What is the best performing Red fighter & why?

[*Buzzsaw*]

Originally Posted by 5./JG27.Farber

The fear factor of the Spit IIa is gone...

Yes we have all noticed the Blue side's explosive complaints have dropped off when they realized not much has really changed.

Maybe the 109's can't play like cats play with mice with the Spits and Hurris right down on the deck anymore, but they can still do it over 10,000 where the bombers come in.

[MadTommy]

Originally Posted by macro

Im sure it would come down to personnal preference but mine is the 100 oct hurri. Fast up high and with boost on down low. Stable gun platform. Out turns 109's most of the time.

Just tested out the Hurri 100Oct... VERY nice.. i'm impressed.

Think i have found my new favourite.

[5./JG27.Farber]

Originally Posted by *Buzzsaw*

Yes we have all noticed the Blue side's explosive complaints have dropped off when they realized not much has really changed.

Maybe the 109's can't play like cats play with mice with the Spits and Hurris right down on the deck anymore, but they can still do it over 10,000 where the bombers come in.

Boo hoo... good thats where we all should be anyway.

[*Buzzsaw*]

Originally Posted by 5./JG27.Farber

Boo hoo... good thats where we all should be anyway.

]

In a Luftwaffles fantasy world maybe... it seems that's where a lot of the Blue community live, no interest in accuracy or realism, they just want their 'uber' plane.

The fact is, there was very little difference between the Spitfire's and 109E at higher alts. The 109E had a slightly better climb and better ceiling, the Spit IIA was actually faster.

Right now we have a fantasy world where the 109's can pull their zooms into the stratosphere over 10,000, or speed away, while the Spitfires and Hurricanes crawl around underneath.

But I guess it was too much to expect accuracy out of these developers.

[5./JG27.Farber]

Originally Posted by *Buzzsaw*

]

In a Luftwaffles fantasy world maybe... it seems that's where a lot of the Blue community live, no interest in accuracy or realism, they just want their 'uber' plane.

The fact is, there was very little difference between the Spitfire's and 109E at higher alts. The 109E had a slightly better climb and better ceiling, the Spit IIA was actually faster.

Right now we have a fantasy world where the 109's can pull their zooms into the stratosphere over 10,000, or speed away, while the Spitfires and Hurricanes crawl around underneath.

But I guess it was too much to expect accuracy out of these developers.

Please dont tell me Im living in a fantasy world and say things that are NOT true... ARE YOU ON THE LATEST STEAM PATCH?


I voted for 100 oct fuel and many red bugs. Dont accuse me of living in a fantasy world and asking for uber blue aircraft. There has been little asking from the blue side and infact many blue pilots have supported the remoddling of red aircraft... You should have been here six months ago!

Allot of reds also choose to fly on the deck!


Actually about half of blue fly low for instant furballs devoiding us more "historically based" flying blue the engagement at all!

You can no longer, in a 109 with equal energy, escape a spit in anything other than a dive... He can keep pace in level flight and will catch you in a climb by waiting till he is underneath you before pulling up!


I heard there is a problem with the spit 100 oct about 3km's, try flying the Spit Ia instead of the spit Ia 100 oct... I hear its better at high alt...

[trademe900]

High altitudes are really irrelevant at this stage given the very poor modelling of higher altitudes and stuttering problems with red planes.

At 10,000 and under where all the fighting takes place the modelling is generally satisfactory and here the spit 2a is the best. Sure the 100 octane outspeeds it a little but max speed is really irrelevant unless in a long chase across the channel where energy state is the same. The 100 octane has bad overheating problems.

Next I'd say Hurricane 100oct which is what I fly most of the time. It does not have the chronic overheating problems and really turns well at certain speeds, but what's important is that it is an extremely stable gun platform and you can get shots in at longer range with confidence than flying a spit or 109. Especially good for bombers as you can unload the guns into the enemy plane with accuracy and then break away earlier. However any good 109 pilot who finds hurricane on their tail will immediately bleed off the hurricanes energy with a few quick rolls and then put the aircraft into a steep climb and speed away with relative ease. It's amazing how many 109 pilots don't do this though... oh damn, now i've spoiled the secret!

