IL2 and Sound Modding

[Bandit Bill]

Originally Posted by zapatista

and for those hack kids who seem to be deaf dumb and blind to olegs opinion on all this, in spite of his other open statements he made showing how damaging all this hack nonsense is.

from a recent russian forum post by oleg...

"В общем так. Будет 4.09, но не знаю еще когда. Там будет защита от хакеров нового типа. Вопрос в том, что это может иногда ухудшить скорость передачи данных. Мы могли это сделать и раньше, но не делали именно поэтому.
Мы могли вообще все на компьютере юзера проверять, но это было бы противозаконно (хотя наиболее просто и действенно...).
В общем мешают нам нормально БоБ-ом заниматься... Готовились только дополнение выпустить, а теперь придеться отложить... пока не сделаем, что сказал.
Не люблю я читеров.... И Ил-2 не предназначался для моддеров... Поэтому так долго и живет в онлайне..."

roughly translates as.... (ivan can maybe be more accurate)

"So - there'll be 4.09 patch, don't know how soon yet. 4.09 patch will have protection from this hack, but it will sometimes increase traffic load. We could do it before, but did not do it for this reason.
The easiest way - do some checks at client side, it will be very effective but illegally.
All this problems delay readiness of addon for IL-2 and BOB"
Also, Oleg said that he don't like cheaters and Il2 was not supposed to have mods. That's why it popular in online long time.

did the hack kiddies miss the points oleg made ?
- its delaying work on BoB !
- its delaying the 4.09 release for the rest of us
- the hack crap will be closed again shortly, so go back under the rock where you came from, and stroke eachother there without bothering the rest of us with your juvenile crap
- hacking files results in cheating online, and this makes il2 less popular in online use
- the new hack fix will increase BW demands, and could make it much harder for low BW people to play online

With all due respect, Zapatista, stuff your 'hack kiddie' slur up your own rosey red arse.

You continue to fling that insult out, and yet there is already one poll on the Unmentionable Site that proves that 'you is wrong'. I am neither a kiddie, nor could i hack my way out of a wet paper bag. The term 'hack kiddie' is also a misnomer for the vast majority of people who are more open to modding on that site - aside from the fact most wish they were kids again perhaps. If you want to keep things civil, 'pro-modder', or 'differently oriented IL-2 fan' will suffice.

If the insults keep getting thrown out, Evgeny should do as he has promised and start removing people exit Stage Left for the good of the civility of the forum, no matter how sensitive or righteous the topic is. How about it, Evgeny, a little balance here?

[Baco]

IL-2 add ons.. hmm. Maybe if anounced properlly there would be no hack....

Self moderated. nt worth a fight.

Still Oleg could set up a team to deliver legal new IA flyable planes with existing cockpits.

[Santa Claus]

CKY_86

I can enter UK dedicated at anytime and use the "sound mod" as a way to cheat.

You implied the CRT=2 blocks sound mod cheaters... I'm letting you know that it does not block them all. Just because you don't know how, doesn't mean its not happening.

If you look at the ntrk I posted I was able to choose and fly the Lerche in any server I wanted (go to external views and you can see it fly in one or more of the tracks)... including those with CRT=2

Its not a trick track, it wasnt changed afterward and it wasn't done by making some file read only like someone else suggested.

A Lerche was used to make it obvious. The chat was used to see if the players in the server felt it was a cheat....obviously they did. I wanted to make sure that they saw it...not only on the scoreboard but also in the game. If nobody could verify it was there...then the track would have been a waste if time.... Actually, it was a waste of time for some people.

What was said in chat, doesnt change the fact that a plane considered to be a cheat, by the players on the server....was able to fly.

CKY_86 if you would like to PM me, maybe we can sync schedules and I'll meet you in UK server for a minute and let you record the track so you know its not a trick????? Although this really doesn't matter. The modders/hackers know that the "sound hack" can be use to cheat in any crt=2 server using many creative ways.

How widespread it is...who knows. The fact that it can be done causes problems and arguing online. (Not just here)

In Summary... checkruntime settings do not guarantee honest play.
(As someone else mentioned... checkruntime should be used... it does help)

In the spirit of Christmas...Maybe every person who has downloaded the "sound hack" is a good honest person. If we all stick our heads in the snow, maybe we can continue to believe that.

