Inaccurate performance data for BOB fighters in COD comparing to RL data

[lane]

Dr. Alfred Price, Spitfire Mark I/II Aces 1939-41, (Osprey Publishing, 1996), p. 19.

[Glider]

Originally Posted by Seadog

I'm still waiting for someone to post something proving that at least one Spitfire/Hurricane BofB combat sortie was flown with 87 octane fuel...

Interestingly and probably the person most unlikely to give evidence I can. In July three spitfires shot down a He111 using 87 octane fuel. However before the doubters get excited, they were three aircraft attached to an OCU unit who formed an emergency flight in case of an opportunity.

All RAF aircraft were armed in case this happened including OCU units but OCU units didn't have 100 Octane fuel, so there was one combat using 87 octane.

[Seadog]

Originally Posted by Glider

Interestingly and probably the person most unlikely to give evidence I can. In July three spitfires shot down a He111 using 87 octane fuel. However before the doubters get excited, they were three aircraft attached to an OCU unit who formed an emergency flight in case of an opportunity.

All RAF aircraft were armed in case this happened including OCU units but OCU units didn't have 100 Octane fuel, so there was one combat using 87 octane.

Thanks!

[Al Schlageter]

It is possible that 245 (Northern Rhodesia) Squadron sent to Northern Ireland in July 1940 might have been still using 87 fuel as this was a backwater base well away from any combat.

I concur that Tomcat is most certainly trolling.

[NZtyphoon]

Originally Posted by Glider

Interestingly and probably the person most unlikely to give evidence I can. In July three spitfires shot down a He111 using 87 octane fuel. However before the doubters get excited, they were three aircraft attached to an OCU unit who formed an emergency flight in case of an opportunity.

All RAF aircraft were armed in case this happened including OCU units but OCU units didn't have 100 Octane fuel, so there was one combat using 87 octane.

I'm pretty sure you're thinking of an Operational Training Unit OTU, rather than an OCU, which was postwar?

5 OTU, Ashton Down and 6 OTU, Sutton Bridge both had Hurricanes while 7 OTU, Hawarden, seemed to have them for a short time http://www.rafweb.org/OTU_1.htm

On 14 August there was another He 111, this one from 8./KG27, shot down by a combination of 213 Sqn Hurricanes and 7 OTU Spitfires (The Blitz Then and Now Vol 1, p. 194).

[Glider]

Your right, it was OTU my mistake, looks like there were two combats with 87 octane.

[Al Schlageter]

Pips on the AHF has confirmed that he is the Pips from AAW.

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtop...?f=69&t=187113

[NZtyphoon]

Originally Posted by TomcatViP

In the series of " What archives tells us" here is the FLIGHT archives that I cited two days ago :

- There was no 100 octane fuel usage during BoB in the FC. Here I am putting my money on British pride that would hve pushed forward any of its usage (ok Brits are not French but never the less )

Sources : (http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchi...0-%201286.html)

1. "International power of the Merlin I and II was 950/990 h.p. at
2,600 r.p.m. at 12,250ft, and the maximum take-off output was
890 h.p. at 2,850 r.p.m."

2. Merlin III : "The power output of the standard engine,"
writes Harold Nockolds, "was 1,030 b.h.p. at 3,000 r.p.m. at
10,250ft with plus 6i lb boost. "

3. "the petrol normally used at that time was 87
octane"

What Mr Tomcat conveniently left out:
1. "International power of the Merlin I and II was 950/990 h.p. at 2,600 r.p.m. at 12,250ft, and the maximum take-off output was 890 h.p. at 2,850 r.p.m."

The 1938 Flight article http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchi...0-%203453.html states that "Figures are being quoted on the Rolls-Royce stand for the Merlin R.M. 2M rated on 100 octane fuel....Merlin II, III and IV gave 1,015 h.p for take off on the same (100 octane) fuel". This was before the modifications made allowing the boost to be raised to +12.

2. (NB:This paragraph refers to June 1937) "The power output of the standard engine," writes Harold Nockolds, "was 1,030 b.h.p. at 3,000 r.p.m. at 10,250ft with plus 6 1/4 lb boost. (The following was left out) Solely by opening the throttle, raising the supercharger pressure, and using fuel of higher octane," he goes on [the petrol normally used at the time was 87 octane] "the engine was made to develop no less than 2,160 b.h.p at 3,200 r.p.m with the supercharger giving 27 lb/sq in boost (albeit this was over a short period of about four minutes - my added comment)....But Elliot and Hives were perhaps even more satisfied with a 15-hr endurance run at 1,800 b.h.p., 3,200 r.p.m. and 22 lb boost..."

[41Sqn_Banks]

Originally Posted by Al Schlageter

Pips on the AHF has confirmed that he is the Pips from AAW.

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtop...?f=69&t=187113

Maybe the Pips here in this forum http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/member.php?u=3927 is also the same person.

[NZtyphoon]

Originally Posted by 41Sqn_Banks

Maybe the Pips here in this forum http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/member.php?u=3927 is also the same person.

Canberra, Australia - most certainly this is the same Pips. Perhaps he can post at the very least an archival reference number for the papers he discovered back in '04?