[*Buzzsaw*]

Originally Posted by 5./JG27.Farber

You can no longer, in a 109 with equal energy, escape a spit in anything other than a dive... He can keep pace in level flight and will catch you in a climb by waiting till he is underneath you before pulling up!

Not the case over 10,000 ft, and under, you can do the 'Bunt and pullup, Bunt and pullup' routine or use your superior rollrate.

I'll give you an example how your claim of Spits at equal energy being able to catch 109's is not accurate.

I was at 20,000 ft on the ATAG server in a Spit IIA, spotted a formation of Blue bombers at approx. 15,000, with two 109's on top of them at approx. 17,000 up sun from the bombers. There were several Spits and Hurris slightly lower trying to climb up to attack the bombers. If things went as usual the 109's in the sun would dive on the Red planes and shoot them out of the air before they could close on the bombers.

I approached the formation and the 109s with the intention of disrupting this situation by driving the 109's down to the level of the bombers where the Spits and Hurris climbing up would have a better chance.

I started with a dive on one of the 109's, I was up sun of him, but he saw me and avoided my pass which showed a speed of 240 mph on my gauge at 18,500 ft. I had much more speed and energy than he did, or his partner. I pulled up smoothly to regain my alt, but because of the poor climb of the Spits at that alt, did not regain 20,000 ft. I was still at least 2000 ft above the 109's. My temperatures were already climbing despite having rpm of 2600 and boost of +0 before the attack, temp of 90, now they were close to 95, after using 2800 and higher boost in my zoom. One 109 went one direction, the other the opposite, trying to split. I moved towards the one which was the higher which was approx. 4 km away and climbing very steeply. He turned, (obviously having to bleed some speed doing this, and obviously going very slowly after the steep climb, and came back at me dropping his nose a little to gain speed. He passed under me, with me at at least 1500 ft higher. We both pulled up into zooms which put us about 2000 meters apart. I watched as he gained on me in the zoom, and in fact pulled out just a hair below my alt. I came out over the top and rolled out into level flight out at a higher speed than him, pointing at him, he had practically stalled at the top of his zoom. I started to move back towards him, initially I was closing fairly rapidly. Instead of having to put down his nose and dive away, he started a climb away. As I closed, my speed bled off almost immediately, and my extremely poor climb was gaining me hardly any alt. I couldn't firewall the throttle and put rpms to 3000 because temps were already at 95. I watched as he simply climbed away from me, despite starting at lower speed and energy.

Sorry, I did nothing wrong in my maneuvers, I was simply flying a plane which is completely uncompetitive at those altitudes.

[5./JG27.Farber]

Originally Posted by *Buzzsaw*

I did nothing wrong in my maneuvers, I was simply flying a plane which is completely uncompetitive at those altitudes.

Always blame the aircraft! The first place I always look for the mistake is myself!

[Bounder!]

The Spitfire variants are sub par in performance to the 109 and Hurricane at altitudes above 15,000ft. There is, in addition, a bug with a number of the Spitfires at altitude; the Spit 1a 100 Oct is most severely effected but it is there on other variants - as you gain altitude the engine splutters and cuts out unless you run at reduced rpms and boost below anything like combat settings. I'm at a bit of a loss as to how we've been left with Spits in this state in the final patch.

As a Spitfire pilot at the moment you have to pick your variant on based on what altitude you want to fly which is fecking ridiculous if you pardon my French Altitude fighting might not be important to those that like to hug the deck on ATAG or Replica4 but it is important for campaigns like the SoW campaign where the fights start at 17-18 thousand feet but often end up going much much lower.

[bw_wolverine]

Bounder's right. It's very distressing to have the Spitfires end up the way they have. I just get the feeling that the Maddox games guys and 1C just had no real way to fix them and that the issues are tied to the service ceiling issues that they claim 'cannot be fixed without major changes in sequel'.

So we live with what we have. Plenty of 109s do silly things and leave themselves open to attack. If you find a 109 not doing silly things, then you'd better have friends with you watching your back, that's all I can say.