Strange archery

[Grim.Reaper]

I also commented about this over at Wargamer.com. In one battle, I had 2 archer units on the top of a hill, with a single calvary unit very close to me but stationary. I opened fire with volley after volley of arrows, and not a single death. This was going on for minutes. Then their infantry came at me. Same thing. Volley after volley with not a single casulaty.

I don't care if I have the worst archers and they have the best armor, I should at least get lucky with killing some, especially after I hit them time after time.

Mitra had me do a 1-1 battle to test it. When I did that, I did see some casualties, but still seemed way too little. I had units right in front of me, getting hit by volley after volley. Some did die, but at the rate and distance I was hitting them, a lot more should have been dead.

Don't get me wrong, I don't want archers to become super units, but they don't seem to do much. However, I did notice in the 1-1 that they would become wounder quite a bit.

[Piemaster]

I only use crossbows and I have noticed that the enemy die exponentially (slowly at first, but then die faster and faster) when they have several units of crossbows shooting them all at once. I suggest having multiple units of archers/ranged focus on a single unit, that way you can take them down faster.

[Grim.Reaper]

Originally Posted by Piemaster

I only use crossbows and I have noticed that the enemy die exponentially (slowly at first, but then die faster and faster) when they have several units of crossbows shooting them all at once. I suggest having multiple units of archers/ranged focus on a single unit, that way you can take them down faster.

As stated in my example, I did have 2 archer units attacking the same unit. My units were archers so maybe crossbows are stronger.

[Piemaster]

You should test crossbows for this, most likely they are more powerful than the bows. I have also heard that the western archers are crummy in general, whether this is true or not I'm not certain.

[Grim.Reaper]

Originally Posted by Piemaster

You should test crossbows for this, most likely they are more powerful than the bows. I have also heard that the western archers are crummy in general, whether this is true or not I'm not certain.

Even if I test this wont change the fact the archers are weak. Don't get me wrong, I don't want my archers to kill everything on sight, but if I have 2 units on the top of a hill shooting at a stationary target, some better die. I could have the worst archers and my enemy the best units, but showering them with 100's of arrows better kill some of them even if with just lucky shots.

[Goblin Wizard]

Some facts about arrow script:
(..\data\aix\weapon\inf.g1.archer.arrow.static\inf .g1.archer.arrow.static.aix)

Each soldier has 24 HP.

Types of arrow damage:

[*] = ;const DeadDamage = 24;
[*] = ;const HardDamage = 12;
[*] = ;const LiteDamage = 4;

An example of damage probability with western bow against unarmored target:

[*] = ;                  if Distance < 5 then
[*] = ;                  begin
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 9 then HPDec := DeadDamage
[*] = ;                     else
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 11 then HPDec := HardDamage
[*] = ;                     else
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 12 then HPDec := LiteDamage;
[*] = ;                  end

[*] = ;                  if Distance < 45 then
[*] = ;                  begin
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 3 then HPDec := DeadDamage
[*] = ;                     else
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 6 then HPDec := HardDamage
[*] = ;                     else
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 8 then HPDec := LiteDamage;
[*] = ;                  end

[*] = ;                  if Distance < 95 then
[*] = ;                  begin
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 2 then HPDec := HardDamage
[*] = ;                     else
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 4 then HPDec := LiteDamage;
[*] = ;                  end

[*] = ;                  if Distance < 100 then
[*] = ;                  begin
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 2 then HPDec := LiteDamage;
[*] = ;                  end

As you noticed there is no chance to kill a soldier in one shot (no possibility of dealing DeadDamage) at long range. If distance is greater that 94 meters you need 6 successful hits to kill a soldier! Even at medium range like 45 meters chance of dealing DeadDamage is very low. And all of this is against unarmored target!

Some examples of crossbow damage (xbow against 0 armor):

[*] = ;                  if Distance < 5 then
[*] = ;                  begin
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 10 then HPDec := DeadDamage
[*] = ;                     else
[*] = ;                     HPDec := HardDamage;
[*] = ;                  end

[*] = ;                  if Distance < 40 then
[*] = ;                  begin
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 6 then HPDec := DeadDamage
[*] = ;                     else
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 7 then HPDec := HardDamage
[*] = ;                     else
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 9 then HPDec := LiteDamage;
[*] = ;                  end

[*] = ;                  if Distance < 100 then
[*] = ;                  begin
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 3 then HPDec := DeadDamage
[*] = ;                     else
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 4 then HPDec := HardDamage
[*] = ;                     else
[*] = ;                     if CubeRes <= 6 then HPDec := LiteDamage;
[*] = ;                  end

As you can see xbow is absolutely deadly at short range. Nearly every bolt kills. Of course at long range xbow is not so deadly but still has a chance of insta kill (unarmored target).
So If you don't like dev's archery system you can easily change it yourself.

[Grim.Reaper]

I don't doubt and have never doubted that is how the developer's scripted it since that is what is happening in the game, I am questioning whether that is accurate or not. Sure, I could update the scripts myself, but that is not something I really want to do for games I buy.

I don't know the precise distance between my units, but visually seemed very close and I was on top of a hill looking down. It would seem there would be some additional advantage for that as well.

[ThisIsRealWarfare]

Originally Posted by Grim.Reaper

I don't doubt and have never doubted that is how the developer's scripted it since that is what is happening in the game, I am questioning whether that is accurate or not. Sure, I could update the scripts myself, but that is not something I really want to do for games I buy.

I don't know the precise distance between my units, but visually seemed very close and I was on top of a hill looking down. It would seem there would be some additional advantage for that as well.

Go for changing yourself. They might patch it, but if you prefer a quick fix of it, go for the scripts
I will absolutely do that myself. Thank you very much Goblin Wizard for the scripts!

[ThisIsRealWarfare]

Goblin Wizard, I was wondering, as you seem to know about scripts and stuff: Do you possibly know how to change camera strafing? You've probably read what I said in other posts, (Camera wont strafe oblique, so it takes way longer time to get where you want, it's ineffective.. and so on), It'd be really grateful.

[Grim.Reaper]

Originally Posted by ThisIsRealWarfare

Go for changing yourself. They might patch it, but if you prefer a quick fix of it, go for the scripts
I will absolutely do that myself. Thank you very much Goblin Wizard for the scripts!

I am staying strong to see if the developers correct, unless somehow this is really historically accurate Let me know how things work out for you.