ROF online shenanigan.

[ElAurens]

Originally Posted by jasonbirder

I don't want to go online...

Afraid you might get shot down for once?



This title will be a success.

If you don't want to go online then don't.

KTHANXBYE.

[Igo kyu]

Originally Posted by ElAurens

If you don't want to go online then don't.

KTHANXBYE.

I don't play online.

I do get shot down by the IL*2 AI that everyone online apparently calls too easy, my reactions are shot and not going to improve. I'm "addicted" to slowed time and external views.

Since I don't play flight sims online, and am not that likely to, I'm only interested in single player. I don't want to know how far from the bottom of some world ranking I am, I'm certainly not going to be near the top. Software phoning home is almost entirely negative, for me.

It may be about developers getting tough with pirates, I'm not sure that's going to work out, as I've heard said a lot before, it seems to be the customers that get the rough end of that deal, even though they are not the ones causing the problem.

[Chivas]

I'd be interesting and laughable to see how many people here, who are so against any kind of game protection, would change their tune, if they owned a percentage of the PC game.

[zapatista]

Originally Posted by Tvrdi

Here is the response from their Blog...
.....Online connection in «Rise of Flight» will give you:


2. .... Not to mention free updates which will be downloaded automatically each time you login into game. Each time new version or an update is available (new areas, landscapes, weather condition) - it will be automatically downloaded and installed on your system. This system will provide you with nice updates and exclude any bugs while playing in multiplayer.
.

so not only do they expect permanent online access exists for all gamers at all times, but they seem to think we will trust them enough to let our home/work pc's become virtual drone terminals where they can constantly install and alter files without owner control/authorization ? dream on folks, pull the other one !

when you add to that they already say you will have to pay for addon planes and other new features, we are being sold a pig in sheeps clothing it seems. when a few months later they provide a major upgrade in features or scenery, they will want another 50$. ahh and if you dont pay you cant use your old game anymore because it is not compatible with whatever for sale crap they again added to their servers.

they dont seem to want us to realize the you are starting on a conveyor belt of perpetual upgrades where we are treated as dumb cash machines. pox and petulance for ten generations on the moronic brain that came up with this plan ! duh there is already a model for this, a free game, where you pay an online monthly fee ! calling their current marketing plan anything else is misleading.


let us il2 fan's thank the gods for having somebody like oleg involved in the sim world, giving us lots of features and options, single player, multiplayer, coop, single missions, campaigns (dynamic and scripted), online and offline, etc.. and yes once we have bought the game we are willing to pay later for whatever new the CUSTOMER WANTS to add in new planes/scenery add those new features or upgrade, because we can also still use the product we initially payed for if we dont upgrade. not that hard to grasp the basic concept, is it now

just hold on to your cash folks, all we need from oleg will be a couple of ww1 planes and ROF will be blown aside, and yes, that will be with oleg's grass moving in the wind at the same time we start our engines

[zapatista]

Originally Posted by Chivas

I'd be interesting and laughable to see how many people here, who are so against any kind of game protection, would change their tune, if they owned a percentage of the PC game.

nothing wrong with copy protections, as long as they dont damage my pc and as long as those copy protections dont create major hassles or problems for the real customers (for ex the starforce crap cost me 2 dvd-writers, and i payed for the game that caused this, and guess what the con artists who made the "feature" are nowhere to be found when i want them to provide me with a replacement drive, what a surprise)

the biggest problem with software piracy is organized commercial mafia syndicates selling games/software/video's in 2e and 3e world countries that dont enforce copyright laws (like china, india, russia, eastern europe etc..). it is extremely rare for this to be marketed in a large scale that way in western europe, the north american mainland, auz and nz, japan etc.... the problem there is not the end user buying a copied game/video, it is the corruption in law and order (which usually has kickback's and payoff's from the local cops all the way up the "official" bureaucracy in those countries), and it is usually deliberately not addressed by the politicians (for ex 95% of all chinese computers used in their official government offices run on pirated software), and there is a complete lack of enforcement and regulation of copyrights.

for those western developed markets where various branches of governement and law and order will do their part in enforcing copyright laws, copyright infringement problems are mostly from one teenager making a game/video copy for a school friend, and most of what they give each other for free they wouldnt spend their money on if it could only be accessed by purchasing it anyway, because they wouldnt be interested in it enough. to inconvenience the real customers in those richer developed markets with half baked and clumsy or faulty protection schemes is foolish, because that is the only place these games/video/software makers can get any money from.

