Ground attack tips, IL-2 Sturmovik?

[Laurwin]

I tend to get killed by German flak quite a bit, no matter how I "weave" or try to turn when approaching ground target area. Attacking enemy airfields usually results in crippling damage to my plane no matter what I do.

Attacking flack trains, with two flak wagons is not a welcome ordeal most of the time (although long range cannon fire can, at least stop the train in it's tracks)

My favorite versions are IL-2 early (series 3), because it has reflector gunsight, as well as vvya-23mm cannons. Very nice for strafing, very good for air-to-air, you can even take out cars easily with only 2x 7.62mm Shkas.

Otherwise I like also, mid-war type 3, because you can often take cluster bombs, or PTAB. And you get the rear gunner also.

Model 3M, has the ridiculous 37mm cannons which are quite good against all tanks in the game.

I have noticed though, that sometimes you can even kill panzerIIIs from behind with the 23mm cannons, on regular sturmoviks. I wonder if you can also kill panzerIV ?

What about side sector shots?

[gaunt1]

German flak is the weakest ingame. Try to attack a soviet airfield! Full of 37mm guns, one hit and you are dead. Or an american airfield, their guns are also incredibly effective.

Attacking trains is easy. The first thing you should target, is the flak wagon, the chance of hitting you is low, plus it has weak 20mm guns.
I found attacking ammo trains is far more dangerous, the chain reaction can kill you instantly if you are too close.

Concerning tanks, their damage model is very very simple. In reality, the ShVAK was nearly useless against them. The 23mm was far better, but it shouldnt penetrate the rear of the Pz.III, too thick (usually 50mm). Pz IV was more vulnerable (20mm), but due to the angle at which the aircraft dives on them, they were also resistant. Tigers, Panthers were almost completely invulnerable, only 37mm aircraft guns could harm them.

A great article:
http://operationbarbarossa.net/Myth-...hbusters4.html

[Laurwin]

Originally Posted by gaunt1

German flak is the weakest ingame. Try to attack a soviet airfield! Full of 37mm guns, one hit and you are dead. Or an american airfield, their guns are also incredibly effective.

Attacking trains is easy. The first thing you should target, is the flak wagon, the chance of hitting you is low, plus it has weak 20mm guns.
I found attacking ammo trains is far more dangerous, the chain reaction can kill you instantly if you are too close.

Concerning tanks, their damage model is very very simple. In reality, the ShVAK was nearly useless against them. The 23mm was far better, but it shouldnt penetrate the rear of the Pz.III, too thick (usually 50mm). Pz IV was more vulnerable (20mm), but due to the angle at which the aircraft dives on them, they were also resistant. Tigers, Panthers were almost completely invulnerable, only 37mm aircraft guns could harm them.

A great article:
http://operationbarbarossa.net/Myth-...hbusters4.html

OK, ok I over-reacted a little bit...

indeed, flak trains can be killed nicely when you make multiple attak passes, targeting flak wagons first.

But, airfields are still quite deadly targets IMO, even German airfields. That 20mm Flak ALWAYS TAKES OUT MY FRIKING CONTROLS.

It's much easier to attack flak with more nimble fighter-bombers, compared to slow-ass IL-2 which just gets wrecked by this 20mm flak.

[Jumoschwanz]

AAA can be a tough one. It seems like you are more concerned with the fast firing short range AAA and not the big flak guns for taking down big bombers.

Speed is a big help. Approach the airfield from altitude so you can get some good speed up in a dive. Fly fast and straight at a point away from a AAA gun and turn towards it at the last moment possible and shoot it out, then climb away and set up for the next one.

Bombs or rockets from a greater range or alt always give you a better chance at survival than strafing.

Try not to expose the plane of your wings to the line of fire, keep them a thin profile for the AAA gunner.

I would come in steep and fast from altitude and hit the most troublesome AAA first with bombs. Getting one out of two or three AAA guns out in the first pass exponentially increases your chances of survival on the second and third pass. Having a wingman attacking at the same time also greatly increases your chances as it will divide the AAA resources or distract them.

Usually on the Eastern front the lone IL2 Sturmovik did not fly around solo attacking German airbases. Doing so is not historical, so you will not get historical results.

[DD_crash]

Take a look here for some useful stuff http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL23ABD7CBB962A977

[illegalBeagle]

Attack flak as priority. Also, order friendly AI and your wingman to attack flak. In every il2 attack formation, there should be some aircraft dedicated to flak suppression. You can try coordinating your attacks following friendly AI in the hope that they will draw flak. You could try padlocking a target (flak) and ordering "attack my target" command for highest priority flak targets.

[majorfailure]

Originally Posted by Laurwin

I have noticed though, that sometimes you can even kill panzerIIIs from behind with the 23mm cannons, on regular sturmoviks. I wonder if you can also kill panzerIV ?

What about side sector shots?

Yes Panzer4 AFVs can be killed with 23mmVYa, you need to make a steep approach and hit the motor deck. Needs a little practice, the pullout has to be late to get penetrating hits - with the risk of crashing becoming a real risk.(Sidenote:It is even possible to get Panzer 3s shot out with 20mm Hispanos, but all planes that carry them in a nice arrangement and with lots of ammo(Beau, Mossie) require some work to make a sucessful pullout)

[Laurwin]

Whats the best tactic for effective rocket attacks with IL2, against German tanks, lets say pzIV?

Realistic rocket spread, phew I have a hard time hitting anything, with 300m rocket convergence, 10sec delay.

And difficulty with rocket hitting, is with these formations of four tanks, mobile. My best results against four moving panzers, is when I use dive bombing with low alt bombs, bombing along the predicted path which the stupid ground AI drives the tanks over With 10sec delay, it's no problem getting 1-2 tank kills this way dive bombing with longer delays, but accurate low level bombing.

Flak 88mm I prefer to kill with either high angle dive bombs, about 60deg, low alt bombs. One drop is usually good enough to kill it.

With rockets, I can also kill flak 88mm, when I make high angle rocket attack, with two salvoes of rockets, usually converging nicely on top of the gun, within maybe 10m circle of the gun itself.

It's just that rocket attacks against mobile groups, or mobile single tanks seem a lot more difficult with these crazy rocket spreads

[TinyTim]

Drag'n'Bag the flak. Seriously, that's the most effective tactics by far. Flak usually starts firing at the closest plane - this one should not engage the flak and only drag its fire away while the rest of the wing neutralizes the distracted flak.

Of course trying to do this solo is like flying a single 109 vs 8 spits and asking for best tactics to win.

[Laurwin]

Originally Posted by TinyTim

Drag'n'Bag the flak. Seriously, that's the most effective tactics by far. Flak usually starts firing at the closest plane - this one should not engage the flak and only drag its fire away while the rest of the wing neutralizes the distracted flak.

Of course trying to do this solo is like flying a single 109 vs 8 spits and asking for best tactics to win.

AI is too cowardly to attack flak, or even to drag their attention flying through, to the target area.

I don't understand how sometimes you're supposed to attack these enemy bases. The AI is too cowardly, and most of the time they "glide bomb" with mathematical precision, from high altitude - far away, with their dive bombers or fighter bombers.

You order them to strafe these flak guns, so that the mission can be fulfilled (ground airplanes destroyed, vehicles destroyed etc...) but they refuse order and fly home! So, yes this happens in vanilla campaigns more or less.

But I suppose you could just go with the formation and get a few ground kills, better than nothing.