BF109 - Can't we just have the gunsight in the middle?

[Lixma]

Originally Posted by SQB

You have placed the eyes too far apart...

The 'Right Eye' image is spot on. The fully visible reticle is proof of that. (assuming the dev team have got their measurements correct).

The 'Left Eye' image is a bit of a guess. I had no gauge to measure how far I should shift the view-point to the left with the mouse to accurately recreate what the left eye would, in isolation, see. It doesn't matter so much, though. The picture was illustrative rather than scientific.

....but also, you can see the gun-sight AND out the front windscreen.

That's what I have been attempting to demonstrate (with varying degrees of success ).

It doesn't look like that picture you keep posting though, impossible to simulate 3d on 2d properly...

It's not an attempt to simulate 3D.

It's a simulation of how the Revi reticle would appear to a real 109 pilot with both eyes open.

Currently CoD simulates a Cyclops with one eye open, looking bang down the centreline of the aircraft.

Because of this unfortunate but necessary Cyclopean view we have had, for a decade now, a work-around; the Shift-F1 view.

More recently Track-IR has enabled the player to lean to the right and achieve a similar result. Unfortunately people are mistaking this as reality. People really do think Shift-F1 simulates what a 109/190 pilot had to do just to see their gun-sight.

[Wolf_Rider]

Thanks for being clearer on what you were trying to get across...


some were thinking, if only half the reticule is seen, only half the reticule gets overlayed, hence some of the difficulty you had.

[Buzpilot]

I see what you guys want to see, but you have narrowed it down to only the reticle. If we should have it like a reticle on front screen, it will be similar to holding your finger close to screen and pointing it upwards, you will still be able to read this(not too close), but there also will be two blurry fingers on each side of the words.
And then it would be like everything close to reticle will have to be double and blurry, to be realistic.

[Jaws2002]

The colimated gunsights work just like the modern red dots on rifles.
The sight projects a crosshair in front of the sight and the shooter can scan aim and shoot with both eyes open. You don't have to close one eye or move your head to the side to aim. You look with with both eyes at the target, one eye through the sight, and the brain will automatically create the combined image, with the dot in the midle.
Shooting both eyes open, specially with reflex sights, has some clear advantages, specially in a fluid combat situation, where your periferial vision is very important.
Same in a 109. The pilot didn't zoom in, or moved so much like in the game. The sight was right in front of his eye.

So Lixma is in a way correct. We have two eyes and a brain to combine the two images.
This looks quite good.


Of course our brain is very good at bluring things close to the eye that we don't focus on.
I kind of agree. The Shift+1 image is unnecesary restrictive in CoD.

[Wolf_Rider]

binocular vision won't work on a monitor though... it will only work in real life

[Voyager]

Originally Posted by Sauf

Correct, if the pilot leans a bit to the right! ie loosen straps. Back to where we started.

So leaning to the right requires 2-3 seconds of horsing around, and then bolts your head down?

You might want to see a chiropractor, because something is really wrong with your neck.

Originally Posted by Jaws2002

The colimated gunsights work just like the modern red dots on rifles.
The sight projects a crosshair in front of the sight and the shooter can scan aim and shoot with both eyes open. You don't have to close one eye or move your head to the side to aim. You look with with both eyes at the target, one eye through the sight, and the brain will automatically create the combined image, with the dot in the midle.
Shooting both eyes open, specially with reflex sights, has some clear advantages, specially in a fluid combat situation, where your periferial vision is very important.
Same in a 109. The pilot didn't zoom in, or moved so much like in the game. The sight was right in front of his eye.

So Lixma is in a way correct. We have two eyes and a brain to combine the two images.
This looks quite good.


Of course our brain is very good at bluring things close to the eye that we don't focus on.
I kind of agree. The Shift+1 image is unnecesary restrictive in CoD.

Now this thread evolved into a real good thing and I learned something. Thanks to Lixma and all the others explaining that thing with a lot of patience. Unlike before I now do think that this image IS what we should have ingame as the best representation of what we have in reality. My guess is also that with headshake the circle will wobble around the position as depicted on the image but stay intact, as long as one eye of the pilot sees the whole circle. We also now should get this kind of behaviour for sideway headshakes in Spits and Hurris as the effect would have been the same (not so though for vertical headshakes whatever plane).

For those not yet convinced: take your hand, hold it up in front of one of your eyes only at a certain distance (10-30cm is a good distance for demonstration) and focus on something in the background but try to mentally concentrate on the hand. You will see a half transparent, a little blurry hand superimposed to the background image you are focussing to. You can try this with other objects, too.

Could we get this to the developers somehow?

[JG52Krupi]

Originally Posted by 41Sqn_Stormcrow

I now understand what Lixma continually explains.

I just come to thinking that both the cockpit of the 109 and the 190 was sooo small that the final paralaxis was insufficient to make the pilot lean to the side in order to align to the sight.

See real historic picture of the 190, the revi's left edge as seen by the pilot is cockpit centred:


The Focke pilot actually sits quite centred while his right eye is spot on on the revi sight. The left edge of the reflector glass is centred as is the pilot's nose which is pressumably in the middle between both eyes. My guess is that the pilot sees the full image of the aim circle as much as I see my hand when I hold it in front of the right half of my face. And I still can regognize it as a hand but the image is that it is superimposed with the background like putting to photo slides together. You can easily try this yourself without any particular equipment.

It is a bit difficult as both eyes will focus at two different distances that is a bit strenuous when you hold your hand that way. However this problem is inexistent for the revi sight as the aim circle was projected as if in far away distance is I understand correctly, so no focus problem.

So that guys head is in the center is it HAHAHAHAHAHA, open your eyes.

[Baron]

Originally Posted by JG52Krupi

So that guys head is in the center is it HAHAHAHAHAHA, open your eyes.

Cant figure out why u are arguing against changing how shift F1 works in CoD.

Something tells me neither do u.

@Krupi:
irrelevant. Dismissed.