Commando units maybe ?

[Crni vuk]

Thinking about it that you can use "enemy" equipment would it be eventually a good thing to have units disguised with enemy uniforms ?

Before you say anything, both the Germans and British used troops that would have enemy uniforms and weapons (and even talk the enemies language) for sabotage. Going so far that in the Ardenes operation the Germans had a whole unit with Shermans and M10s, masking Panthers as M10s and attacking American postions or leading them in wrong directions.

The SAS had such tactics as well where they used enemy uniforms to mislead the enemy. And I think even the Soviets had such units in the NKVD but I am not sure about that. Cant say anything about the US forces though.

Maybe it could be interesting to have troops that exactly look like the enemy and appear on his screen as "his units" as soon the enter his screen. Just that he cant command them and that to be the only way to eventually tell they are not his own units.

I am not completely sure how this could work out, but it would have to be very expensive infantry units so much for sure (comparable to what kingtiger or Sturmtiger is to a panzer III if you want).

Just curious what other people think eventually ?

[Korsakov829]

Yes, a good idea for a mod. In Afghanistan we often infiltrated enemy ranks.

[MasacruAlex]

A great idea indeed.

Maybe you could just have a man disguised, so the enemy AI wouldn't attack him on sight unless you order your men to shoot at him(You'd know his enemy if you couldn't click him, in this case the enemy player), therefore you'd keep him hidden so the enemy player wouldn't suspect. The only way to detect the traitor would be to have an officer in the area. If you have an officer at this camp in a tree, pretty much all approaching spies would get spotted and the AI would auto-shoot at him. It's also good cause from what I saw on MP you can't have many officers at once.

My idea for now of having an ally behind the enemy lines, is the scout, moving him round the enemy if I manage to survive and move bush to bush behind em' and dynamite em or something.

[Korsakov829]

I've just thought it out. Terrible idea! Can you imagine if this guy had TNT or.. anything explosive, even mines?? You could just sneak some TNT or a mine behind a King Tiger.

Maybe we can get something less destructive scripted, aerial recon plane for example. That would give a advantage in all game modes.

[Crni vuk]

Originally Posted by Korsakov829

I've just thought it out. Terrible idea! Can you imagine if this guy had TNT or.. anything explosive, even mines?? You could just sneak some TNT or a mine behind a King Tiger.

What you see as bad is an plus in my book. Many do that with scouts already anyway, or try it at least. One more reason to keep infantry close to your tank. It happens way to often that you have tanks standing around in the midle of nowhere without infantry cause they are dieing so fast and droping like flies leaving most of the battle out to the "tanks" only, well sometimes it happen that way at least. Even though for eventualy one tank you would have several THOUSAND of infantry around, for ONE single tank. Except in those situations when certain forces had only armored vehicles and a few APCs with infantry. I think the british that very often that they had only armored forces seperated from infantry with cromwells and fireflies. The Germans had their "Panzergrenadiere" which have been troops with vehicles for fast transport. The Soviets had the Tank detzanshiky (or something like that ...) which have been quite similar to the German counterpart following most of the assault guns they are famous for the picture of Soviets ridding on their tanks in to battle which was quite common. I dont think the US had really classified specialiced units for that since they had a large motorized army so most infantry could be transported either by APCs or trucks and jeeps. But I would not be surprised if certain units had specialy trained men for supporting the tanks in their fight. But probably nothing on the level of the Panzergrendiere, German armored units have been almost like an "small" army in itself full with anti tank guns, artillery, tank hunters, infantry and battle tanks of course. Best example with Rommel which had always quite a lot of 88mm anti tank guns with his armed forces before he became a General and just comanded a smaller tank group.

But with spies it could be always done in a way that if the "spy" (letz call it that) gets to close to the target the units will just shoot him assuming they asked for a check, you know most armies have those, Flash! - Thunder! anyone ?. Friendly fire amongst other issues was always a serious problem, particularly when you happend to be out at night on duty and had to check who the person infront of you was. At night someone with a rifle will just have the general shape of a soldier and to know if its friendly or enemy might be important so every army has usualy an phrase they shout and if there is no correct response they start firing.

In WW2 at least the actions of spies or troops behind enemy lines have been very important many times using the uniforms to camouflage themself. This was done at least by certain German forces and as well by British special forces. To avoid cheap use of course such units would have to be expensive and should eventualy not start with a uniform but get the option to use one from fallen enemy soldiers. Eventualy. No clue about that how hard ot easy that would be. And yeah officers should have the optoin to see them and identify them on sight. Snipers as well. The scout can be a pretty effective tool in the right hands and yet I dont see really anyone "spaming" them and attacking the player directly all the time since they are not cheap, cant be taken right from the start (time delay) and can be as well countered effectively.

[Korsakov829]

On a huge battle with multiple fronts open it would be difficult to manually uncloak a unit. If this is ever added to a mod, make it cost 5x as much as a Jagdtiger.

[FM_Von_Manstein]

As far has historical realism goes its a sound idea. The Germans had 2 such units that come to mind.

Panzer Brigade 150, which was led by Otto Skorzeny, wore US uniforms and had many English speaking troops. They went on sabotage missions behind enemy lines during Unternehmen Wacht am Rhein.

Here's their vehicle OOB:

o 1 Sherman tank
o 5 Panther tanks
o 5 StuG IIIs
o 4 Sd.Kfz. 250/1s
o 6 Sd.Kfz. 251/1s
o 6 M3 Half-track
o 6 SdKfz 234/1s
o 4 M8 Greyhound
o 12 motorcycles with sidecar -German
o 1 motorcycle with sidecar -American
o 43 motorcycles -German
o 20 motorcycles -American
o 28 jeeps
o 6 light civilian type car -German
o 36 medium civilian type car -German
o 9 heavy civilian type cars -German
o 64 light trucks -German
o 56 medium trucks -German
o 8 medium trucks -American
o 6 heavy trucks -German
o 1 truck -American
o 1 truck -German

There was also Kommandoverband Jaguar, which operated on the east front in 1944, primary in Hungary. It was made up of troops that could speak Russian, they used T-34/85s primary and sported a lot of cool modified weapons like MP-40s with silencers.

However I'm not sure about something like this being used in the game. It would have to be very expensive, because someone with good micro+this unit, equals GG.

[Crni vuk]

well I am not really thinking about this on a whole army level like with severla vehicles and such. More a smaller formation like 4 or 5 infantry men. Highly specialiced commando units similar to the SAS for example.