[Chivas]

Do you actually think developers and publishers would spend huge amounts of monies to protect their property if there wasn't a piracy issue. Its also highly unlikely they're doing it just to piss off their customers. They have to do something as the internet regulators are doing nothing to stop the obvious illegal downloads.

[zapatista]

Originally Posted by Chivas

Do you actually think developers and publishers would spend huge amounts of monies to protect their property if there wasn't a piracy issue. Its also highly unlikely they're doing it just to piss off their customers. They have to do something as the internet regulators are doing nothing to stop the obvious illegal downloads.

you'r mixing up to many concepts and trying to make them into a drinkable soup, not all of what you said fits together

Originally Posted by Chivas

Do you actually think developers and publishers would spend huge amounts of monies to protect their property if there wasn't a piracy issue.

yes there is a piracy issue, and yes some basic protections are needed, but keep that in the context that wholesale and bulk piracy is not being address. also "adding protection" should not equal inconveniencing and damaging genuine customers, it is possible to avoid that to.

and spending "huge monies" as you say it, to add a faulty and inconvenient copy protection doesnt mean that the amount of money spent directly equals the quality level of the copy protection either. you can spend smaller money on it more smartly, and have a better result

Originally Posted by Chivas

Its also highly unlikely they're doing it just to piss off their customers.

copy protections are often only added as an afterthought, once the product is finished, this then limits the methods they can cheaply apply to add copy protection. the end result in many cases is that they do piss off the real customers, and this shows their professional incompetence in marketing software to their real target market. add to that that they simply dont care if they piss people off as long as the sales drones make money, and you end up with the mess we have in the last few years.

Originally Posted by Chivas

They have to do something as the internet regulators are doing nothing to stop the obvious illegal downloads.

it is not the big bad internet that is the problem, or the lack of enforcement tools by commercial internet companies to infringe the rights of citizens in western countries, it is the fact that the biggest source of large scale piracy is not being address.

and why is it not being addressed you may ask ? simply put, because there are additional even larger scale "other commercial interests" at work in those same "markets" that over rule or push aside those smaller copyright interests of the entertainment industry. for ex your and my government actively engage those copyright infringing countries in international trade negotiations to make agreements that benefit ford, bmw, mastercard, siemens, hoffman laroche, bayer, shell, Lockheed-Martin, etc... so that those companies are given access to those markets (free trade agreements, and "market access" agreements), and in exchange of those large companies getting access for their products our governments will tolerate some minor issues not being addressed, err like like lack of copyright enforcement for example.

the enemy of pirated games is not us the legitimate customers and aviation enthusiasts, it is large criminal piracy syndicates and corrupt government officials in 2e and 3e world countries. and yes, there are solutions to this that still allows my kids to play their games while on hollidays, and doesnt require my pc hardware to be damaged.

[|ZUTI|]

The best way to fight piracy is pricing. If the price is right i buy stuff. If not, i get stuff.

Don't really care about this online thing. I'll get the game if the demo shows nice flight models and if the price won't be too high. I am curious though how the game will behave if connection is lost during missions (summer and summer storms, my connection resets sometimes ).

[Codex]

Totally understandable that some people don't like to pay online. But i suppose the risk of getting ripped on money is just as rare as with putting your card into the cash dispenser these days with all the technical equipment. As long as you pay to companies like valve/steam you're totally on the safe side, it's all about common sense.

I'm not so sure.

Just to qualify myself, I work for one of the four major banks in Australia. Credit card fraud via online intercepts is not as prevalent as you might think. It is very hard for someone to obtain your details purely via intercepting net traffic. Over 80% of credit card fraud reported to us was the result of customers using fraudulent sites, responding to phishing emails, allowing "friends" to use their cards and identity theft where thieves went through rubbish bins collecting sensitive documents like bank statements and even purchase receipts (look closely as to how much info is on that receipt.)

Generally speaking purchasing goods via legitimate online sites, in itself, is no more risky than buying a bunch of flowers over the phone or even paying for fuel at a service station.

Besides if you find you have been a victim of credit card fraud, your card issuer must investigate the matter and if your found not to be at fault, your guaranteed by law to get your money back.

Just wanted to put some perspective surrounding this issue.

Oh BTW, I have no problem with needing a net connection to play ROF. If it hampers pirates then more power to the developers I say. But then I have a biased opinion regarding this.

