a pass on the enemy try to climb back to altitude (no sharp climb, no sharp turn), circle widely and reposition for a second pass. If the enemy has gained altitude and the difference is perhaps less than 500m I would say to call it a day and leave. This as starters. You have to find out at which altitude difference you still can keep the upper hand so trial and error.

What Stormcrow said. Flying the 110 requires a lot of patience, it's seriously not a plane you want to bring into a dogfight. Speed is of the essence. The 110 is not a slow bird, in reality it was between the Spitfire and the Hurricane speedwise, which is not at all bad for an aircraft this size. In a way you have to treat the 110 like a 190, high speed boom and zoom maneuvers, making its devastating firepower count. It's like a two hander, incredible cumbersome and easily dodged, but when it hits, then it hits. This should also be reflected when flying it, making very wide turns and loops to not bleed energy at all. Hit and run tactics works best.

As was said already, the 110 is most effective in teamwork. But it also works as a solo plane if you keep your speed up, have some altitutde to play with and never, ever get sucked into a turning fight.

All that said, if flown right, the 110 can be really rewarding, even more so once it gets the M-shell. Diving down on an opponent and shredding him to bits at first pass is kinmda satisfying, to say the least. And there is no substitute when it comes to bomber hunting.

Well, I still have to find out how to shred planes to pieces with the M-shells.

I spend a lot o time in the 110 on the ATAG server, i use it mainly as a strike aircraft. It is great with a couple of 500kg bombs under it for skip bombing ships, and low level strikes on airfields ect. With the righ prop pitch, rad, and cooler settings, plus well trimmed she is good for 420kph on the deck, a d about 440kph minus the bombs. She is basically a one hit wonder when it comes to taking on fighters, you either get them on the first pass or you just keep her pegged and keep going, even boom and zoom is not a great option 1 on 1 because once they know you are there it is pretty easy to avoid you on a firing pass, and you will very soon be out of energy and a sitting duck. The key is keep it fast it bleeds speed and energy like a pig. I love flying the thing, it is a great challenge to get results, and make it home on a busy server !

Craig

Right convergence range in the 109. It is interesting to notice, btw, that I regulary rip of wings from aircraft with the M-shell but one, the Spitfire, which appears to have quite some deltawood build into the main spar. Never, ever have I seen a Spit lose a wing. Managed to remove the tail, however, so it's not all lost. That said, in the 110 so far it is mostly the 4 machine guns doing most of the work. If you get half a second time on the enemy fuselage you have the opponent out of the fight, if not going down in flames.

P.S: as we are at it, anybody knows how to skip and low level bomb online in the 110? I think I used every single bomb fuse setting available but those buggers simply won't explode when dropped below 750 meters.

with the low level fuse ( that is set fix to 14sec IIRC), it works very well.

Hm, will try that again then and report back.

interesting

At high speed the 110 can handle a fair amount of G to be looked at seriously. Of course it's a big plane so it will bleed E much faster, but for a snap shot it works well.

I regularly use her to CAP england coast at 5K with some modest success against fighters. No pilot lost so far I think. With a classical B&Z approach, you're doing the job right.

However the concrete Spit wing is still a mystery for me aswell. You can poor whatever possible she wld still hold into that fuselage and provide lift just as on its first day (and that's nonreciprocal of course old Oleg)

Yup the SC500 type III, with the C-25 type fuse set at 14 seconds works great low level, I rarely fly the 110 at more than 100m altitude, usually at mast top height except for when popping up to acquire a target area. Skip bombing ships takes 1x 500 bomb and they go down, I come in flat out at deck height, and release as soon as the bow and stern touch either side of the reflector sight glass, then you have about 2 seconds to pop up over the ships mast and back down to line up on your next ship!

Craig

So, just managed to sink 3 ships, a bit of experimentation still required, however. Funny that only the 500kg works this way, I usually only use 250kgs, so that explains a lot.

@Tomcat, yeah, since they fixed the 110s highspeed problems it's quite descent in dives. Still requires lots of patience to fly successfully, but I just managed to get a couple kills without being killed. Enemy target fixation helps of course, hehe.

I was flying 110's last night on ATAG and killed couple of spits.

I did discover that I could out accelerate a spit in a dive with low fuel tanks. I think fuel weight is a big factor in this plane. I would want to engage a fighter with as little fuel as possible. And as the other guys have said only attack with the E advantage, one or two passes and then run! I was not sure if I could escape but I easily out ran the spits in a dive with empty tanks.

You got so much fire power and ammo and no convergence so you can go for difficult long range snap shots with a chance of hitting em.

Very challenging plane really :cool:

Just subscribing for now. I definitely want to be involved in this thread.

Not much time as I am about to shut the computer off for the night but I want to put this little nugget out there. Starting sometime in the near future my squad will be allowing me access to a training server where I can help pilots learn to love and fight with the 110 in online combat. I also hope to come away with a couple new wingmen as well.

See y'all in the skies.