***Warning.... Do NOT stick your head in the snow that looks like this forum.

Ho Ho Ho

Happy Holidays to All

[zapatista]

Originally Posted by JG52Uther

So Baron you think you can do what you like,call me a bonehead,and threaten to 'nuke my pc'.
Apologise as Evgeny asked you to.

thats hypocritical, this thread is full of your posts insulting people, and now you are pretending you dont understand the context of barons text or him adding "lol" at the end of a statement, grow up !

[zapatista]

Originally Posted by Bandit Bill

With all due respect, Zapatista, stuff your 'hack kiddie' slur up your own rosey red arse.

You continue to fling that insult out, and yet there is already one poll on the Unmentionable Site that proves that 'you is wrong'. I am neither a kiddie, nor could i hack my way out of a wet paper bag. The term 'hack kiddie' is also a misnomer for the vast majority of people who are more open to modding on that site - aside from the fact most wish they were kids again perhaps. If you want to keep things civil, 'pro-modder', or 'differently oriented IL-2 fan' will suffice.

If the insults keep getting thrown out, Evgeny should do as he has promised and start removing people exit Stage Left for the good of the civility of the forum, no matter how sensitive or righteous the topic is. How about it, Evgeny, a little balance here?

your a little confused about what the 1c forum guideline is about, it specifically warns against "promoting hacking, using obscene language" , and your insult of "stuff it up your own rosey red arse" is exactly what is not allowed here.

the infantile selfishness of the hack promoters here in this forum is the problem that ligitimate users are reacting to, try and focus on this:

Originally Posted by Oleg Maddox:

Say "Thanks" guys who did it... and who do not understand what they did for online community... we need simply to rewrite too many things, icluding even file structure.(...)

its an infantile and selfish because promoting the hack only focuses on the ...me...me...me.... aspect of a small group of people who dont care about the rest of the il2 community, like selfish like little kids not able to understanding the greater ramifications the hack problem has has created, or respecting the wishes of its owner and creator.

it takes a minimum of maturity to be able to look at the broader picture, and that is not being demonstrated here. their promoting the use of the hack and keep trying to pretend it is legitimate and allowed. the whole lot of them, including you if you promote it, should be kicked out of here.

[fabianfred]

all these arguments about "the sound mod CAN be used to cheat on-line...".... so what?

that doesn't mean that everyone who uses the mod WANTS to cheat....

cars CAN kill...but that doesn't mean everyone driving a car is a killer...

I have been using the mods for months...and am very active in the AAA forums.... I am certainly not lacking in intelligence (IQ=140)...but I do not see anywhere how the anti crowd can claim that it is EASY to hack the FM.... it is certainly not right there in front of your face.... you may have to go looking deep in the files to be able to do so....

and to make those kind of changes requires the use of 'Qtims sfs extractor tool'... which is NOT a part of the mod kit...and has to be got from another source...if you want to use it

I believe that MOST of the people using the mods have just downloaded what is available from the AAA site...and are not interested in making their own

To label everyone who uses the mods as cheats is ridiculous...

But for those who adamantly deny themselves the use of the mods..... you are very soon about to miss out on some of the most interesting work which has been done.......
new maps are in progress.......the Aleutians..... The Slot..... Truk .... N.W.Europe ..... Malta.....
and also a boon for ground pounders... the ability to destroy certain 'objects' with normal strafing ammo...especially the AA gun mounts on warships.... and the small fishing boats

[stalkervision]

Originally Posted by Bandit Bill

With all due respect, Zapatista, stuff your 'hack kiddie' slur up your own rosey red arse.

You continue to fling that insult out, and yet there is already one poll on the Unmentionable Site that proves that 'you is wrong'. I am neither a kiddie, nor could i hack my way out of a wet paper bag. The term 'hack kiddie' is also a misnomer for the vast majority of people who are more open to modding on that site - aside from the fact most wish they were kids again perhaps. If you want to keep things civil, 'pro-modder', or 'differently oriented IL-2 fan' will suffice.

