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#21
08-28-2011, 02:09 PM
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@Madstrike: well first of all, this is the KB:TL forum. There are no paladins as troops.
Secondly, if you're a paladin as a class it is very much recommended to get tolerance, unless of course you're playing with units that don't mind Demons to begin with. Like Animals, Undeads, and some creatures like Cyclopses, Evil Beholders and stuff. I usually play with an Undead/Demon combo + Inquisitors so I don't really need tolerance. I just cope with the deduction of stats for the inquisitors. They're not damage dealers to begin with and if they get targetted I made a mistake in my strategy, so the lower hp shouldn't matter. By girls' army I suppose you mean Lake Fairies, Sprites, Dryads, Demonesses and stuff. Firstly I'd never go with a 5/5 girls army but with a 3/5 (S, LF, D), added Demons and Skeleton Archers and sometimes swap Dryads with Inquisitors or Black/Green Dragons. I never saw the point in 3 or more melee units that have no tanking features. 2 melee strikers are enough, plus an offensively gifted tank unit, one supporter and a ranged damage dealer. To answer your question, although it does answer itsself after my recommendations: the Demons of course ^^ 
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#22
08-28-2011, 06:22 PM
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Ok, cheers for all the info, yeah I was currently playing AP, thats why I was using paladins, no wonder I never saw them in KBTL duh.... yeah I was thinking about getting the sprites/lf/d plus another 2 units U said demons are best, but is it so even with their low init/speed compared to the girls(with the ruby they are blazing fast), I was maybe thinking of using green emerald dragons as tanks for target, they seem like a good option, I rly like his mana sucking ability since Im a mage, he is also a good target for phantom since it can go for very cheap with the mana drain...
Anyway considering I go with ur setup of sprites/lf/d + demons, what would u reckon as last unit, ranged damage dealer unit or a support unit like inquisitors? or maybe even shamans? Last edited by Madstrike; 08-29-2011 at 01:00 AM.
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#23
08-29-2011, 04:14 AM
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Quote:
As for the Initiative problem you have: it's vital to specc Onslaught in the might tree early on. The battle is won or lost in the first (two) round(s). Additional rounds are a matter of form and loss preservation. And since the Demons are your tanks to begin with you may even pause all your units and let them move first (which they will, even before Dragons, provided you have Onslaught). But this strategy also greatly depends on the enemy's setup. If you're facing a wizard type hero with more than two ranged units in his setup you should of course take precautions and pick a more suitable strategy and setup. P.S: Don't forget that the girls setup isn't complete just with Anga's Ruby. It greatly (!) depends on two additional items damage wise. One being the poison dagger, adding +1 poison damage to their damage as well as Isshara's Whip, adding +1 fire damage to it. With the Sprites and Lake Fairies that have 1-2 and 1-3 (no guarantee on the numbers; just cited from memory) base damage you will end up with 3-4 and 3-5 damage which effectively triples their minimum and doubles their maximum damage output (except with magic/fire/poison resistant/immune opponents). The greatness of those 2 units comes from these items and nothing else. Last edited by Vulture; 08-29-2011 at 04:20 AM.
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#24
08-29-2011, 01:43 PM
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oh, very good points u got there, I thought the girls would do well with just the ruby, I dont have those other items u mentioned. Do you reckon they are weak otherwise? Its a shame cuz I have a place to get demons(in arlania lol) and I got sacrifice so no problems. Would u rather have a different setup in this case?
ps: I just realized those weapons also add the bonus to the archers which is just icing in the cake(or do they not?) Last edited by Madstrike; 08-29-2011 at 01:45 PM.
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#25
08-29-2011, 02:07 PM
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Yes, it does ice the cake. That makes it even more awesome. You should use the savegame scanner (search for a link to it in the forum) and check where the poison dagger is (or if there is one) in your game. Isshara's Whip is a quest reward and everyone gets it in every game.
