I Want my 4.09 Spit FM's back.........

[Kwiatek]

Originally Posted by K_Freddie

What I read/heard is that the slats never caused a stall, but allied BoB pilots thought it did, as in tight turns the me109 will roll out.

The actual reality was that the slats came out with such a 'bang' (force) and inexperienced pilots thought they were being shot at and hit, so rolled out of the turn. Experienced pilots had no such problems. The slats did cause a momentary loss of aim.

Wings with slats stall too. Look at 109 slats. They not cover all leading edge of wing but mostly airleon area. So it mean that your wing root could be actualy in stall but wingtips still have lift and you aircraft is controlalble. You push stick more and your wing tips would stall also. Slats in 109 cause much more control in stall depart and very good stall symptoms but still if you push it more you will stall your plane. It would help a lot but not elimante stall completly.

In Spits other hand there was wingtips washout which also allow higher angle of attack in wingtips and when your wing roots were in stall your wing tips and airleons were not and your plane was still controlable until you push it more. Spit had also good symptoms of incoming stall.

Of course slats give 109 more gentle stall but other hand casue some more other problems with not symetrical opening slots in both wings ( in slip or slide).

[Seeker]

Originally Posted by jameson

BBC documentary:
Spitfire! Two seconds to kill
http://www.bbc.co.uk/archive/battleo...in/11405.shtml

Bob Stanford Tuck and Douglas Bader discussing more or less what this thread is about. From 25 mins on, pertinent remarks regarding Merlin's neg G fuel Starvation and Miss Shillings orifice by Sir Stanley Hooker of Rolls Royce.

Please post a reply to say whether it's possible to watch this if you are outside UK, thanks.

Not from Denmark

[Ra'Kaan]

I love this thread! I have read the entire thing!

I apologize for not having anything to contribute on the subject, however, I wanted to post my appreciation for all the thought, dedication and hard work that goes into the mechanics of each and every plane in the IL-2 series.

This thread demostrates the fact that we all here respect the men and women who flew these amazing machines our desire to recreate as close as possible the conditions these people encountered in various circumstances.

I have worked in the aircraft manufacturing industry so many of the things discussed here intrigue me on a mechanical level.

Thank you posters for a fascinating discussion!

[K_Freddie]

I know....

[Corto]

Originally Posted by Blackdog_kt

I don't remember if it's in this very thread, but i sat through the entire BBC documentary about the battle of Britain that someone linked on youtube and at one point a surviving RAF veteran (i think it was Tom Neil) talks about the advantages and disadvantages of Spit vs 109.

Here is the BBC Doc:
For the Spit enthusiasts: Part 4 is the part were they talk about the advantages and disadvantages of Spit vs 109...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDDeLRy7UM0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5D49...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4IHLZ...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8FsR...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MW0i...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIcWx...eature=related

[i]A fresh analysis into the Battle of Britain, exploring the German point of view, and highlighting the role of those who supported the Few during the summer of 1940.
Focusing on the tactics, technologies and intelligence available to both sides, Mr. Holland examines the ways in which both Germany and Britain used their resources: from aircraft to air defence, and from intelligence to organisation. And, by gaining rare firsthand testimony from German veterans, and access to the untapped diaries and documents we reveal that this was a battle of two sides and many layers.[/]

-------------------------
Spit vs Me 109 Part 4 from Min. 3 sec 20....

Spit 14.7 sec of fire Pee Shooter Ammo vs Me 109 55 sec of fire.. nearly 4 times as long!

If this and other facts are modeld in Olegs "realistic Simulation" "Cliffs of Dover".... no one will fly spit.....
---

[JG4_Helofly]

Why will no one fly spitfire? From what I read, the spit and the 109 are so close in performance, that the pilot will be the decisive factor. And firepower is worthless if you can't get behind the ennemy.

Btw. I am saying that as a pure blue flyer, so no bias for the spit from me.

[Corto]

Originally Posted by JG4_Helofly

From what I read, the spit and the 109 are so close in performance...

pls hear !!! the pilots from both !!! sides in part 4 of BBC Doc....
they are not so close in performance....

IL2 are balanced... and COD will be the same.....

[JG4_Helofly]

Originally Posted by Corto

pls hear !!! the pilots from both !!! sides in part 4 of BBC Doc....
they are not so close in performance....

IL2 are balanced... and COD will be the same.....

Well, never trust only one source. And If the 109 faces a spit with higher boost pressure (100 octan fuel) which were common in the BOB, then the speed advantage is for the spit at most altitudes.

[Corto]

Originally Posted by JG4_Helofly

Well, never trust only one source.

in this doc different pilots (plural!!!) talk... about advantages and disadvantages of Spit vs 109.
And yes to: never trust only one source.... but if i see such sources (pilots, facts).... I beginn to trust....

but anyway.... dont feed....

[csThor]

Sorry, Corto, but ... Never take interviews conducted 50 or 60 years after the event as gospel. Take them as a facet of what happened, but we're all humans and therefor fallible. Do you still remember every little tidbit you experienced two or three years ago?