How to perform Lag Displacement Roll Attack?

[Laurwin]

Originally Posted by Janosch

^ Ohhhhhhhh now I see! Brilliant video! The pilot starts the maneuver before the target passes his gunsight, and that's why rolling away from opponent's turn enables the unbroken visual contact. Things are different and perhaps less aerobatic if you start pulling up after the other guy passes your gunsight - that's usually when you try an initial snapshot with a plane that has lots of cannons. Then it's just a regular nearly vertical climb, roll and see-what-happens-next.

Those bi-planes and tri-planes sure do turn on a dime, though!

How much energy would you lose, if you simply tried to turn into the breaking bandit, and simply try the high deflection shot?

Would you lose more E, compared a well executed, lag displacement roll? Probably you would lose quite a bit energy, if you really had to pull lot of Gs, at high speed turn, and if you still missed the shot. Depends on the attacker's plane also, though.

High yoyo would retain more of your energy, also.

But I have to try this manouver sometime online. I will be going on one week vacation to Canary islands (Lanzarote), tomorrow on 21st December, so the earliest time I can play IL-2 again, is on the 29th December or something.

LOL I'll just have to contain my eagerness for battle for even longer time! Maybe play golf or tennis there. And check out the beach babes of course

[Janosch]

Originally Posted by Laurwin

How much energy would you lose, if you simply tried to turn into the breaking bandit, and simply try the high deflection shot?

Beats me, but you could try shooting without actually turning much, sometimes from a leveled wings position, if you're fast and are indeed already in a lead pursuit. A bit of rudder with ailerons to compensate can be used to make a fine last second adjustment to your aim. If you miss though, you'll lose ammo, time and someone else might see the tracers from miles away - too soon.

[Jumoschwanz]

I don't think this is worth wasting your time on. have been flying this sim online for a dozen years or so and there are much easier methods and explanations.

Just because someone writes a book does not mean anything, lots of dummies write books, and WWII pilots don't have anywhere near the hours of combat experience a lot of il2 pilots have.

Try this for beginners: If you are approaching a target at a high rate of speed from above, don't fly right at him fly at a point to either side of him several plane lengths. If you fly to his left side and he breaks left then he will fly right in front of your cannons. If he breaks right then he helps you because you can fit a larger radius turn into the space he makes between you and him that will not lose you energy.

Even better: Most targets that see you coming from their high six will try to zoom up at you for a head on shot or after they make you miss and shoot at you as you pass or gain some E. Fake them out by zooming back up smoothly as soon as they break, they will zoom up after you for a shot but you will be looping back out of range while they are shooting and you will come down on them right as they lose E and fall away from you at almost zero speed for an easy shot.

Practice practice practice is the best thing, the new AI is great for this. NO matter what you do, if it takes any thought then it is taking too long. You should be able to do the job without thinking at all.

[jameson]

Watched some US propaganda footage on utube yesterday showing our boys beating the Luftwaffe, lots of gun cam footage. What struck me is that the victims never moved, made no attempt at defence even with tracers wizzing by, even before they were hit. German footage shows pretty much the same. WW2 pilots seemed to fire from further away, 250 to 400 yards. There's much in Jumo's point. The weapons seemed to be a lot more effective than they appear ingame as well.

[Masi67]

From my expreince with lag roll you can keep pressure on your target without loosing too much E. Simpy using rudder and trying to get gun solution gives your target more room to counter your attack after initial attack.

Things ofcourse change in multihostile environment.

[MaxGunz]

You don't have to get or make the shot. if the target makes a hard turn that wastes his energy and you conserve yours then the fight is one step closer to the target not having the speed & alt to make a hard maneuver.

Jumo has it right about attack from one side. Hartmann wrote that only with his exit crossing the target's path behind the target and start to end, at much greater speed than the target. Hit or miss, he didn't hang around. Perhaps not having a refly button had something to do with it.

Don't follow a target's six co-speed trying to ease up close unless you can out-turn him at the speeds you're both flying. If he turns better then the closer you are, the easier it is for him to turn inside you.
Don't try to turn with a target from close to his six if you are going much faster. Climb to slow down and store your energy while rolling to keep him in sight while he burns his energy in that hard flat turn.

Closing with a target that's 100+ kph slower than you (you dived and leveled out to simplify the gunnery), start firing from long range (300+m depending on closure rate) but aim as if he is 50m closer than that range. The difference in speeds shrinks the travel time of your shots. Give it a short burst to test aim and depending on the result fire for effect or break high to set up another pass or leave.

[Masi67]

Don't mix boom and zoom, turn fight etc. with Lag Roll maneuver. Lag roll can be used to cut corners if you have E advantage and keep you E adnvantage. If you overshoot executing lag roll and loose to much E then you are misunderstanding it.

Use it when you have more E and enemy is turning and you want to keep pressure, or when attacking unaware enemy who is changing direction.

And ofcourse using Hartaman's tactics is always the safest pet Topic is when to use Lag roll manuver LOL

[Derda508]

Excuse me for being ridiculous, but ever since I read the title of this thread ...

[MaxGunz]

Lag roll sets you up for side attacks.
Telling why not to turn fight is not mixing turn fighting in.
Yes, you can lag roll with high closing speed. Where is a rule that a lag roll does not end in a gun pass and switch to other tactic.

Here is a strategy: don't be predictable.

[Masi67]

Originally Posted by MaxGunz

Lag roll sets you up for side attacks.
Telling why not to turn fight is not mixing turn fighting in.
Yes, you can lag roll with high closing speed. Where is a rule that a lag roll does not end in a gun pass and switch to other tactic.

Here is a strategy: don't be predictable.

Again this is discussion about Lag Roll, not about HOW TO BE UNPREDICTABLE LOL