Friday 2011-02-04 Dev. update and Discussion

[Wutz]

Originally Posted by Jaws2002

About the BF-108.
Maybe we can somehow convince Mathias from Classic Hangar to make an addon to turn the 108 into a flyable plane.
He's working on it for FSX right now:

http://www.classics-hangar.de/phpBB3...&sd=a&start=40

And it looks bloody gorgeous.

That looks really nice!

[CharveL]

Looks good until he has to make a damage model for it too.

[fireflyerz]

blimey

[Luftwaffepilot]

Luthier,

how goes the process of editing the dev videos and translating it?
Will you get it done til friday?

Originally Posted by Jaws2002

About the BF-108.
Maybe we can somehow convince Mathias from Classic Hangar to make an addon to turn the 108 into a flyable plane.
He's working on it for FSX right now:

http://www.classics-hangar.de/phpBB3...&sd=a&start=40

And it looks bloody gorgeous.

Yeah...It does..But this image looks way better than the in-game one !



Salute !

[jspec01]

Has anyone else's ignore list been growing lately?

[Richie]

I trust these guys and I know there's no way they would put out a piece of crap. Ilya wouldn't be on here answering all of these questions like he is spending, more time than ever being as honest and forthright as possible. What more do people want? What isn't included will be added later in patches.

[minvid]

Originally Posted by Hypernova

Luthier, I can't believe what I hear. I feel frankly cheated.

I was right two or three years ago or so when I said on a forum to Oleg that he was being pulled by the "perfection syndrom" regarding the modeling of planes, trucks, tanks etc... But we are not paying for a bunch of technical drawings to build planes, tanks and trucks. We pay for an immersive simulation of certain historical events, that includes, airplanes, pilots, but also tanks, trucks ground objects, artillery, infantry, environment, weather, sounds etc. etc. etc. It is the combination of all this that makes it a big hit, a killer game. There must be an equilibrium between all the actors in the game.
I am not interested in flying one airplane that has been modeled to each bolt, nut and screw, each cable, wire etc.. It has to be visually excellent but there is a limit. I do not care if when hit the airplane explodes in a perfect physical dynamics way with the excact perfect structure and parts damage. Some approximation is perfectly enough. But I care to have all the other things that makes me feeling that I fly in a living dynamic environment.

Shoestring budget. Sorry but this not acceptable. Oleg said five years ago that your ambition was to build the best of the best and other than perfection was not an option. I commented at that time that the budget for such an ambition was a team of 10-15 people and 5-10 or more millions of dollars at minimum. But if you knew you had no budget for such ambition, then I feel cheated to have waited so long.
And five years later you cannot even afford to do sound recording. Or model the various categories of people that should populate and animate your flight sim. You will just dump people in the trucks!!! Com-on!

Luthier, five years of developments. That is enormous, I have the feeling you were alone, the whole team. And I have the feeling that there were many other products developed and financiall probably more interesting and this COD has been kind of sidework. It could have lasted 10 years. Realistic (and not arcade) flight simulation is a niche market in gaming (It is not the market of World of Warcraft, or GTR and similar games, completely uninteresting for me) and I understand that it is not justified to do a large investment for it. But this you should have said. Keeping us with extremely high expectations over such a long period is a terrible risk. A risk that we will feel very very disappointed. It will not become a killer flight simulator but a killed one.

Il2 Sturmovik / Pacific Fighters was a killer flight simulator with all patches and improvements had an incredible long life on my machine, about six years. Why? because it was an incredible surprise, of unexpected quality, playability and immersivity.
I am now afraid that due to extremely high expectations COD will be exactly the opposite.
A year ago it was a sure buy. Now I will wait and buy only according to what will be the experience that will be communicated buy the first fliers.

As Luthier said:

Originally Posted by luthier

Most developers stay completely shut in from the world up until a few months from release. We choose to interact with the community throughout the process because we feel that you are mature enough to understand the concepts of "work in progress" and "subject to change".

So I'm not sure how to react when people latch on to something said 5(!) years ago while ignoring everything that's been said over the past year and a half. I guess we brought this onto ourselves.

Someone who enjoyed Il-2 for many years should be very exited and curious for the new Sim. It will be an awesome start into the future of WWII air combat simulation. We should trust that Oleg´s Team will do the best possible - and improvents will be released time after time.

It is quite unfair to judge ClofDo () without haven´t it played a single time.

So, such massive complaints are really strange. It is obvious, that the update threads like theese not only attract the fans of IL-2, but also the competitors and rivals of Maddox´ games, maybe trying to spoil our fun.

So, we should not be irritated

[Ravenous]

Originally Posted by Hypernova

Luthier, I can't believe what I hear. I feel frankly cheated.

I was right two or three years ago or so when I said on a forum to Oleg that he was being pulled by the "perfection syndrom" regarding the modeling of planes, trucks, tanks etc... But we are not paying for a bunch of technical drawings to build planes, tanks and trucks. We pay for an immersive simulation of certain historical events, that includes, airplanes, pilots, but also tanks, trucks ground objects, artillery, infantry, environment, weather, sounds etc. etc. etc. It is the combination of all this that makes it a big hit, a killer game. There must be an equilibrium between all the actors in the game.
I am not interested in flying one airplane that has been modeled to each bolt, nut and screw, each cable, wire etc.. It has to be visually excellent but there is a limit. I do not care if when hit the airplane explodes in a perfect physical dynamics way with the excact perfect structure and parts damage. Some approximation is perfectly enough. But I care to have all the other things that makes me feeling that I fly in a living dynamic environment.

