SolidWorks

[Spudkopf]

G’day All

I am a SolidWorks (SW) user, and I’d like to try and contribute in some small way, as I understand it a model created in SW can be exported in a VRML format and the saved as a STL file and then imported to say 3ds Max.

I did a quick experiment using a surface model to see how a low resolution basic shape (a crude Luftmine shape) created using SW would translate into poly count at output, in this case it came out at 300 Tri’s.

Low res' SW model


VRML/SLT model



So my basic question is can a model that I can create in SW be of any use to a 3ds Max user and can said user reduce the poly count further if needed, because basic stuff like this take mere minutes to do in SW.

[Sita]

hard to say right now .. it's must be checked ... but i think yes ..... and once again "But" ... there is a difference between that two progs ... plus i don't know is it possible to make uwv maping in solid?

[Spudkopf]

G'day Sita

SolidWorks apparently uses UV mapping, not UWV mapping, but in my line of work custom skinning is not a requirement so i know very little about doing this.

From my JWWIIF modding days I know that the 3d modelling is more or less the easy part, and that wrapping the skins over the objects can be a tedious and at times frustrating affair, not to mention a real hour eater.

My aim was just to see if i could create surface objects (not solids) in SW as a way to possibly help out by taking on some of the modelling load, I would still be expecting that the mapping and any assembly would be done outside of SW in the final software.

I'm happy to do experiments with solid works to see if it can be of any benefit as a 3d tool, to the modelling community, maybe if I had some kind of simple test subject as a project to evaluate its worth, again I'm happy to give it go.

[Sita]

here is the thing ...

you can made 3d model at 5 minutes ... but for us ... if we talking about 3d modeling for Il2 1946 it's only first step ... and most easest step ..

short note about work process

1. at first you made 3d model of object ... in max detalisation ( under humble Il2 limits)
aka Lod00
2. need made mapping for it ...
3. make skin ...
4. need made three more models ... Lod01 Lod02 Lod03 .... ( plus yLod00 and yLod01 for shadow and collision mesh )

and Lod01 Lod02 Lod03 makes from finished painted ( or good mapped at least)
Lod00 by simplifying the model without losing maping

in that light of that ... clean 3d model without skin(maping) its just first step ...

[Pursuivant]

This source is somewhat incomplete, but gives you the basics of what's needed to model an IL2 plane.

http://www.smsp.org/il2/3d_modeling_bible/

The various IL2 modding sites will have more details.

I'm not sure what LoD models are needed for a 3D object, probably far less than for a plane since they're low-poly already.

These days, most 3D animation programs (Maya, 3DS Max, Blender) are pretty good about providing "unwrapping" functions allowing you to easily skin an object, although it is still time consuming and requires a fair bit of artistic skill to make a skin look right.

Animating the moving parts and properly setting up "hooks" for breaking parts and various effects (lights, smoke, fire) is also quite time consuming.

For planes and other objects with moving parts, I'd be more worried about how the animations translate from one program to another. From what I've read, often times animated parts don't transfer, or don't transfer properly, from one program to the next.

Ideally, an IL2 modder has access to 3DS Max, otherwise, all you can do is make the various models, and possibly skins, and then hand off your work to someone with 3DS Max for animation.

The good news is that if you're a student or associated with an educational institution, you can get a license for free:

http://www.autodesk.com/education/free-software/3ds-max

(FWIW, I've played around with all these programs, but my critical lack of artistic talent keeps me from making anything that doesn't look like it's made from Lego blocks.)

[Sita]

Originally Posted by Pursuivant

I'm not sure what LoD models are needed for a 3D object, probably far less than for a plane since they're low-poly already.

lods are a requirement of il2 engine ... and in most cases for lod01/02/03 used lod00 .... and it's not good ...

[Spudkopf]

Pursuivant/Sita

As mentioned early on I'm fully aware from past experience that the 3d modelling of parts is more or less the easy bit, and that the real work lies in the assemblies, animation and textures, not to mention all the LOD work.

Initially I was talking more along the lines of assisting with with doing churn type work, small objects or knobs, buttons, levers, etc.

However, seeing as I have two students (my kids) at home, I may as well take a look at getting 3ds-Max (if the free license offer also applies to Australia) and have a play and see how far I get.

I've read through the modeling bible a few times now, usually managing to dissuade myself from taking it any further, with real life and time always being limiting factors, but what to loose giving it a go, lets see if I pick myself something small to do and then just see what happens.

[gaunt1]

For start, what about some cockpits for planes that do not need too much modifications?
Like Ju-88C6, Bf-110C4, B-25C,G,H
If I understand correctly, cockpits do not need complex lods, and separate mappings and skins.
And maybe later, (and if possible), finish He-177 missing gunner's positions?

[Pursuivant]

Cockpit design is a mystery not discussed in the"Bible ". I have no idea what the polygon counts are or how you do animated gauges.

Also, lack of 3 view drawings for crew stations means you need really good artistic skills to get perspective right.

My ignorant guess is that it's the hardest part of modeling, even if Sita makes it look easy!

For a new modeler not working with 3DS Max my guess is that static ground objects, like buildings, are the easiest objects to contribute. DT members please correct me if I'm wrong.

[Sita]

Originally Posted by Pursuivant

My ignorant guess is that it's the hardest part of modeling, even if Sita makes it look easy!

to me most easy work with cockpit ... work with external model is terify me ... all these lods/caps/hooks ... all that smal thing which don't see to eye when you play ....

Originally Posted by Pursuivant

For a new modeler not working with 3DS Max my guess is that static ground objects, like buildings, are the easiest objects to contribute. DT members please correct me if I'm wrong.

good point ... but not everybody love do that stuff ... but it's need... for new map or something else ...

for example now we have long list of British hangars which will be use on new map ...
also good training for modeler is ordnance ... bombs rockets and other ....

but if someone want to make a pit for some unflyable at that moment plane in il2 ... it's always welcome ...

for example for bomber pit limit for poly was some about 10k poly ....
but not every time you can get in it ... for example Nac pit of Il4 is more ... some about 13500 or 14000 ....

you can over limits ... but only if it is justified ... and no other way ... but again you must try hard to make it low
less poly is better ...

and few words about limts/requare ..... a lot of for that work ... for example ... every mesh must have names ... simple and logical ... there whole system for it .... needles have special name ... other mesh other name ... and more ... all meshes must reset x-form ... all static meshes must set at 0.0.0 coodrinate ....

and other and other ..... all that needs to simplify life for person who will be make export for model ... those person are rare now ....
i mean if you made model for il2 you must make it at 100% and be prepare to fix some thing ... because person which possibly will make export for it don't have a time to reworking it .... or fix it ...