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#11
08-30-2010, 06:29 AM
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To be honest with the amount of time I have spent on IL2 I could have built my own airplane by now - it might be a good thing if SOW is loaded down with horrible counter-productive DRM software to encourage me to go do something more constructive 
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#13
08-31-2010, 11:21 AM
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I must say it will be 1c,as why would they be using 1c forum,s
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#14
09-01-2010, 04:43 PM
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I second the posts in this topic though. I will not buy this from Ubisoft or Steam or any other release with crazy DRM lockdown. Are there any news on this? The point is this. I see Steam as a spyware and don't want it running on my system. With ubisoft... we all knew the issues with it it's DRM attempts. I just want a simple game that I can install and put the disk away again. In fact I don't even have an optical drive attached to my workstation anymore and most of my CD's and DVD's are broken. So if things don't work out in europe to me the only options are: 1. Getting an english release through 1c or any other retailer without crazy DRM or 2. Buying the russian version and play with a cracked english one. I'm German and I don't mind playing an english version. But I can't speak russian so sadly that's out of the question... I want to support the developers and honest publishers with my money, not a publisher who treats PAYING customers like pirates. It shouldn't be the people who buy the game suffering from stupid DRM. If anything it should be the people NOT paying for the game. I'd love to pre-order this game DRM free in english directly from the developers / 1c (I don't mind a key for multiplayer or anything but no rootkits, crazy DRM locks like activations or forced on-line only play etc.). I wouldn't even mind sending the money straight to Oleg himself and getting a copy. I just definately won't buy it if it's coming from the people at ubi or any other publisher that has nothing else to do other than developing DRM schemes. This goes especially for European releases and even more so for German ones. We pay really high prices here, much more than any other country usually, for example the USA or UK (a ton cheaper), even for english titles. And on top of that we get our asses kicked for paying more. No thanks. A game's just bit's and bytes but still some publishers are treating the customers who payed for a game worse than... poop. I don't want to depend on remote servers and ask some 3rd party if I am allowed to play the game that I bought. I'm sure anyone can understand this at least a little bit. Last edited by Madfish; 09-01-2010 at 04:46 PM.
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#15
09-01-2010, 09:24 PM
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Wishing for a game without any copy protection nowadays is to be blunt... unreal.
__________________
LEVEL BOMBING MANUAL v2.0 | Dedicated Bomber Squadron 'MUSTANG' - compilation of online air victories
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#16
09-01-2010, 10:03 PM
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If you go looking for free software and look at the number of downloads that are constantly being ripped off on popular software, music, videos and other media site... it is in the millions 24/7 at broadband speeds constantly.
Piracy is a huge problem, huge is not adequate "gargantuan" still doesn't descirbe it. Those millions of people that are constantly stealing media aren't buying media. In America the entire music scene has changed. The most popular music is pre-teen and rap. That isn't true, but those are the people buying the music. That's why artists targeting pre-teens and rap rule the Grammys. The people that are more computer literate are stealing all they want from share sites. So, the true figures for what music is or isn't popular is not relative to the number of buyers. I have a friend that plays guitar in a pretty well recognized group. He says, "If we didn't do live performances constantly we couldn't survive. We see hundreds of thousands of downloads for our music, but we get paid nada. We are tied to road trips and nightclub performances, just to make a living." The Eagle Dynamics developers http://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/ have their methods and they are invasive, but you definitely don't see their stuff all over the web for free sharing. I bought the LockOn, but never purchased anything after that. At the time I hated the piracy locks, but I understand they are improved. Regardless... I didn't really care that much for the fast movers anyway. Whatever Oleg has to do, to protect his software I will go along with. I hope he can protect his software, because he deserves to be paid fairly. The software protection environment has changed and protection of intellectual rights requires more radical methods. All the jibe about a pop in CD or DVD only (nowadays)... We all know that won't get the job done, just like we know we need a virus scan (nowadays), if we participate on the internet. Last edited by nearmiss; 09-01-2010 at 10:10 PM.
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#17
09-01-2010, 10:48 PM
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#18
09-01-2010, 11:00 PM
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First of all, Steam makes it harder to mod. Ok, but what's good about that? Mods and custom content are part of what kept IL-2, no almost any decent game out there, alive. And even if you don't like mods... no game makes it necessary to be modded so that's not a point really.