[virre89]

It may be where your challenge comes from...but it certainly isn't where everyones comes from

Certainly isn't but the fact remains that SP stays static vs mp which is more dynamic and anything can happen, smart AI is one thing but humans is another thing.

Or reject it...Or indeed reject it quite vocally as we feel they are trying to modify gamers behavior and impose their idea of what a flight simulation should be all about on us...

I don't want to go online...
Reply With Quote

Just don't buy it then, they've made their decision and it's their product not yours. They certainly ain't doing this just to piss you off which you seem to think.

I hope Oleg is reading these threads...

I wouldn't mind him implementing this as well... maybe you do but its still a great solution, except for the fact that the offline users can't play the game.

I think u fail to see the main reason why A LOT of people dont like this new development, they took something that is an option (offline) most people use atleast once and most of the time more than that and turned into some kind of a problem.

Simply put: why should u or the dev team or anyonelse for that matter care when and if i play singel player mode?

Seriously, give me 1 valid reason and ill give u a milion bucks.


"Copyprotection" doesnt fly, if you are that scared of pirates dont sail on the 7 seas.

It's defiantly not a definite option these days, just look around you there's a lot of online-only games and maybe this is the future for the simulation market as well. Dear god , i hope you're aware that the simulation market is very thin already and piracy ain't helping and the developers have to do something.

My VAILD reason is piracy and the only once to blame for todays copy protections is the customers, if the world wouldn't be filled with greedy kids downloading everything we wouldn't need this kind of stuff.

It may be about developers getting tough with pirates, I'm not sure that's going to work out, as I've heard said a lot before, it seems to be the customers that get the rough end of that deal, even though they are not the ones causing the problem.

Customers are the only reason why copy protection exists it's not just there to make you pissed. We are the problem, not the developers when it comes to protection features.

I'd be interesting and laughable to see how many people here, who are so against any kind of game protection, would change their tune, if they owned a percentage of the PC game.

Very true, people here didn't invest millions in the product and that's why they fail to see the reasons why the developers do this.

so not only do they expect permanent online access exists for all gamers at all times, but they seem to think we will trust them enough to let our home/work pc's become virtual drone terminals where they can constantly install and alter files without owner control/authorization ? dream on folks, pull the other one !

when you add to that they already say you will have to pay for addon planes and other new features, we are being sold a pig in sheeps clothing it seems. when a few months later they provide a major upgrade in features or scenery, they will want another 50$ ahh and if you dont pay you cant use your old game anymore because it is not compatible with whatever for sale crap they again added to their servers.

they dont seem to want us to realize the you are starting on a conveyor belt of perpetual upgrades where we are treated as dumb cash machines. pox and petulance for ten generations on the moronic brain that came up with this plan ! duh there is already a model for this, a free game, where you pay an online monthly fee ! calling their current marketing plan anything else is misleading.


let us il2 fan's thank the gods for having somebody like oleg involved in the sim world, giving us lots of features and options, single player, multiplayer, coop, single missions, campaigns (dynamic and scripted), online and offline, etc.. and yes once we have bought the game we are willing to pay later for whatever new the CUSTOMER WANTS to add in new planes/scenery add those new features or upgrade, because we can also still use the product we initially payed for if we dont upgrade. not that hard to grasp the basic concept, is it now

just hold on to your cash folks, all we need from oleg will be a couple of ww1 planes and ROF will be blown aside, and yes, that will be with oleg's grass moving in the wind at the same time we start our engines

You don't believe you can trust a developer .. dear god.
Where's you're proof of updates without your agreement? They've said they will allow constant updates automatically via their service, that doesn't mean you won't know it's happening. You're most likely going to have to accept it each and every time.

And as we all know there is an single player mode just that it requires an online connection for statistics, meaning that you can most likely play without owning the latest patches or stuff like that. When going online you'll need game updates that fix stuff like glitches,bugs and balance due to synchronization and cheat protection .. but for game content such as planes etc it will be up to the customer if he/she wants to buy it as a flyable otherwise you'll only see others fly around in them.

Do you trust anyone?.. the cash dispenser?
Common sense is one thing but paranoia is another one.

I am defiantly not going to hold on to my cash and miss out on such an awesome title, but you go ahead sir your loss.
We all know that BoB is currently far away and that it's centered around ww2, meaning you won't see any ww1 planes in it anytime soon.
Besides i think RoF game engine looks stunning with all the particle effects,lightning and wind flow, i think you're just very pissed at the moment but please don't try to convince us buyers of standing down because i couldn't care less if you do.