To answer your question: I wouldn't recommend using Sprites and Lake Fairies without these two items. Without these items the only quality of those is their speed and initiative, which of course is nice, don't get me wrong, but they're supposed to be your main strikers and they just can't be it without those two weapons. As for the other question: almost any "glass cannon" striker (ranged or melee alike) will go along perfectly with Demons as a tanking unit. But since I have no idea where you are, what level you're at, what class you play and what talents you chose I can't give you an honest and suitable recommendation about what to replace the girls with. I'd say: try it, play around with certain setups until you find one that suits your level, class, talents and playstyle.
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#26
08-29-2011, 08:45 PM
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Im a mage, lvl 18, in the elven lands atm. I have level 2 higher magic, chaos magic and distortion magic are maxed. I do like the demons as tanking units, the only downside however to them is that I cannot heal them or res with inquisitors, only way to res them is with sacrifice, which I dont fancy doing every game...(also I dont have the ressurect spell atm, I know...).
Ive been using royal snakes throughout the game since Im married with the frog lady. I was using regular griffins(didnt find any royal griffins) as tanks for "target" before the demons, and inquisitors to res them, so royal snakes/griffins/inquisitors as a staple, plus I was using a mix of ranged attackers, usually evil beholders and cannoneers, but those last 2 are not that hot atm for me, maybe I should change one of them for shamans(those would also come in handy to heal the demons[I dont know if they can heal them though] I suppose, could change those with inquisitors as well), and maybe get skellie archers also, but they rly need dragon arrows otherwise they are meh... ps: I took a look with the scanner, and it seems I dont have that dagger in my game, either that or it has a very different name, cuz everything has a different name, I mean whats smile skul spell? whats a wing wind? lol.... I have been using giants as of now for target, they work quite well with shamans, and inquisitors(just in case), also using skeli archers and royal snakes. It feels smooth now, but I might try emerald green dragons later. Last edited by Madstrike; 08-30-2011 at 03:44 AM.
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#27
08-30-2011, 02:44 PM
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#28
08-30-2011, 04:01 PM
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At lvl 18 you should have gotten The Reaper eternities ago to use Time Back to restore your Demons' casualties instead of sacrifice.
Turn 1 -> activate run and move Demons across the field one tile shorter than they can, drop pentagram. Use ranged to kill enemy ranged, cast target if neccessary. Bring in your melee strikers half the way and pause them. Enemy moves and eats infinite retaliation from the Demons. Your strikers move last and finish off what's still standing. Turn 2 -> Drop the Demons' minions and hope they're Demons, too. Pause any of your troops so you have the last action in this turn. Your strikers kill stuff, you cast whatever you want. Enemy moves and eats retaliation yet again. It's your paused unit's turn now: cast Time Back on Demons. Demons are fully restored. What's left on the battlefield should be so decimated now that nothing is a threat to you anymore. Result: no losses, and you have surplus rage from killing leftovers which you can take to the next combat. See also: chain fighting (search function).
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#29
08-30-2011, 05:31 PM
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I understand the chain fighting concept, u also have good points on ur strat, however, I dont have timeback for level 4 creatures yet(its level 3), so I am stuck with sacrifice as the only way to heal demons, that is why Ill keep them at bay for the moment, Ive been using giants to great effect, and in some cases green dragons. Also in your no losses strat I dont see how u deal with creatures that deal damage to everyone in the field like giants(for that I usually have to cast battle cry and dragon arrows on the skellie archers, but if there is more than one giants stack it gets tricky, especially if there are also other ranged units on the enemy's side).
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#30
08-30-2011, 08:10 PM
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In order to get your Time Back up you have to use it constantly to level the Reaper and get Time Back options upon level-up. In my games I go and get the Reaper as soon as I can (mostly around lvl 7-10-ish) and abuse the shit out of him until I get Time Back. Then I abuse the shit out of that so that on average I have lvl 5 Time Back at 2 rounds rest for 20 rage by (character)lvl 17 at the latest. Vital for my playstyle, especially on impossible ^^
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