the best dogfighting this generation?

[Lexandro]

I hate to do this but I have to point out that people that game on PCs tend to have systems that far exceed what would be considered "mainstream" a year or two ago. Quad cores have been on the market for some time now, AMD and Intel both have 2nd generation quad core processors on the market. These far exceed the 360 processor capabilites.

In graphics alone, the consoles cant hold a candle to a modern gaming PC. I have the same games for both 360 and PC and while the 360 version will struggle to play above 30fps on my screen, the PC version on my rig will do double that fps. Gears of War/HAWX/Mass Effect all play at much higher resolutions than the upscaled 720p of the 360 and at much better frame rates.

Nvidia themselves stated many months ago they had exceeded the RSX's graphics ability with a "mainstream" desktop card. Other developers have already stated that many PC games simply cant be done for consoles are they are not powerfull enough. Crytek the most vocal of this with its cryengine2. So much so they are making a new engine just for consoles, that is a "lite" version of CE2.


EDIT* Controler wise, a pad does not have the same finese of movement that a flight stick has. Also many flight sticks feature multiples of buttons even on cheaper units. A cheap 50 buck joystick will have a hat switch, throttle control, rudder control, and usually around 10 buttons all of which are much more capable than a joypad. A pad is good but a good stick is far far better.

Also they are not "next gen" anymore, its this generation.

[TexRoadkill]

I bought this game because of the Realistic and Sim modes. I've tried the demos for all the 360 flight games and this is the first one I had to buy. I'm glad there aren't a lot of complicated controls to deal with. That always turned me off in PC flight sims. I think it's possible to have a 'sim experience' without having to duplicate every single input that a real pilot would have to provide. To me the sim experience is more about allowing you to deal with the realistic challenges of flight and air combat without having to memorize a bunch of different key combos to deal with engine managment and seat warmers.

I seem to have a a lot of trouble finding my adversaries in MP dogfights on sim though. But since they seem to have no problem finding me I'm going to assume that's my fault and not the game.

[loopdreams]

This is true now although I'm not sure that it always will be. Gone are the days when the incentive to get a quick PC was that you could play games that were a whole quantum leap away from what you got on the consoles. Nowadays a lot of PC games are pretty shonky afterthoughts but with slightly shinier graphics. I tend to play PC games every few years when I need a new PC anyway so I have a few years worth of titles to catch up on. But this last time I was really quite taken aback by just how little I'd been missing out on.

[Anton Yudintsev]

Originally Posted by Lexandro

I hate to do this but I have to point out that people that game on PCs tend to have systems that far exceed what would be considered "mainstream" a year or two ago. Quad cores have been on the market for some time now, AMD and Intel both have 2nd generation quad core processors on the market. These far exceed the 360 processor capabilites.

Nope
Check here: http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/
Those are people, who actually game.
And, Operating system is also occupying some resources.

No need to argue - I believe you, that you and you friends have only Quad Cores at home, with superb videocards.
But that's not mainstream. And you need to rely on mainstream to make sales.

That won't be a problem in a year, I am sure.
But right now - current-gen(OK) consoles are still better in computing and about equal in video capabilities.

But on consoles, however, you have a fixed and defined architecture and hardware, and can make application much more optimal with much less time (and money). So, in a next year or even two the best optimized games (for broad audience) will appear on consoles.

Than (next year) we'll get the new cycle in the infinite spiral 'consoles vs. PC', and PC versions of the game would be always better on a target hardware, and than there will be new generation.

Of course, right now modern PCs are doing better.

[King Jareth]

I love sims but I cant play sim games on my PC. Its just not good enough and I cant justify the expense of upgrading just for that especially when I have a 360 sitting 7 feet away.
So I take what I can get.

I got RacePro as soon as it came out and play it as Sim as I can and now I play IL2 online on Sim mode.
No neither are as 'sim' as their PC counterparts and I do get highly jealous of the PC modding communities (which is the major difference between the 2 formats IMO) but for me its a lot of fun with little hastle and I love it.

