Friday 2010-12-10 Dev. video update and Discussion

I wanted to post this before but just didnt have time:

As Oleg explained, the flame output of an exhaust is affected by factors like temperature and pressure. Flames visibility is due mainly to lighting factors (it'll be harder to see flames on a sunny day), but they're always there (bear in mind that what you see is the output of the avgas combustion straight from the combustion chamber!).
Exhaust fire shouldn't be confused with backfire though, which is an external combustion of a too rich mixture which causes flames like this


Oleg, I love the work you're doing, the attention to details as usual is surprising and comes from a man who obviously has experience with aviation, my humble suggestion is to keep the flames towards the red/blue spectrum more than yellow, since the temperatures involved are far higher than a "yellow flame" when it comes to exhaust output. Another important aspect is to keep them subtle (in terms of transparency/alpha channel) but visible from distance (thinking of the Zerstoerer night fighters spotting the engine exhausts of Lancasters at a certain distance).

[BP_Tailspin]

Originally Posted by kalimba

Oleg must be laughing outloud at home tonight: Look at this , honey, ! I told you it would take less that 2 days before they get at each others throat arguing about..guess what this time ? exhaust flame color at night!!!...hahahaha!
Next week, I will ask them about tire pressure....It will be a carnage !!! Can't wait till next update !

[150GCT_Veltro]

About map.
Dimension are enough but i agree about Duxford. Would have been better have it.......... Why? You know it.

However my question is. Would be possible to fly this map also online or we'll have dogfight style maps with islands ecc. ecc.?

[alexei1789]

Hi Oleg and thanks a lot for the weekly updates !
looks like we're gonna have a wonderfull flight sim.

it's my first post, and please apologize if the subject has been already chatted, i haven't found the answer.

QUESTION:
- The screenshots show fuel tank selector knob in cockpit... will fuel cunsumption influence centering/trimming of the airplane ?

- a suggestion: if this very realistic management is really implemented in the released game, it would be nice to have precise doc on the DVD, i.e. admission pressure and rpms for different flight condition, time to deplete a fuel tank,... the kind of data that is in the flight manual
otherwise even solo flying shall be difficult !

-will we have random failures ? (not only engine, but gun jamming, radio down, gear or flaps innoperative...)
they might have been common it the crash-programm building of materials during the war.

Thanks a lot
Alexis

NB: i don't mean there's too much realism, i'd just like to have the information to run "smoothly" the engine.

Originally Posted by Sutts

I don't see this as a squabble at all. It's been a useful and interesting discussion with opportunities to learn new things. Oleg asked whether the flames were too yellow on the running engine. From all the evidence and experience posted here it is clear that yellow flames are generally only expelled on initial start up or when the engine is damaged in some way.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I haven't seen one video here showing regular yellow flames coming from a running engine. All are either blue or red once the initial startup is complete. Also no night shots show the side panels being lit up by the exhaust flames. That backs up my personal experience from 2 night runs on a Lanc and a Merlin Spitfire.

I think the thread has done its job well.

You are right Stutts. In every new Fryday Update we do learn a lot about WW2 from lots of well informed members...
But it doen't take long before somebody disagrees with someone's opinion, and instead of politely making a comment,replies with a harsh and useless remark, often beeing a personnal attack....As a father of 2 young boys, I think that my overall patience is well challenged everyday in the real world, so when I come here to enjoy good company and admire Oleg's work, it is very irritating to witness such a behavior... And in this forum , it is exactly like at home : kids play togheter, happy with the new toy, and you can be sure it won't be long before screams and tears...

Salute !

[Daniël]

Originally Posted by alexei1789

Hi Oleg and thanks a lot for the weekly updates !
looks like we're gonna have a wonderfull flight sim.

it's my first post, and please apologize if the subject has been already chatted, i haven't found the answer.

QUESTION:
- The screenshots show fuel tank selector knob in cockpit... will fuel cunsumption influence centering/trimming of the airplane ?

- a suggestion: if this very realistic management is really implemented in the released game, it would be nice to have precise doc on the DVD, i.e. admission pressure and rpms for different flight condition, time to deplete a fuel tank,... the kind of data that is in the flight manual
otherwise even solo flying shall be difficult !

-will we have random failures ? (not only engine, but gun jamming, radio down, gear or flaps innoperative...)
they might have been common it the crash-programm building of materials during the war.

Thanks a lot
Alexis

NB: i don't mean there's too much realism, i'd just like to have the information to run "smoothly" the engine.

No.3 : Should be. If I remember it right I don't excactly know what things will random fail, but I think some things.

No.2 + 3 : Would be very nice

[Richie]

I wonder if grass will move in prop wash. I was kind of hoping in the first video that that one Spitfire would swing right around and blow the grass.

[Spinnetti]

So, some may know already, but "proper" color of flame is not just what you like, but depends on many factors including Fuel type and Mixture, and mixture varies by type and amount of boost. Actual flame color is relative to combustion temperature and oxygen concentration. Generally speaking, the leaner the mixture, the "bluer" the flame, and the richer, the more yellow it is. At full boost, you tend to run richer to avoid burning a piston, and it should be more yellow. At cruise, it should be leaner, and thus bluer. For game purposes, I would probably have a couple settings - yellower for start up and full power, and bluer for all other settings - Important to note, but generally the only time you see any flame at all is on a missfire. If the engine is running in tune, there should be little missfires, and thus not much flame (although even a 2% missfire rate is still about 11 missfires/sec on a 16 cyl at 2000 rpm if I did the math right). The flame occurs when the unburned mixture hits the hot exhaust and combusts in the exhaust stack.... This is the general truth, but I'm sure experts could refine the exact details.

let's not forget that the flaming alternation of different exhausts is more visible at low revs/idle. When the engine is on cruise the blue flames are more constant from all the exhausts, as the engine is working at higer revs.

[AMVI_Superblu]

Originally Posted by leggit

awesome...maybe a little red or orange would be good.

Agree!!
Thanks for update Oleg !