-Klein

well that sounds great!if its possible i would sign up!

thx for all the replies...i already now that one should avoid dogfights and tight turns with the 110 against the british fighters.i usually avoid it even when in a 109, and would never try with a 110.
as someone said that in reality the 110's speed was between the hurri and the spit, in game its certainly behind both and can be easily outrunned by them....so i think its almost impossible to survive as soon as your oponent is aware of your presence.
-if you try to run, they will gain vicinity on you, sooner or later
-if you turn, they will reach you even more quickly


while i am pretty successful with the 109 online, i dont consider myself ready for the that challenge with the 110 yet, because i dont know all the procedures to handle this aircraft correctly yet.
i dont know which systems are controlled automatically and which have to be influenced by the pilot.for example i dont even know if you have to manipulate the mixture by oneself or if its adjusted automatically.
i still have to find out how the fuel tanks are working.
yesterday i pushed the one-axis-autopilot button and ended in the channel.
i also find that that the engine(although its supposed to be the same as the 109's?) seems to overheat pretty quickly.the healthy ata pressure levels are at about 1,2 ata, which seems pretty low.does it have WEP?


i would really like to master this plane, as it seems to be a big challenge for me.and therefore a kill and making it back home would be really statisfying.


...so keep the advices coming guys!!!

Actually, I'd be more then up to it myself, having a bit of fun with the 110 and exchanging ideas can't hurt. Maybe I can even learn another trick or two, so sign me up!

Time to show those 109fires what real men are made of, heh heh heh.

Actually, if you manage the 110 correctly you can squeeze quite a bit of speed out of her. Enough to keep Spits and Hurricanes at bay as long as they don't enter the fight with a large energy advantage to begin with.

The secret here is perfect trimming, and I mean "perfect" trimming in all axis. If you then also use air and oil radiator at 50 percent max you can keep and hold her at around 440, which is enough to demotivate most pilots in holding up their chase and requires perfect aircraft set-up of them as well. In my expirience only few Pilots take it to the extreme and given enough distance it provides enough time to get back to France and with a bit of luck assistance by others.

Unlike your expirience I also consider the 110 a very forgiving aircraft in regards to throttle and pitch settings, certainly more forgiving then a 109.

thats interesting, cause i have no problems to shred off a spitfire's wing with the E4...sure it doesnt loose its wings as easy as the hurri does, but it still happens quite often when i shoot at spits....though i have to commit, that while playing offline, i had much more of those incidents than playing online.

FYI, it takes only 2 x SC50 to sink a tanker, so with a 109/b you can take out 2 ships skip bombing.

So for the 110 i always take 2 SC250 against ships with the low-level fuse and the SC500's only against ground targets.

40% fuel is enough for 40min, so thats what i take for a short hop over the channel.

For speed keep your rpms low, pp around 10:00 o'clock after accelerating, watch for the markings 1', 30' and d at the ata and rpm instruments.

My usual attack profile on the atag-server is: low level (<100m) to the ships, attacking two in one run, extend out of the vicinity,

check for pursuit: yes -> homeward, keeping the speed up. no -> shallow climb over englands back country to 5000 m and loitering for targets.

250KG low level never worked for me online. Spot on towards the rest, pretty in line in regards to my own tactics, with a bit of airfield supression thrown in between when boredom gets the better of me. Mostly rather short lived, however, lol.

you guys really manage to get 440kph out of the 110 in real level flight??

if thats really possible i have to practise a lot...
i trim the 110 as often as i can, but is it possible to trim the ailerons as well?up till now, i have only trimmed the rudder and the elevators

It's possible to trim ailerons, but should not be nessecary.

The trick really is a combination of low fuel, perfect trimming (constant trimming while accelerating helps), low drag radiator profile, no maneuvers and a bit of a descent in the beginning to get up to speed, then holding it. If you do it right Spits and Hurries will have a very very hard time catching you, if at all.

This is for a plane without bombs, of course.

will try and practise a lot then...

what about the rpms and ata values...?
i usually try to maintain 2200-2300rpm with a prop pitch of about 10 o clock,radiators as much closed as possible and the same with oil rads.

Yup, rudder trim has to be spot on, 400kg fuel, 10.20 pitch, 1/3 oil cooler open, and about 2/3 rad open, 440kph is easy achieved, and you can run like that all day without damaging things.

Craig

ok will try it...

btw, how do the fuel tanks work??

Love low level bombing of the airfields as well. On one sortie last week I came screaming over hawking at about 50 meters, I spied 2 spits running up their engines at one end of the field, I lined up between then and toggled my 2 x 500's, with a couple of seconds between them. One of the spit pilots RAAF SNIPER I think it was latter told me on coms that he saw both the bombs release and skid along the ground before digging in between the spits, he sat there and watched them for another few seconds before the world went black ;) fantastic fun, would love to have seen it from his perspective!

Craig

The following thread pretty much explains it all:

http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthr...ight=fuel+tank

Full throttle with pitch in in the 2200, 2300 range works best, imho. As trumps already stated, with this setup at max speed you can fly as long your fuel lasts without fear of overheating. Half radiators suffice in this setup, but make sure you keep up that speed.

Haha, combine that with the sounds in this game now and a 110 approaching at high velocity and that must have truly been a sight to behold :D

When i "skip-bomb" i actually score direct hits, i believe, as i release at a altitude between 5m and 10m when the target fills the screen.

