Mustang accident

Originally Posted by Jabo2009

whats wrong with that? Honestly, I dont get your message.

What world are you living in? car races and airshows should become strictly private again? organised only as VIP club events and the public has to stay on the other side of the fence and watch from 1km distance?

come on...you must be joking

No, he's saying that Reno air racing will be strictly private. Air racing has nothing to do with air shows.

[Jabo2009]

Originally Posted by IamNotDavid

No, he's saying that Reno air racing will be strictly private. Air racing has nothing to do with air shows.

what about that? it started as an public event from day 1, which made it legendary ...

http://www.redbullairrace.com/cs/Sat...01238611393596

Originally Posted by Jabo2009

what about that? it started as an public event from day 1, which made it legendary ...

You misspelled "infamous".

[winny]

Originally Posted by IamNotDavid

That includes the air show, which distorts the numbers.

The whole accident distorts the figures.

From a few sources it would appear that about 8,000 people were there on the day. If you take it as an isolated incident then obviously that's a much higher chance of being killed. But it only applies to that one race. If you take it as an isolated incident then the number of deaths per race would be 11, and it isn't.

If you get the total number of races, then the total number of people who attended these races and the total number of people killed you'd get the average chance of being killed at the race. I couldn't find total attendance to date, or how many races there have been since it started.

But, 30,000+ people were killed in the US by traffic related accidents.
If it's about unaccetable numbers of people dying then however you dress it up it's trivial when compared to other accidents.

If it's about people smashing vintage warplanes into the ground then why mention deaths. Racing any machine is, has always been, and will always be, dangerous to the participants and the spectators. But the number of people who die is miniscule as a percentage of the overall death total for a year.

Total number of deaths in the USA in 2009 - 2,423,712 - total killed by an out of control aircraft that was involved in a race - 11. (this is actually wrong because I'm using 2009 and nobody died as a result of watching an air race in 2009) But you see my point.

It was tragic but it was also a freak.

Originally Posted by winny

It was tragic but it was also a freak.

Aircraft crash regularly at Reno. As I have pointed out repeatedly, 2 pilots die for every 5 events. That one of them finally crashed into the crowd is not especially freakish considering how often they crash.

[Crumpp]

Originally Posted by Jabo2009

what about that? it started as an public event from day 1, which made it legendary ...

http://www.redbullairrace.com/cs/Sat...01238611393596

No, the first Reno air races were not open to the public. After Bill Stead died, they became public events.

The first Reno air races, in 1964 and 1965, were organized by World War II flying ace Bill Stead. They took place at Sky Ranch airfield, a dirt strip barely 2,000 feet (610 m) long, which was located in present-day Spanish Springs. After Stead AFB (20 miles to the west, and named in honor of Bill's brother, Croston Stead) was closed in 1966, that field was turned over for public use and the races have been held there since then.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reno_Air_Races

When the Reno Air Races started in 1964, they were based on the premise that out in Nevada’s high desert, where there was no one around to suffer collateral damage, all bets were off. If you came to race, you knew the risk and accepted the consequences.

http://www.larrylowe.com/content/air-racing-101

There is no money to be made racing airplanes. Owners only have the opportunity to spend a lot of their hard earned wealth doing it. Owners do it because they love it. Opening it to the public was just a way to share their passion for aviation. It will go back to being a private venture for those who have worked hard to own these aircraft and not something shared with those not fortunate enough to have them.

[Sammi79]

Originally Posted by IamNotDavid

Aircraft crash regularly at Reno. As I have pointed out repeatedly, 2 pilots die for every 5 events. That one of them finally crashed into the crowd is not especially freakish considering how often they crash.

It is absolutely freakish considering it has happened only once in the entire history of the sport.

You seem to fail to grasp the amount of racing that goes on at Reno, It is hardly 1 event. Several days qualifying followed by a week of heat racing with several races per day, is as I have pointed out to you repeatedly, closely comparable to a whole season in F1 which has a higher death rate per year.

If people want to kill themselves having fun in their own machines, or want to get close enough to watch the spectacle therefore accepting the slight risk that an aircraft may crash on them then who are you or anyone to tell them that they shouldn't? Do you think people would be thankful for being deprived of their passion? I personally can think of worse ways to go.

[winny]

Originally Posted by IamNotDavid

Aircraft crash regularly at Reno. As I have pointed out repeatedly, 2 pilots die for every 5 events. That one of them finally crashed into the crowd is not especially freakish considering how often they crash.

It's racing - it's the very edge of performance - people die racing motorcycles all the time. Isle of Man TT kills at least one rider per year, That's 1 for each event.

I beg to differ, it's extremley freakish. It happened directly in front of the crowd, it happened at low level, it has never happened before. Explain to me how it's not a freak?

2 pilots per 5 events = 1 every 2 and a half years. More people die in the US from lightning strikes per year.

Originally Posted by Sammi79

It is absolutely freakish considering it has happened only once in the entire history of the sport.

You seem to fail to grasp the amount of racing that goes on at Reno, It is hardly 1 event. Several days qualifying followed by a week of heat racing with several races per day, is as I have pointed out to you repeatedly, closely comparable to a whole season in F1 which has a higher death rate per year.

The fact that it has only happened once does not necessarily make it freakish. The sample size (47) isn't very big. I out of 47 really isn't that freakish, especially when you consider how often they crash.

And is isn't close to an F1 season at all. Each F1 event also has qualifying and practice. A Reno event is similar to a single F1 event, not an entire season. Comparing a single Reno event to an entire season of F1 is absurd.

Originally Posted by Sammi79

If people want to kill themselves having fun in their own machines, or want to get close enough to watch the spectacle therefore accepting the slight risk that an aircraft may crash on them then who are you or anyone to tell them that they shouldn't? Do you think people would be thankful for being deprived of their passion?

Reno racers don't have the right to put people in danger just because they want an audience. Nor do I care what they think about being shut down.

Originally Posted by winny

It's racing - it's the very edge of performance - people die racing motorcycles all the time. Isle of Man TT kills at least one rider per year, That's 1 for each event.

Racing motorcycles is probably the only thing dumber than racing aircraft.

Originally Posted by winny

2 pilots per 5 events = 1 every 2 and a half years. More people die in the US from lightning strikes per year.

The sample size of "people in the US" is considerably larger than "Reno pilots". But thanks for proving my point about not understanding how dangerous it is.