second sino-japanese war 1937-1940

[IceFire]

Originally Posted by Wutz

Hmm odd, but then politics has little to do with logic.
On the other hand chinese skins have been around for years, never really heard anything....is China so influencial in the sim market that they could have an impact in any way?
Good Chinese - Japanese squabbels are nothing new, and if China had its way
I guess no sim would also have any WWII Japanese aircraft flying at all. Let alone chinese nationalist planes.

The topic is very interesting and it would be a bummer if politicians can just so block for the rest of the world something like that.

That'd be Chinese "Communism" (it really isn't... but that's beside the point) for you. They get overly sensitive on these kinds of things surrounding their revolution. Japanese aircraft in the product isn't on the same level.

IL-2 apparently is sold in China so probably what would get them going is if there was a more significant Chinese Nationalist presence in the game. Having the Flying Tigers in there is still a US presence and I guess that lets that go under the radar.

Third party campaign builders can of course do whatever.

[Wutz]

Originally Posted by IceFire

That'd be Chinese "Communism" (it really isn't... but that's beside the point) for you. They get overly sensitive on these kinds of things surrounding their revolution. Japanese aircraft in the product isn't on the same level.

IL-2 apparently is sold in China so probably what would get them going is if there was a more significant Chinese Nationalist presence in the game. Having the Flying Tigers in there is still a US presence and I guess that lets that go under the radar.

Third party campaign builders can of course do whatever.

Hmm o.k. guess then the way would be since most Chinese planes used during that time where either Russian, German, US or from another western country, there is no real possibilty of blocking that, same then for the Japanese aircraft. I wonder if they would make a fuss if a map turned up with their part of the world on it.
Most likely you are right then it would have to be a third party add on....I just hope that politics do not scare off any who might be thinking of covering this topic. It would be a shame if it fell due to politics under the table.

[OrangeYoshi]

Originally Posted by Wutz

I wonder if they would make a fuss if a map turned up with their part of the world on it.

China has banned the sale of the Hearts of Iron series because it doesn't depict China as a single entity, so that would be a yes if you want a historically accurate scenario.

[baronWastelan]

Originally Posted by IceFire

That'd be Chinese "Communism" (it really isn't... but that's beside the point) for you. They get overly sensitive on these kinds of things surrounding their revolution. Japanese aircraft in the product isn't on the same level.

IL-2 apparently is sold in China so probably what would get them going is if there was a more significant Chinese Nationalist presence in the game. Having the Flying Tigers in there is still a US presence and I guess that lets that go under the radar.

Third party campaign builders can of course do whatever.

Based on the Chinese TV programs I've seen in the past couple of years, I'm not at all convinced that this political angle exists today. I can say that there seems to be almost no interest in the ChiCom revolution in Chinese pop culture. Sadly, I honestly believe there would be much more official disapproval of a positive depiction of the AVG pilots.

[wannabetheace]

Hey guys this is very good campaign indeed.
Don't forget the battle over Hkalkhin-Gol 1939 (Nomonkhan for Imperialist Japan)

These battles took the biggest air battle in single day about 250 fighters and bombers from Soviet and 170 fighters and bombers from Japs took part in one day air battle. Also massive tank battle was orchestrated by Soviet legendary general Georgy Zhukov Sorry for bad spelling

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battles_of_Khalkhin_Gol

i believe that will be great fly Hawk III and i153 against mistubishi A5M and Nakajima A4N1
i would like so much a map in the china coast, not in the interior of the country. i want the aircraftcarrier whit old monoplanes and biplanes.

[Blackdog_kt]

I'm mostly a Fw190 driver and fan, but sure, count me in. If i was to make a simplistic analogy, i'd say that simulated fights in these planes would be like having a hot-rod version of WWI biplanes and that makes it fun and appealing to me.

As for possible objections from China, i think the issue rests on how easy it is for a disagreeing party to take legal action against you. It's just like the Grumman vs Maddox Games situation:

If you are a company releasing a commercial product, they can threaten with lawsuits and force you to settle or accept their terms out of fear of legal expenses, or take legal action to have your game banned in their country and cost you sales.

If you are a bunch of non-commercial 3rd party modellers however, they can't individually sue you for exercising basic freedoms in your state even if they tracked you down (at least not without causing a diplomatic incident with your government and giving free public image ammunition to their rival governments in the process, ie not worth the trouble). The most that would happen is they would block the download of your content in their country, but that wouldn't cost you anything as it would be free anyway. If anything, it would save you money in the form of reduced bandwidth/hosting costs not having 1.2 billions of people as potential downloaders of your community add-on

Hence, if it's done by people that can't be blackmailed or have their arm twisted by a combination of legal and economic means, there's nothing they or anyone else can do.

[proton45]

For me...part of the fun is flying and fighting over a convincing map. This theater of battle could be made better by a really good China map (and the much needed improvements in the SoW engine)...(flooded) rice patty's, the proper architecture, tree's and everything else could really make you feel like you where "their".

Down and dirty fighting...aeroplanes that are poorly maintained, dirt runways. The planes set is diverse and with the introduction of the A6M (if properly done), the initial advantages of this fighter should be useful...

[IceFire]

Originally Posted by baronWastelan

Based on the Chinese TV programs I've seen in the past couple of years, I'm not at all convinced that this political angle exists today. I can say that there seems to be almost no interest in the ChiCom revolution in Chinese pop culture. Sadly, I honestly believe there would be much more official disapproval of a positive depiction of the AVG pilots.

Actually that is what I'm trying to say. By sensitive I mean... essentially no depictions at all. Totally different world view on that period in history. North American and European pop culture, on the other hand, are almost obsessed with one piece or another of the 1940s.

[ElAurens]

I've made a DF map using a mod pack, and have many of the aircraft needed already in it.

What is missing however are the Curtiss Hawk III and fixed gear Hawk 75 H and M, and some of the rarer bombers for both sides. And the Kawasaki Ki-10 biplane fighter for the IJAAF.

It is very fun to fly these old aircraft types against one another.

This is also a fascinating prelude to the wider Pacific war, and one that the US and Commonwealth countries paid too little attention to.