I suppose you could call me a casual simmer or sim lite gamer.

[Lexandro]

Anton, the steam survey is nowhere near an accurate representation of the average gaming system. Ive had steam for about 5 years and still have never done the survey as have many others on Steam. Also not everyone who games actually has Steam. I know of a several people who simply refuse to use it due to previous issues with the system.

In short its not accurate, and if thats what you are basing your projected sales on, I honestly suggest you invest in some market research by an approved agent for any future developement.

And as for your comment on my rig. I have 2 PC's, this one is in the living room and has an AMD X2 CPU 2gb Ram and an HD 3870, while my main rig has a Phenom2, 4gb ram and a single 4870. I was going to go crossfire but decided against it in favour of buying a 360. Its currently needing a new OS install as I just replaced a defective HDD (damn you Hitachi!), and im waiting on my Win7 pre-order coming. And I regularly chat with people who have much more powerfull systems than me, plus they have several systems which they use to fold with.

And in graphics, iirc the exact statement by Nvidia was "We now have a card that makes the PS3's RSX obsolete", and that was oh about a year ago now.

EDIT* Oh yeah and take a look at GTAIV for the PC. It FAR exceeds what you term "mainstream" in its system requirements and it has still sold well on the PC.

[mondo]

I think its probably worth pointing out that this is the FIRST console flight simulator.

HAWX, ace combat etc are not simulators by any stretch of the imagination.

They have about as much in common with simulators as Katamari has to real life.

[Anton Yudintsev]

Originally Posted by Lexandro

Anton, the steam survey is nowhere near an accurate representation of the average gaming system. Ive had steam for about 5 years and still have never done the survey as have many others on Steam. Also not everyone who games actually has Steam. I know of a several people who simply refuse to use it due to previous issues with the system.

In short its not accurate, and if thats what you are basing your projected sales on, I honestly suggest you invest in some market research by an approved agent for any future developement.

I assume as you have better publicly (or even privately) available survey?
If not, than do not assume there is one

EDIT* Oh yeah and take a look at GTAIV for the PC. It FAR exceeds what you term "mainstream" in its system requirements and it has still sold well on the PC.

Not even close to consoles.

[dazz1971]

i dont care either way THIS GAME ROCKS !!! and im having so much fun playing it each to there own i guess ive had ace combat6 hawx and they are nothing compared to this game ive been waiting so long for a game like this to come out now i have a great game i can finally get my teeth into and progress with unlike most games i own on xbox that once you complete them there is nothing to draw you back to and they all end up gathering dust on my shelf
ive been playing this game nonstop since i got it and that is something rare to me with console game

oh and i have a powerfull pc setup so could easy play latest games on it but to be honest i cant be arsed with all the installing and then downloading and updating withe the latest patch just to play a game some games ive got for pc ive had to sit there fannying around with patches etc for 2-3 hours just to have a quick go not fun imho!!

[aceofdaves]

Originally Posted by Lexandro

Sure cockpits are nice and all but theres no zoom in on instruments so they are pratically useless.

I'd agree, I think sim would benefit from having heading displayed on the hud along with alt and speed. The cockpits are nice it's got to be impossible to optimise the cockpit view for both seeing the enemy, where you're going and be aware of your instruments without being able to move the pilots 'eyes'. Perhaps when the altered look-around controls come into effect with the dlc this will be partially addressed.

Originally Posted by Lexandro

I have several close friends with the game and they all agree with me that sim mode just isnt any fun for them, as its far to frustrating. They and I prefer arcade at this point, though we have tried realistic a few times. But the way things are in realistic and having no option to set some things on/off really puts a downer on the fun, which is the whole reason we play the game in the first place.

Its not about personal opinion in the end however. Its about knowing the market and selling titles. I personally think its selling well simply due to the fact that its a damn good game. Its nothing to do with "the challenge", its simply well made, looks fantastic, and most of all is fun.

I'd disagree here. It's all about personal opinion and the fact that both you and Axe99 both like the same game for completely different reasons is testament to how well the devs have understood and catered for the various corners of the market!