Friday 2010-09-03 Dev. update and Discussions

[Ekar]

Trees and all of the details look really great.

I've mentioned before but it mostly comes down to resolution now (not that you really need to hear this), the terrain textures are very washed out in the first shot atleast. I think SOW will have the best cockpit graphics and aircraft models seen in a flight sim yet- I'm hoping the terrain will match these other elements in quality. The trees and grass are really looking quite stunning now.

I'm sure you guys are working hard on it- wonderfully textured terrains are quite rare in flightsims,.. you have the ORBX stuff for FSX, and WOP does a pretty decent job of things as well. The terrain has always been a bit of a weak spot for the average flight sim, I guess because most time is spent up in the air- but we also have the computing power and gfx memory now to bring in much crisper terrain graphics. Low flying can be exhilarating, but only if the detail holds up at these low altitudes. Blocky terrains ruin the immersion.

Great job!

[David603]

First off, let me say I love the rest of the update, and I'm fully aware this is WIP.

However there are some problems here. The roads are much too wide, at least 2-3 times as wide as they should be, judging by the scale of the train. In general, trains dwarf crossings, not the other way round. Period roads in the countryside would be narrow, usually around 12-15 feet wide, designed so it is possible for two oncoming cars to pass each other with care. Try placing a car on one of the roads and having a look at the width. If it isn't possible to place at least 4 cars side by side on those roads, I will eat my metaphorical hat.

Hedges are also a problem, you clearly need a hedge type of vegetation that can be placed along the sides of the road, because achieving a satisfactory look with individual bushes is going to become prohibitively expensive in terms of numbers needed, and at the moment the hedges look like individual shrubs placed at intervals along the side of the road.

To end my comments on a positive note, the way the trees and landscape work together at a distance (on the hills in the background) is fantastic and bodes well for the way the SOW will look from altitude

[OldFrenchy]

Compared to what we have been used to, this is a quantum leap forward in appearance, despite being a WIP. Well done!
What would be nice would to see a lot of ground activity. Yes, yes- framerates. Oh well.

[philip.ed]

Originally Posted by Bloblast

This makes things clearer:

Actually, zoomed in like that, i think the team have done a good job on the pilot model. The angle of the picture, with the reflection on the back of the canopy, can create the illusion the canopy is a lot bigger than it really is.


And regarding landscape; guys, this is soooo WIP Oleg said that the terrain would be almost photorealistic, and I just think this shows the team messing with textures before increasing their resolution...In any case, the terrain in WoP can look very good (debateable?) but I am sure that the textures from WoP could be placed into SoW in some form. I don't say this to say that this should happen, but to show that these txctures are far from final as the SoW has a lot more to offer. I'm confusing myself here; but I think I have made my point credible in one form or other...

[kendo65]

Originally Posted by David603

...
However there are some problems here. The roads are much too wide, at least 2-3 times as wide as they should be, judging by the scale of the train. In general, trains dwarf crossings, not the other way round. Period roads in the countryside would be narrow, usually around 12-15 feet wide, designed so it is possible for two oncoming cars to pass each other with care. Try placing a car on one of the roads and having a look at the width. If it isn't possible to place at least 4 cars side by side on those roads, I will eat my
metaphorical hat.

Hedges are also a problem, you clearly need a hedge type of vegetation that can be placed along the sides of the road, because achieving a satisfactory look with individual bushes is going to become prohibitively expensive in terms of numbers needed, and at the moment the hedges look like individual shrubs placed at intervals along the side of the road.
...

I was wondering if this shot was using a 'low detail' setting with only sparse trees/hedgerow details - like in Il2 which has a config.ini setting for trees. At the lowest level you get next to nothing - maybe this fits in with Luthier using a low-powered PC for testing purposes? It looks to me as if it may just be giving an 'indication' of tree and hedgerow density - the wooded areas look very 'thinned out' too compared to some shots we've seen before.

Tend to agree with your comments about the road / train though.

edit: the more I look at that picture the more I think that it is actually the train that is the problem. It's too small compared to the road AND the trees - maybe a lod issue ? - surely the passenger carriage should be much longer than the width of a country road!?

But I'm just going to remind myself of what is said on Page 1 - EVERYTHING IS WIP!!- and apologise for whinging

[philip.ed]

Compare Il-2 on first release to now...that, for me, is a thought that makes me know that SoW will be awesome.

[Bloblast]

Originally Posted by philip.ed

Actually, zoomed in like that, i think the team have done a good job on the pilot model. The angle of the picture, with the reflection on the back of the canopy, can create the illusion the canopy is a lot bigger than it really is.


And regarding landscape; guys, this is soooo WIP Oleg said that the terrain would be almost photorealistic, and I just think this shows the team messing with textures before increasing their resolution...In any case, the terrain in WoP can look very good (debateable?) but I am sure that the textures from WoP could be placed into SoW in some form. I don't say this to say that this should happen, but to show that these txctures are far from final as the SoW has a lot more to offer. I'm confusing myself here; but I think I have made my point credible in one form or other...

The top part of the canopy, between the 2 lines, seems to be too large in comparison.
The difference is clear: it's the pilot and the canopy imho.

[Asheshouse]

David603 makes some valid comments. If its possible to have hedges or small tree lines along roads and railways it will significantly enhance the appearance of the landscape.

I notice that the railway is single track. Although many branch lines were single track the majority might be better represented by twin tracks. Also if this allowed trains to be routed in both directions that would be great. Are cuttings, embankments, tunnels and level bridges being modelled. In IL2 railways never look quite right with steep bridge approaches and extreme track gradients in hilly country. --- Ok, I know its not a railway sim, but it would be good if it was possible.

With roads if convoys are routed in two directions will they pass each other on the left, as is correct for England, and on the right in France?

Overall I am hugely impressed by what is being achieved. Looking forward to its release.

[philip.ed]

Originally Posted by Asheshouse

David603 makes some valid comments. If its possible to have hedges or small tree lines along roads and railways it will significantly enhance the appearance of the landscape.

I notice that the railway is single track. Although many branch lines were single track the majority might be better represented by twin tracks. Also if this allowed trains to be routed in both directions that would be great. Are cuttings, embankments, tunnels and level bridges being modelled. In IL2 railways never look quite right with steep bridge approaches and extreme track gradients in hilly country. --- Ok, I know its not a railway sim, but it would be good if it was possible.

With roads if convoys are routed in two directions will they pass each other on the left, as is correct for England, and on the right in France?

Overall I am hugely impressed by what is being achieved. Looking forward to its release.

+1

[ChrisDNT]

Ok, look at this...



... don't you see the differences ?


P.S: of course, I'm not speaking here of the über-ugly filtering of WOP, just of the geometry of the landscape and the implantation of the trees, fields, roads and rivers.