The real IL2 focus group (Everyone come in here)

[Saturat]

it is a bit strange to have controls for trim in a sim but at the same time no black/red-out!
Personally I dont' care too much at this point, just let me play!
And dont get too upset about it; its too late to make changes to the code at this point.
(I guess) it has gone 'gold' allready and being tested at microsoft/sony - if they want to reach september launch.

[jt_medina]

Anton you are making a BIG mistake.
This is an important feature. You take it out, don´t call it simulator.

[Kartman013]

Oh well, perhaps next time. At least we are moving in the right direction and getting a potentially amazing flight sim for consoles.

[Anton Yudintsev]

Originally Posted by jt_medina

Anton you are making a BIG mistake.
This is an important feature. You take it out, don´t call it simulator.

I suppose, there are now a lot of flight sims on a market, and everyone of othem (except ours), has red-outs?

I've never called the game anyhow, except IL-2 Sturmovik:Birds of Prey.
We are making it, you are voting for it - with your money, and your (possible) loyalty. If it is so important for you - OK, do not even try demo. Or, buy the game, and vote for blackouts in this (and others) polls - than we'll make it in sequel.

But my guess is that this feature is not what make flight sim game a real simulation. Flight sim - by definition - is the simulation of the flight, of the plane dynamics - not of the pilot's body reaction to it. Should 'real' flightsim simulate vomit on a spins as well?

[juz1]

Originally Posted by Anton Yudintsev

I suppose, there are now a lot of flight sims on a market, and everyone of othem (except ours), has red-outs?

I've never called the game anyhow, except IL-2 Sturmovik:Birds of Prey.
We are making it, you are voting for it - with your money, and your (possible) loyalty. If it is so important for you - OK, do not even try demo. Or, buy the game, and vote for blackouts in this (and others) polls - than we'll make it in sequel.

But my guess is that this feature is not what make flight sim game a real simulation. Flight sim - by definition - is the simulation of the flight, of the plane dynamics - not of the pilot's body reaction to it. Should 'real' flightsim simulate vomit on a spins as well?

The point being vomit, unless it really flies up and covers your googles, wouldn't hinder flying...black/red outs and the ensuing slight loss of stick control would interfer with extreme maneouvres and consequently handling...but there are times a combat pilot would risk it in extremis. It would add to gameplay...
Just sayin...
________
Gm foods

[Yossarian]

It's not a deal breaker for me. I am going to buy the game, I would have liked to see blackouts in, but after what Anton said about publisher pressure to not include a sim mode at all I will count myself lucky to have this game with any kind of sim mode, it is more about the flight model than anything else for me.

There some strange choices for sim campaign mode, unlimited ammo, fuel and no blackouts but it's not a deal breaker compared to what other flying games there are for consoles.

Also from reading Anton's comments it looks as if people with different difficulty settings can play in the same server, so us blacking out would give us a serious disadvantage online.

[Raw Kryptonite]

Don't let them get to you Anton.
You've seen on the forum here that there's always something being complained about, and it's always "the end of the world" if things don't go a certain way.

I remember a couple of pilots on Dogfights episodes saying they pulled 9 g's and didn't even notice in the heat of the fight. That's pretty much at the point the plane breaks up.

[Anton Yudintsev]

Originally Posted by Yossarian

There some strange choices for sim campaign mode, unlimited ammo, fuel and no blackouts but it's not a deal breaker compared to what other flying games there are for consoles.

1. In single missions, you can customize it yourself and play with limited resources if you want to.
In campaign, that would require us to make two different campaigns - one with limited resources, the other with unlimited. Two is not only twice more work, but actually confusing player - is he finished Campaign, if he had finished it in Arcade mode? Or he will have other missions in Simuation? Who's cooler - the one who finished on Arcade, Realistic and Simulation or the one who finished only once, but with limited ammo? Etc, etc. Keep it simple: Single missions - are hardcore enough, and can be played with limnited resources. Campaign - is more fun, less realistic and can't be played on limited ammo.
2. Blackouts/redouts are not technical characteristics of the plane. It is something related to pilot body, and can't be 'simulated' accurately. Moreover, red/black-outs (blood going to/out brain) is not just something red/black in the eyes. It is physical condition of the pilot. It affects his ability to react, to make decisions. It is something that can't be simulated on a TV screen.
What game can do, is only indicate that, probably in a real life, trained pilot would have red/black-out. (Most of gamers are not in such good shape and so well trained as real pilots were, and would suffer from redouts on smaller forces.) But in any case, your actions and reaction speed won't be really affected by redout.
The same goes to vomite in a spin.

[Anton Yudintsev]

Originally Posted by juz1

It would add to gameplay...
Just sayin...

I understand the reasons.
Once again, we made this feature. We've just decided to cross it out off the game, for certain reasons.

[jt_medina]

Originally Posted by Anton Yudintsev

I suppose, there are now a lot of flight sims on a market, and everyone of othem (except ours), has red-outs?

I've never called the game anyhow, except IL-2 Sturmovik:Birds of Prey.
We are making it, you are voting for it - with your money, and your (possible) loyalty. If it is so important for you - OK, do not even try demo. Or, buy the game, and vote for blackouts in this (and others) polls - than we'll make it in sequel.

But my guess is that this feature is not what make flight sim game a real simulation. Flight sim - by definition - is the simulation of the flight, of the plane dynamics - not of the pilot's body reaction to it. Should 'real' flightsim simulate vomit on a spins as well?

For sure I´ll try the demo. But I have been a fan of the original IL2 and this BOP has part of his name. IL2 made history and I expect at least from this BOP to be as realistic as the original IL2 is.

You want to take this feature out?. Ok, But don´t expect people say that it is an ultra realistic sim. Sorry this is what ""hardcore"" simmers are gonna think, including me. Blackouts play an important role and have been included since my first 16bits simulator.

To me this lower the standar of this sim, may be after I try out the demo I will change my mind but to me and for many others fans of IL2 are gonna see this like a weird decision.

You get angry because of my comments?.
Sr, critics said politely are good to improve things. I am not being rude but just trying to let you know how important this feature for many people is.

There you have the votes of the people. is not it enough to let you know what people really want?.