Steam has disappointed me many times already. Also I don't like buying not a product but a very questionable download license that can be revoked at any time. Not happening. On top of all you basically get spy and adware installed on your system AND steam is dangerous because if it'd succeed we would have a total monoculture when it comes to distribution. If you like that, fine, I don't. When it comes to DRM and piracy. Piracy is not a problem at all. A ton of research has been done on that topic and even games companies, mostly indie ones, admit to these facts. In fact many people wouldn't buy they game anyways, they pirate it, yes, but they wouldn't buy it if they couldn't pirate it. So usually it's NOT stealing a sale, all it does is making the game more popular so more people WILL buy it. Secondly it was estimated that most pirates download 4-5 games per month in average. Valid players buy 2-3 games per year in average. Most pirates don't even play games seriously or at all. Many of them start a game and quit it after 3 days. Only a very few amazingly popular games are being pirated and played. And if that is the case then mostly because of DRM. Which means many people, myself included, needed to actually crack or download a "clean" version just to be able to play a game they BOUGHT. On the other hand side I haven't seen any of these games coming out with under at least 10 million profit. So there can't be much harm done here. Remember what economy is like: We can't generate absurd amounts of profit from material and physical labor and transfer it to effortless digital copies of the same bits and bytes. That will essentially draw out all money from the real industry and transfer it to a bits & bytes bubble. No one can eat games. No one can sleep on them or drive them to work. Game studios and publishers seriously need to throttle down their shareholder revenues. Look at Blizzard Activision, Ubi, EA, even SEGA! A company that everyone thought was dead - they're raking in absurd amounts of money and that with tinkered financial reports! Yes, this game is different. It's a niche product and I tried to make suggestions on how to get it out of there (game modes). But seriously, simmers are hardcore fans and they will not pirate a game that easily. Only people who cannot pay for it anyways will. That's not really a lost sale. Asking for a DRM free game is far from blunt. I said I will pay so what right do they have to DRM me for this? None. On the other hand side I will not pay a penny and maybe grad it after years for a few bucks if they do DRM it. It's their choice. One sidenote on your mention of music. Music has gotten sick. Originally music was inteded to be copied. It was made to be sung and copied and performed. That is how it originated, how it integrated into the culture and how it grew. Nowadays artists usually steal. They steal the techniques, they steal music theory and research, they even steal inspiration or simply cover the hell out of "forgotten glory". But they expect everyone to pay? I don't think that will happen. Ever. People don't have to be computer smart to dislike that industry. They just have to be intelligent. The music industry doesn't do anything for the user. They even hinder him. I can't count the number of broken CD's I have. They won't give me a cheap exchange either. Copying the CD as my personal backup is illegal though and the industry hates lossless standards just so they can sell the same song over and over again. Your friends are probably just bad at promotion or music or their music is so niche that they just can't live off of it. Big deal, get real and get a job. I do art as well but can't live off of it. So I do a normal job. What's the problem with that? I dislike the princess syndrome - not everyone can be that lucky to earn millions in their sleep! If they need help I could lend them a hand. You can PM me and I can look over their marketing strategies and overall quality of covers, artworks, promotion, website, viral marketing etc. Next is eaglydynamics. I don't see a game that hasn't been cracked from them. Note: Multiplayer usually doesn't work. Rarely pirated titles support multiplayer but in general I don't see where they had more success fighting piracy than anyone else out there. And please keep in mind: Hardcore flight sims are a niche product! No one... plays them. A very small minority. So the fact that even their stuff has been cracked means that it's basically pointless to be an ass to your customers just for your own profit. We could go on about this for days but usually the defenders are not reasonable anyways. I could tell you for example what costs are added just for copy protection. Copy protection that usually does nothing! At least nothing good. The fact for me is: if this title will get released under reasonable conditions I will pay, play and promote. If it doesn't I will not pay, not play and warn everyone to stay the hell away from it. There are a ton of other games out there and there's also real life. I don't have to pay money for being kicked in the butt. Paying customers should be treated with respect. That's an imperative in the material world, where people would sue you to death if you deliver such low quality and intrude into their personal lives and it shouldn't be any different in the digital sphere either. Sorry for that lenghy post and the strong language but I hope I made some understandable points. If this discussion goes on I might add another post with good research material and statistics and then just drop it, wait and eventually stay away from the game. I will only play this if it's not intruding my computer, rootkitting it, spying on me, my hardware, my software and habits as well as not employing some messed up server side authorization crap that prevents me from playing it should I not have an internet connection or something like that. When I buy a game, I want to get a disc or download, install it and forget about it. Not worrying about what might happen if there is bad weather, if an earthquake takes out the authorization servers or if someone just doesn't like me and blocks my account for no reason. On the other hand side I do know that I bought a number (more than 10!) of games even multiple times already. Even sims (For example Freespace etc. I bought that about 3 times, along with Freespace 2) and SoW could be one of them because I'd want to get my girlfriend to try it out and fly with me I suppose. That said it's up to them and I really hope people would rise their heads and not accept that slavery. I was hoping slavery is a thing of the past but recently it got more and more popular again with the media industry. Best regards, Madfish Last edited by Madfish; 09-01-2010 at 11:10 PM.
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#19
09-01-2010, 11:29 PM
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...slavery? The media industry forces you to work for their purposes and in exchange provides your food and shelter? I realise that English isn't your first language (but I only know this because you said you're German somewhere else, I wouldn't have guessed from your writing) but that's not the right word to use to describe the media industry...
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#20
09-01-2010, 11:38 PM
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Sins of a Solar Empire was released without any copy protection and was one of the top games of the year. The publishers logic was DRM simply interferes with genuine sales as the people that hack take breaking copy protection as a challenge and would never buy it anyway. It worked for them. The recent fascination with DRM is simply the result of too many accounting and lawyer types who tend to be control freaks conniving their way into executive positions in big corporations
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Linear Mode