Important then, is to give the bombs time to leave the racks before taking action to avoid the ship.

S!

I (nor my squadmates) have had any trouble in getting the sc250 to explode with the low level fuse. I drive the bomb to the target with a shallow dive, releasing at about 100m from the target. I love the 110 action now as it doesn't do the "rodeo" anymore :)

Sadly it feels like the rear gunner is a waste of space, he barely manages to scratch pursuing aircraft

The way I see it is that if the rear gunner gets an opportunity to fire then I am pretty much in a world of sheet and will soon be dangling from a chute if lucky. If he gets no gunnery practice then I am doing ok ;)

Craig

True on the one hand. Then on the other, when the sheet hits the fan, it would be nice to have one option more. Unlucky most of the times the rear gunner does not even bother to deploy the gun :D

Gents

I love the 110...cantankerous beast! And I agree with everything said up stairs.

One of my tips...Set the Gyro! that will keep the reflector sight G centered.

Im part of a "Jabo" squad, we've developed tactics for Il2, based on heavy , AI rear gunner, aircraft (IE 110, 410, stukas). As said above, elemental, or team tactics, are the key to success, when you get into the thick of things.
Unfortunately, Ive haven't found the AI rears to be predictably dependable also.
Therefor, defensive elemental tactics, from IL2, have had to be adapted.
Slowly were adapting to live rears. Just the idiosyncrasies, of having someone "flying" backwards, as been a riot!!! (left/port, just isnt the same anymore lol)

Moxy

The Gyro will keep the reflector G centered? What is the connection?

I really would like to know, how and why this should work.

Not really sure why its working this way
but if you don't set the gyro,(at least my experience) turn hard, off goes the reticule to never land.
Set the gyro, and it acts properly.
Moxy

BULLSHIT.

Try reading the facts instead of the allied propaganda.

Also tell that to Oktoberfest, and the old 110 squad on IL2 46, or to the 17000 110s that survived WWII intact(the highest survival rate of any aircraft in WWII).

Flown CORRECTLY the 110 is a deathtrap....to single engine fighters. :evil:

S!

Had quite a good fight against a Spitfire in my Bf110C-7. He managed to get in a shot or two, but I hit him too so he later crashed after disengaging. My gunner was admiring scenery once again and did not fire a shot :( Bf110C is underrated..with speed it is not that bad :)

Where the hell are those fellow gone ?

Pls can we get details on tht nbr ? I will be interested to know more

Bf110
 

Hello Bf110 pilots,

Having a lot of fun with the twin engine planes in CLOD, yeah, even the Blenheim. Although the scope of action in the Bf110 is greater than the Blenny. My basic 110 mission is to skip-bomb (2x250lb) a ship then extend back to France and intercept bombers if I can find them.

I must say the Bf110 is luxury after flying the Blenheim!

At this stage my Bf110 tactic is to avoid single engine planes unless I get a chance to boom and zoom (like one pass!). I have maintained around 410-20 kmh in level flight and think other posters who mention higher speeds are on the money. I have not figured out just how far I can close down the oil rad and air rad at this stage.

When diving I get the rough shaking feedback, yet are way below max dive speed. Any clues there?

The AI gunner is a bit of a loser, doesn't seem to do much even if a Spit is right on your tail, presume the default gunner is a rookie. In the FMB I think you can set the gunner's skill rating - rookie ... ace. Would be a nice addition to the Bf110 game if there was some way to increase your AI gunner's skill with missions flown/survived, air gunner school, etc.

Will subscribe to the thread and if I can join some training would be interested in doing so (timezone permitting). Usually fly in the ATAG server.

nachtjagers with advanced radar having a high survival rate ... good thing im seated.

as a day time fighter the 110 proved to be quite vulnerable. that isn't to say it wasn't a good platform but it was no match for single seat fighters.

the biggest failing though was they were forced to fly close escort. had goering not been a total moron he would have employed the 110s as hunter killer escorts screening well in front of and ahead of the he-111s attacking the hurricanes and spits before they had a chance to out position the incoming bombers.

then had the 109s clean up anything that got through.

the 210/410 industrial failure did help them to stay on the front ;)

Hmm? I thought the problems were sorted out with the 210C?

lack of engines and failure of the zestroyer as a concept were the only problems with the 210/410. apart from the initial instability problems of the 210 of course.

the brits had the right idea with the mosquito. recon, pathfinding, light/fast bombing, night fighting ... these are the realm of the small (relative to wellingtons 111s etc) 2 engine plane not air superiority.

Yeah ... latte in 1943 with only 2000 ex painfully built until the war ends ;)

You hve to put that in perspective to the 35000 109 and 20000+ 190 built

Production of the 110 were ordered down as early as 1941 if I remind well :!:

By the way I had to crash land a 110 online and what a bast ! Superb graphics and animation. Interminable ground slide with one wing ripped-of (but no sound)... I am stunned, bluffed and deeply expect the next occasion :D . Oh sry if my right wing obscured the runway as it was left there even after my plane respawn

Ah kay, so you guys talk not about the plane itself, but the environment it was used within.