Speaking of Guns...

[ATAG_Bliss]

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II

I think the no need for maintenance of AKs is surely a bit overrated, but it's true, you can leave them to themselves and they will keep on working, extremely simple guns but obviously not that accurate. Helluva fierce thing to use in close combat though!

No it's not overrated. We tried about everything with them in theater. They just plain almost always fire or can be made to fire very easily in the worst conditions.

oh, if we're talking about big assault rifles I'd rather stay classic (and classy) with my Garand M1.
30-06 calibre is by far the best compromise, it's a whole whopping kg lighter than the SCAR and keeps 8 rounds in its very sleek design, which means you can use it also on prone position without the magazine being in the way.
The M-14 is another lovely gun, and maybe more versatile than the Garand.

I haven't heard much good about Rumanian stuff, but never tried it myself. Even their version of the Dragunov is a bit crap.

I wasn't really talking about big assault rifles. Just something the OP started, wanting something with a 7.62 - aka SCAR-H. The only reason I mentioned heavy weapons is because I hardly get a chance to play with the light arms as I deal in 60mm mortors, Mk47's, M19's, Mk44, M2/M2A1 etc. and only bring out the small stuff when we are not just wasting ammo at the range.

[Jaws2002]

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II

oh, if we're talking about big assault rifles I'd rather stay classic (and classy) with my Garand M1.
30-06 calibre is by far the best compromise, it's a whole whopping kg lighter than the SCAR and keeps 8 rounds in its very sleek design, which means you can use it also on prone position without the magazine being in the way.
The M-14 is another lovely gun, and maybe more versatile than the Garand.

I haven't heard much good about Rumanian stuff, but never tried it myself. Even their version of the Dragunov is a bit crap.

Ask the guy that told you a Garand is 1kg lighter than the SCAR-H to give you your money back. the garand was a great rifle, (not assault rifle), back in it's time, but it's time pzssed 70 years ago.
The heavy scar weights 7.9lbs. A Garand around 10lbs. The scar is the lightest. 308 assault rifle out there and it has everything you would want from a modern weapon.
The Romanian AK's are not considered that good. They work like most other ak's, but the Russian and bulgarian are the best. From what I heared the Arsenal saigas are some of the most popular AK rifles this days. Quality at a good price.

[Sternjaeger II]

Originally Posted by ATAG_Bliss

No it's not overrated. We tried about everything with them in theater. They just plain almost always fire or can be made to fire very easily in the worst conditions.

Yes but they need cleaning and maintenance like any other rifle,that's what I meant. The mechanics are extremely simple and primordial,but it's still an highly effective gun for close combat,with a fantastic ammo.

I wasn't really talking about big assault rifles. Just something the OP started, wanting something with a 7.62 - aka SCAR-H. The only reason I mentioned heavy weapons is because I hardly get a chance to play with the light arms as I deal in 60mm mortors, Mk47's, M19's, Mk44, M2/M2A1 etc. and only bring out the small stuff when we are not just wasting ammo at the range.

Yeah I understand, but the .308 is not on the same level of the 7.62x39, that's what I meant
Never used the SCAR personally, but I heard about some issues with the bolt and extractor?

[Sternjaeger II]

Originally Posted by Jaws2002

Ask the guy that told you a Garand is 1kg lighter than the SCAR-H to give you your money back. the garand was a great rifle, (not assault rifle), back in it's time, but it's time pzssed 70 years ago.
The heavy scar weights 7.9lbs. A Garand around 10lbs. The scar is the lightest. 308 assault rifle out there and it has everything you would want from a modern weapon.

Sorry,my memory is starting to fail me, a Garand is roughly 9.5lbs, although I bet that a modern, battle ready, SCAR-H with all modern gizmos like front knob grip, ACOG, light etc.. is not much lighter, and the M-1 still has a sleeker design and a better range. As per your age remark, the M-14 is the 50 years old evolution of the M-1, and it's still widely used by sharpshooters in the Army, Marines etc... Stuff like polymer stocks and lightened components gave a new life to an already solid design.

The Romanian AK's are not considered that good. They work like most other ak's, but the Russian and bulgarian are the best. From what I heared the Arsenal saigas are some of the most popular AK rifles this days. Quality at a good price.

Never tried a Bulgarian, but their gunsmithing is quite good, so it wouldn't surprise me if so were their AKs.

[ElAurens]

Every time I think about getting an AK I always seem to find something better to spend my money on. Currently they are over priced for their technology level, IMHO.

Back when I was competing in NRA type service rifle matches I had the chance to shoot 4 different platforms over the years. I started with an 1896/38 Swedish Mauser because it's all I had at the time. Then a buddy lent me his Springfield M1A (civilian version of the M 14). I then got my M1 Garand from the DCM, then finally ended up with a Rock River Ar 15 DCM National Match.

