Realistic joysticks/throttles

[Honeymonster]

I'm not implying they are not worth the money. I have already made the point that constructing this kind of thing is labor intensive and a cottage industry. You do end up with a product of very high quality. The problem is how many of the simmers here can justify that kind of money on a stick without getting brutally beaten by the wife on its arrival?

Also if you had 470 euros laying about most people would benefit more from upgrading their graphics card rather than their joystick.

Of course for the select few this is an excellent product, and those who are single or have very understanding wife's are sure to buy it.

I know I would...

[xnomad]

What I was thinking about the other day is this:

Someone has to buy the rights to the MS FFB2 and expand on it. Build it as a base like the Tarmac aces one, where you can add different stick types.

I'd love to have a full length KG13 Bf109 stick with FFB. Or am I getting it wrong and the Tarmac Aces one is FFB? I can't really tell from the website, but it's very expensive. Not sure if my wife would be happy with me spending a lot on a stick and base.

I go through one new surfboard a year, but that's a sports item so she has no problem with the $600 there.

[flyingblind]

The thing about making a replica Spit column is that it is fine if all you want to fly is a Spit. It just wouldn't feel right if using it for a 109. It's the same if you build a pit modeled too closely to an actual cockpit - it becomes restrictive. I am sure there is a market for replica parts but personally, because I fly many different types of planes I would prefer a more generic style because I can fly a spit or anything else without losing immersion. I think it would be nice to have a stick with a more period feel to it with more WWII style switches and buttons. The only thing that might be quite good would be to design an attachment that some DIYer could fit to his joystick shaft in place of the existing grip and then supply a range of replica grips which could be simply plugged in or out depending which plane you were using.

[Zkirby]

Like I stated earlier, we are in the early stages of this project. I'm an avid aviation buff as well as simulator fan. I'm currently active duty Navy and fly the EA-6B Prowler. On the side my father and I are in the middle of building a vans RV-8 Experimental aircraft. So far we are kicking around a few ideas, they are as follows:

3 ways to get the control stick you desire:

1 - A standard joystick (size wise). Size and feel will be very authentic, materials TBD. It would be a plug and play, programmable of course, joystick but only stand about 12 inches high or so.

2 - A full size joystick, for those who have the room and prefer a full length stick. Telescoping may be a viable option to allow for slightly different setups/seat heights etc.

3 - Stick kit. This would be the bare bones to mod a current stick, not very high on our want to do list as we then have to deal with warrantees and other people tearing apart their already good working joystick.

As for the first two options, our initial idea is to make our base accept all of our sticks i.e. you could detach your current, say spitfire stick, and plug in your BF-109 stick etc. Buttons would be historic with accessories or attachments available. Although we understand the constraints with current sims and the need for more buttons there are other options, albeit they cost money but the new trackIR setup is amazing and voids the need for a coolie hat to control your view. As for throttle quadrants they would have the 2-3 main levers and trim wheels and be as period correct but on the base would be a multitude of buttons, sliders, levers, etc. all within reach and all programmable.

Force feedback: I don't think we will be going down this road. The sticks will most likely be free floating with adjustable dampener/stiffeners/springs so when released the stick would not just flop over to the edge. More to come on this.

Materials: We believe in doing things the right way. We will be using a lot of high grade materials but will not sacrifice playability/affordability just to say we used grade 9 aviation bolts and fasteners. Where injection molded plastics will suffice and not take away from the overall feel/look we will probably use it as long as it holds up well. We do however love the feel and look of raw or anodized aluminum so who knows.

Again, feedback is what I'm looking for at this time. Hopefully we will have a few concept drawings to post in a few weeks/months. As for now, I have a lot of research to do. Luckily Paul Allen owns and flies a spit out of Arlington field which is about an hour away. A field trip is in order.
Zach Kirby

[revi]

I have modded my Cyborg FFB stick to a full length size, to give me the feel I had a control column in my grasp that my arm could use, not just my wrist as was the case with the stick out of the box.
This has been both easily accomplished as well as one of the best modifications/additions to gaming - for me.
From doing this I learnt the height of your stick needs to be adjustable, as everyones set up is going to be different.
Force feedback is crucial for me. I wouldnt buy a stick without it. No matter how good looking a stick is, the immersion factor is gone without FFB.
I do like a solid and weighty feel on the stick/column although materials dont concern me too much as long as the feel is there.
Authentic looking buttons/switches +1. No good on the base tho.
Selling interchangeable sticks for generic base is a great idea.
Most importantly, as you will be well aware, its not just the flight simmer who you have to sell this to, its more his other half.
So keep the cost down or you'll join the ranks of the other exclusive fanatics.

[Sokol1]

The thing about making a replica Spit column is that it is fine if all you want to fly is a Spit. It just wouldn't feel right if using it for a 109.

Just imagine that you are a pilot in Swiss 109.



I look for KG13-B - Tarmac Aces plan in next version of these change B-Knof in 5 way switch, so you have 8 buttons. But they actual cost is prohibitive.

Since Force Feedback involve royalties to Imersion, this is a No Go for small scale production.

I like the idea of kit for MOD actual joystick.
Imagine that someone have a CH Fighterstick and buy a kit to change to KG13-B,
whit 8 buttons in WWII grip. But left unused another 8 + HAT...

Just include in kit a small switch panel to handle this leftover buttons.
Something like this AV8R MOD:





Sokol1

[Doc_uk]

Website
http://spitfiresite.com/2010/04/spit...ct-review.html

[VO101_MMaister]

Your business idea is mostly welcomed. I think the critical thing is to find the right price/performance balance.
I guess to sell grips to existing sticks is a good idea. You can use the same grips to your base as well, so you can manufacture these parts in greater numbers what keeps the price tag lower.

If you design a base which can handle both short and full length sticks (with some adjsutments), and has the immersion of a real flight column (no center point, damped movement) that could be a hit as well.
The FFB would be nice, but not at all costs. What would be great though to have some kind of mechanical trim on the y (elevator) axis.

Good Luck
MM

[CharveL]

How about a standard base with connectors that allow you to interchange different control columns? That could be a bit more initial planning and engineering but offer a lot of value to a simmer that likes to fly more than one plane.

Just plug in and connect different control columns.

I don't have the place so likely I never will buy one (also because I rent a flat and I have the faint feeling that my landlord would not be too enthousiastic about me screwing the thing to the floor).

I think adjustability and modularity is the two most important thing with ranking in just this order. Adjustability for me is the key to comfortably flying. Beware that your devices should fit to a wide range of people with different sizes, ranging from kid size to giant size.

Adjustable functions would be for me: distance of pedals to the stick, distance between the two pedals, height of the stick, height of the pedals.

I would like to have the brakes on the pedals (independantly moving). For the Spit however you would need the brakes on the column so this might be incompatible with modularity.

Force Feedback is essential but one should be able to turn it off.

However, if you really want to stay authentic it may be limiting in the buttons that can be integrated into the throttle lever or the stick, so perhaps you could offer as an addin some panels with programmable buttons and axes that can be easily attached to the frame.