Shoestring budget. Sorry but this not acceptable. Oleg said five years ago that your ambition was to build the best of the best and other than perfection was not an option. I commented at that time that the budget for such an ambition was a team of 10-15 people and 5-10 or more millions of dollars at minimum. But if you knew you had no budget for such ambition, then I feel cheated to have waited so long.
And five years later you cannot even afford to do sound recording. Or model the various categories of people that should populate and animate your flight sim. You will just dump people in the trucks!!! Com-on!

Luthier, five years of developments. That is enormous, I have the feeling you were alone, the whole team. And I have the feeling that there were many other products developed and financiall probably more interesting and this COD has been kind of sidework. It could have lasted 10 years. Realistic (and not arcade) flight simulation is a niche market in gaming (It is not the market of World of Warcraft, or GTR and similar games, completely uninteresting for me) and I understand that it is not justified to do a large investment for it. But this you should have said. Keeping us with extremely high expectations over such a long period is a terrible risk. A risk that we will feel very very disappointed. It will not become a killer flight simulator but a killed one.

Il2 Sturmovik / Pacific Fighters was a killer flight simulator with all patches and improvements had an incredible long life on my machine, about six years. Why? because it was an incredible surprise, of unexpected quality, playability and immersivity.
I am now afraid that due to extremely high expectations COD will be exactly the opposite.
A year ago it was a sure buy. Now I will wait and buy only according to what will be the experience that will be communicated buy the first fliers.

Uhm, I'm not going to tell you what to feel or anything, but i want you to consider what you are saying here: you are telling him that you are "very very dissapointed" with CoD because they could'nt afford to send about a truckload of equipment from Moscow to Britain to record a real Merlin and Daimler-Benz engine, and that vehicle crew slipped their mind for the time being... You are infact so dissapointed by this that you don't want to buy CoD unless someone you trust says it's a killer sim...

The way I see this is: OK, they don't have a real Merlin/DB engine, BUT they recorded real engines of other planes and engineered the sound to be a stand-in for them. As far as i know, that seems to be the only way they could get their hands on the engine sounds of, say a Zero..or even a M163 Comet etc. etc.

So to me this is just as good as the real thing when you realize that they aren't just half-assing this by slapping the sounds of a lawnmower in there and then call it a Tiger Moth.. they have professional equipment and i'd assume that since they could have recorded the real thing if they had access, their sound engineer is most likely a professional too.

Besides, Luthier already said that the sound feels right, and I'll take his word for it.. You've been waiting for 5+ years? I would have assumed that you have seen these people's passion for what they do, so i would have thought that you could take his word too untill you could judge it for youself..Or do you consider 50-ish dollars or whatever your currency is, to be waaaay too much to pay for something that is supposed to be the successor of IL2 in every way when it gets off the ground?

And regarding Luthier's choice of words that you freaked out about...

would you please relax for a second, take a breath, and then try to think about the quality of the rest of the sim...They aren't LITERALLY going to just dump somebody into the driver's seats of the vehicles just to put something in'em..

and even if they weren't too good-looking...what do you care?? You're supposed to be zipping by at alittle more than 1m altitude AND you're going to be going alittle faster than walking-pace...atleast I choose to believe that you're supposed to be engaging COMBAT while in FLIGHT in this SIMulator..

I'll be using a ram on the door of my local gamestop if they aren't open at the very second they're supposed to

Can't wait to get the new incarnation of WW2 CFS's, and to actually take part in the "childhood" of it

sorry, if this somehow offends you, that was not the point of this, I simply got fed up with all the panic about the green, and the small pilots..and the wrong eye-color in the reflection of the pilot in instrument-glass in the cockpit..and tracers that look like starwars (which btw was made to look like WW2 AIRCOMBAT IN THE FIRST PLACE!!!) and all the other nitpicking people have had the spare time to bother the lead developers with in the updates..

*sigh* I guess what I'm trying to say is that I wish people would take the history of every game into account when thinking about CoD too..They almost without exception get patches and fixes to correct anything wrong with it, and in IL2's case it was also ADDED to the content by the patches

[Kikuchiyo]

Originally Posted by Hypernova

Crazy talk about lack of people in vehicles being a complete deal breaker. Long winded rant, etc.

Just because there aren't INITIALLY going to be people manning every piece of equipment you now believe the whole thing is going to be a huge bust? It will get in there as long as we support them (buy this epic product). I would much rather have the highly detailed aircraft in a FLIGHT SIMULATOR. Than see a dude in a truck for 1/10th of 1 millisecond. Some of you seem to have gotten lost in the weeds, and forgot about the field. I know I come off as a white knight, but honestly some of the nitpicking, especially on things that the devs have said they will patch it in, is absurd.

Regarding the whole "dot" issue a few pages back I have a terrific solution that will require little effort on the devs parts. DON'T PLAY WITH PEOPLE THAT YOU THINK ARE BASICALLY CHEATING.

Yes, I am disappointed that there won't be people in every vehicle at launch. I do find it irksome to fly against people that are more worried about their kill death ratio or points than enjoying the spirit of the game. No initial dynamic weather hurts (that runs reasonably). I will miss dynamic campaigns, but none of that is tantamount to what all the included features will bring to the table.

Thank you Luthier for giving up part of your weekend to reveal some really cool stuff to us.