If the insults keep getting thrown out, Evgeny should do as he has promised and start removing people exit Stage Left for the good of the civility of the forum, no matter how sensitive or righteous the topic is. How about it, Evgeny, a little balance here?

I find the use of the phrase "Hack Kiddie" over and over very telling about Zapatista's true moral nature. It is an obvious abomination of the phrase "script Kiddie" which very few people but true hackers know about.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Script_kiddies

True hackers refer to these people with disgust just as Zapatista does over and over again in compairing il-2 modders to these people.

[Rama]

Originally Posted by fabianfred

that doesn't mean that everyone who uses the mod WANTS to cheat....

cars CAN kill...but that doesn't mean everyone driving a car is a killer...

What you don't understand is that there's not police online to prevent or punish you for cheating (as there is on the road with your exemple).

So either cheating is impossible because the software prevent it.... or there will be cheat.
Of course not every online gamer is a cheater. But only a very few of them can ruin online play.... just because honest players will loose confidence in online "security", inflamatory wars will begin on forums with peoples accusing other to cheat (wether these accusations are justified or not doesn't matter... accusations have no impact when everybody believes the software is safe, they begin to hurt and instillate the doubt when most believes the software isn't fully safe)... all these leading to a dramatic reduction of the online crowd after some time.

[Viking]

Why is it that everyone assumes that we all are onliners? 95-99% of the users of this sim are offliners and most don’t give a hoot about all the online ranks and points.

I will use what is available in hard and software to make this simulation as realistic and enjoyable as possible and I will ask no one of permission to do so!

A small clique of militant online users have for years dominated and controlled the forum, debating and development of the sim but thanks to the mods the power and control is now in the hands of the users.
This is the biggest shot in the arm that this sim had had in years!

To not exploit this development would be foolish and will seriously hamper the sale and life of the simulation we all care for so much

It can be made better and more realistic for the majority and the minority tries for selfish hierarchical reasons to put a stick in the wheel.

[Rama]

Originally Posted by Viking

Why is it that everyone assumes that we all are onliners? 95-99% of the users of this sim are offliners and most don’t give a hoot about all the online ranks and points.

Actually I don't believe these numbers. I know a lot of offliners too, and I think the correct statement should be: " 95-99% of the peoples that purchased this sim are offliners"... most of them having garbaged the game since long time, some of them playing once a month or less, and a few relativelly active (playing at least once a week).
based about the peoples I talked with (in meetings, sim events in RL, etc...), my guess is that the number of active offliners isn't bigger than onliners.

... but in any case, it doesn't matter... offliners got everything's open with the 4.08 hack... they can't ask for more.
So the remaining problem IS with onliners.

I will use what is available in hard and software to make this simulation as realistic and enjoyable as possible and I will ask no one of permission to do so!

And Let me tell you.... as long it doesn't ruin my online play... I don't care. You can do everything you want in your home.
I just hope 4.09 will restore a secure online play, in order to stop a reduction of the online crowd that will decrease if not...

.../... To not exploit this development would be foolish and will seriously hamper the sale and life of the simulation we all care for so much

On this one you're totally wrong.
Most of the offline purchasers did buy IL2 originally... then garbaged it. Much less of them bought PF and even less 1946.
The one that did, did it only because there was very active forums + lots of free advertizing with screenshots, movies, Stunt patrol (including in RL meetings), and passionated onliners making demonstrations in various RL events like Sim Salon, etc... All of these done by offliners.
You also forget that a lot of content of IL2/AEP/PF/1946 were donne by modders (a big part of the planes and cockpits, maps, etc...) with official M:1C control, and you got also a lot of skinners, mission creators, online war creators, etc....
A huge part of what's inside and outside the game was done by players.... MOST of them beiing onliners... So the game wont be what it is without the onliners.... it probably would just be a long forgotten sim, just used by a few nostalgics...
... or be the toy of a reduced offline modders crowd... like CFS3 for exemple.

So... you can spit on onliners as much as you want.... the game wont be what it is without them... and would probably have ceased to exist long time ago.