Friday 2010-09-03 Dev. update and Discussions

[watts]

I'll have to get a new computer to play this, but god do I look forward to it.

[airmalik]

[Flanker35M]

S!

Airmalik..that pic! TOUCHÉ!!!

[Blackdog_kt]

Originally Posted by AdMan

lets use a time tested unit of measurement for the human body, which is the head and use perspective:


as you see there is a total of about 1 head of space from front and back of canopy edge, while barely a chin from top of head to canopy.

again:

^now you will notice in this photo (original full size too, ALL the pilots are slightly hunched over - not exactly sure what puts them in this position, chute, seat position, but it also seems their heads are hunched over a bit too , maybe for optimal view of panel/sight. Still you see there is only about a quarter head in front and a head and a half in the rear, the top of the canopy looks like it would nearly graze the helmet

now look at the screenies:

2 1/2 heads front to back, 3/4 of a head to canopy top.

Yes helmets aren't swimcaps but the aren't so big the enlarge the pilots head by double or more

That's a much better base unit of comparison, but the execution is inaccurate without having photos that show the aircraft from the exact same angle.

All of the comparisons done thus far have failed to account for view angle (or aspect angle if we want to put it in aviation terms).

The fact is that unless we view all the Hurricanes in the photos from the same angle (for example, with us sitting 90 degrees to the left of the plane), comparisons will be inaccurate because of the different angles skewing perspective.

For example, let's say we have a Hurricane with a non-moving pilot dummy in the cockpit. If i view the plane from 7 o'clock, the distance between the pilot's head and the windshield will appear bigger than the distance between the pilot's head and the headrest, but if i view it from 10 o'clock it will be the other way around. Add difference of perception due to distance and the fact that we totally discount the 3rd axis in this example and it's obvious we can't make an accurate comparison.

In your comparison, the real-life black Hurricane is viewed from 10 o'clock low, while the SoW Hurricane in the pictures is viewed from 8 o'clock level. So, even with a perfectly scaled pilot the SoW screenshot would exhibit more distance between pilot's head and windshield than the photo of the real one, simply due to perspective (part of the reason you measured 2,5 heads worth of space). Differences in perspective can be explained with trigonometry and such calculations have played a big part in observational astronomy before computers, when people had to measure the real dimensions of objects that are million of miles away based only on the characteristics of the telescopes and the angular data of the viewing. I'm not in the mood to bust out the crayons and start drawing in MSpaint, but a quick google search on stuff like parallax angles and apparent/angular distances will explain a lot.

I agree that in some screenshots the pilots in the fighters look somewhat small and this week's Hurricane is among them. What i can't explain is why the same pilots appear fine in bombers, or even in fighters shown in previous updates. Up till now, it seems that nobody else can explain this either, otherwise someone would have answered this question. Until someone can prove that different pilot models have been used in different screenshots, i'll just chalk it up to being used to the IL-2 oversized pilots and needing some time to get accustomed to the new ones.

In any case, your idea of using the head as a unit of measurement is solid. What would lay the debate to rest and give a positive verdict is if we could take a real photo and replicate its viewing angle and distance in SoW, then accurate comparisons could be made. However, this demands the use of an object viewer or track recording/playback, which i guess wont be available until the release of the simulator.

[McHilt]

[QUOTE=airmalik;179432]I hope Oleg's getting a chuckle out of this thread.

Here's my contribution:



You can tell just by eyeballing that the pilot's head is a bit small but on the other hand: what could ever make me think Oleg and crew can't figure the right proportions... they of course use decent reference materials as templates. Weird issue here.

Anyway, they'll get it right, I'm sure.

Have a nice day all


Real good contribution btw airmalik, it makes perfect sense

[Jumo211]

Excellent topic ! also a lot of fun going on because that's about all we have right now

@ Skoshi Tiger

here is what I meant by initial outburst footage with aircraft going all the way to the ground ( or water in this case ) .
These two aircrafts are about the biggest black thick outburst I have seen from tons of WWII archive footage ,
it's rare to find as there is not much of such outburst recorded by gun cameras or by the cameraman on the ground .
These are pretty violent blasts but then again each thick smoke is running out in few seconds .

Here beginning @ 3:24

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9txeXJE0zL0

[lbuchele]

[QUOTE=McHilt;179444]

Originally Posted by airmalik

I hope Oleg's getting a chuckle out of this thread.

Here's my contribution:



You can tell just by eyeballing that the pilot's head is a bit small but on the other hand: what could ever make me think Oleg and crew can't figure the right proportions... they of course use decent reference materials as templates. Weird issue here.

Anyway, they'll get it right, I'm sure.

Have a nice day all
That pilot was made prisioner by some shrinking head african tribe,that's a possible explanation.
Makes perfect sense to me.


Real good contribution btw airmalik, it makes perfect sense

[Bloblast]

[QUOTE=airmalik;179432]I hope Oleg's getting a chuckle out of this thread.

Here's my contribution:


Head too small and canopy too big. I already concluded that.

[McHilt]

"..... That pilot was made prisioner by some shrinking head african tribe,that's a possible explanation......."


That wasn't me

[Space Communist]

Ok this is getting ridiculous. Clearly they are going to have to exhume the bones of the pilot of L1833, remodel his head with plasticene, then place him in a reconstructed Hurricane and do a full 3d scan.

Seriously guys this is such a pointless debate. I am confident that it is to scale, but even if it wasn't you'd have to be Rainman to see it in flight.