At long range (600 yards) the M1 Garand was peerless. I shot my best 10 shot string of my whole life with that rifle. Overall however, my scores went up about 20% (yup) when I switched to the AR platform. At close ranges (100 to 300 yds) it gave up nothing to the M1 and in the rapid fire portions of a match is was far far superior.

I enjoyed that old Swedish Mauser more than any of them though. Still have all of them too.

I'd love to have the SCAR H in 7.62x51, but I cannot justify the money for one now as my long gun shooting is all but done.

[CWMV]

Originally Posted by Sternjaeger II

I think the no need for maintenance of AKs is surely a bit overrated, but it's true, you can leave them to themselves and they will keep on working, extremely simple guns but obviously not that accurate. Helluva fierce thing to use in close combat though!



oh, if we're talking about big assault rifles I'd rather stay classic (and classy) with my Garand M1.
30-06 calibre is by far the best compromise, it's a whole whopping kg lighter than the SCAR and keeps 8 rounds in its very sleek design, which means you can use it also on prone position without the magazine being in the way.
The M-14 is another lovely gun, and maybe more versatile than the Garand.

I haven't heard much good about Rumanian stuff, but never tried it myself. Even their version of the Dragunov is a bit crap.

I politely disagree!
If anything I think the AK's reputation for reliability and ease of use/maintenance can not be overrated. Ive pulled these things out of Iraqi irrigation ditches, kicked open the bolt, locked, loaded and fired without issue. And these things had been in the mud so long that the stock had rotted away, and that's saying a lot for laminated wood!
The accuracy does leave a bit to be desired by western standards, but overall its acceptable for an assault rifle. Add to that the sheer power advantage of the x39 and ability to penetrate light cover and I would much rather have it than the 5.56.

Perhaps you can explain the garand thing to me. I loath the platform. Seriously it feels like I'm shouldering a 4x4 fence post. Nothing like a nice sleek 98K or even a Mosin-Nagant. Overall I'm not a fan.

As to the Romanian stuff it has gotten much better in recent years. The Romanian G kit is the kit by which all others are judged for your own home built gun, and the WASR series of rifles are much, MUCH better than they used to be. Canted sights and terrible mag wobble are a thing of the past. Add to that a whopping $400 price out the door (in a free state anyway, not here in the peoples republic of kalifornistan). Even the little Draco's are a nifty little gun. Surprisingly accurate at 100 meters for such a short AKM. Nearly my favorite pistol-nearly.

The PSL that you mention actually has nothing to do with the Dragunov. Its a DM weapon yes, but the construction is unrelated. Its based off of the RPK receiver with the heavier trunnions. The biggest thing going against it is the barrel-long and skinny. Mine has a tendency to climb due to barrel whip during quick bursts, but nothing dramatic. Again perfectly acceptable for a 400 meter rifle. If you actually take slow, deliberate shots with it it is surprisingly accurate even with the surplus ammo flooding the market right now. With handloads and slow fire Ive actually watched someone pull off a 1.5 MOA group pretty easily with the platform.

If I lived in a free state Id probably buy two WASR's and a boat load of ammo for the price of an Arsenal. not to mention Arsenal has, in the past, taken strong stances against the 2nd amendment and heavily discriminated against certain states, to the point of taking retailers to court for selling their product to California regardless of the legal nature of the transactions.

[CWMV]

Originally Posted by Jaws2002

...From what I heared the Arsenal saigas are some of the most popular AK rifles this days. Quality at a good price.

Oh man youve been lied to!

I suppose it depends on what you mean by Quality and good price.

A quality weapon would not have a finish that peels off, which is something bordering on common with Arsenals.
Then the good price thing. I just cant agree with ya there. Think of it like this. Arsenal takes a $350 Saiga (which they get for about $280, the last time I looked at RSR wholesale anyway that was the dealer price), adds a new trigger mechanism and does the butstock/front end conversion.

I did this myself for less than $200. But arsenal wants to charge up to and over $1000 for their rifles? insanity. They change nothing about the gun other than cosmetics. Heck I can talk someone through a conversion or just point them to a step by step website that will show you how to do it. Save yourself $500 bucks for ammo and other rifles.

[raaaid]

gootta love those who didnt lose contact with their inner child

[Sternjaeger II]

Originally Posted by raaaid

gootta love those who didnt lose contact with their inner child

..why don't you stick to your threads instead of trolling on others' as well?

[raaaid]

yep sorry couldnt avoid it wont participate again in thi thread since have nothing to say about it